I'm trying to like it, someone kick me. (Full Version)

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Elrod -> I'm trying to like it, someone kick me. (6/9/2003 5:50:44 PM)

Good morning everyone. I am a long time Grigsby fan and I still have Carrier Strike on my PC from oh so many years ago. Now here is my delima...

***and let me preface this with the game is rock solid, no crashes after 30 hours of gameplay, easy install and everythign seems to work as designed. SO this is NOT a slam on the game but my prefrences and what I assumed this was going to be. I'm hoping that you guys can read the example below and slap me in the melon and tell me what I am not doing right.***

I stumbled onto Uncommon Valor this weekend and for $19.99 I couldn't say no. What I got was a game that I am unfortunatley disappointed in. I am trying to like it, I really am, but I am disappointed in the lack of the ability to "get my hands dirty" with the background eco or the front line troops. I was looking forward to all the fun and abilities of "Carrier Strike" with the added umph that todays procesors could bring.

I will give you and example of what has me so down. Last night I moved a transport group into Gilli Gilli to invade. I had a plan to send a surface fleet running ahead of the transports with a carrier fleet trailing behind to provide cover and hitting power if we ran into those pesky Americans. Well I sent the surface fleet down to a point 3 hexes SE of GG and wanted it to hold there as a heavy picket force while the invasion took place. Well I couldn't get it to stay there and patrol. Instead every turn it would turn North and try to run for Truk, none of the ships were in need of replenish it just seems they always want to run home.

Well as the invasion was just beginning the surface fleet did it's normal thing and bolted North past my invasion fleet and an AMerican surface group came right through and pounded my invasion fleet. My Carrier Battle group had done the same thing but it was at least still close enough to hit the US ships whacking away the the loaded transports. But without the ability to plan the attack or even tell it to do so all I could do was click on a spot in the Ocean and hope it decided to attack the US fleet. It went down to a position 6 hexes NE of the US fleet and then I get a message that it is running away from the enemy fleet. Never in the real world, would a 5 CV/CVL battle group with 16 escort ships run from an enemy fleet that 80 miles away and consisted of 2 CA's and 5 DD's.

It was very frustrating as I watch the invasion fall paart and the marnies get waisted on the Ocean when I had all of the resources to complete the mission but not the ability to make it happen. The 1 day long turns are way to long IMHO. Anyway I was expecting to be able to control my fleets and their actions and I was expecting more of a WWII Harpoon or Carrier Strike 2 game. I'm not taking it back as the box is accurate and the programs built a solid program, so it's not their fault, but it falls way short of my expectations based on the extremely limited level of unit control, the 1 day long turns, and the inability to assign tasks and patrol areas to fleets.

Thanks: John

P.s. Is there any chance on that level of detail and control being added in the future? I mean we can control the altitude a plane flies at but not the direction or when it flies.



Bradman -> No way (6/9/2003 6:33:35 PM)

This is the best game I have ever played in around 20 years of nerd-like fun. It just takes a bit to get used to.

Try selecting 'patrol/do not retire' on the fleet screen, which’ll stop em running for the hills.

Good luck. :)



Raverdave -> (6/9/2003 6:40:55 PM)

As someone who has a strong Harpoon background, I too struggled with the game for the first week, but the more that I played it, the more that I enjoyed it.......infact I play nothing but and it has been that way since the game came out.

Stick with it for a while longer, and get you hands dirty with some PBEM....maybe with another newbie.



Sonny -> (6/9/2003 6:52:04 PM)

There is lots to discover about the mechanics of the game.

The two things which are the most confusing/tricky are the fleet settings of :

Retirement allowed or Patrol Do Not Retire (which is where you seem to have the problem) and

React to Enemy or Do not React to Enemy (this one has more importance of carrier forces but it also applies to other task forces).

Learn about these and your invasions will come off far better.

If you are looking for the detail of Harpoon (weapons loadouts etc.) then you will of course be disappointed. But as Raver said once you get used to it the excitement will pull you into that "gotta see what will happen next turn" addiction.



Mr.Frag -> (6/9/2003 7:32:58 PM)

Read and re-read and re-read again the 8.x section of the manual which covers the differences between the various task force types and their reaction to the patrol/retire and react/do not react setting.

Failure to understand these 2 key controls will result in pain unending.

I'm sure there is not one of us here who didn't take a while to understand the implications of these.



spruance -> (6/9/2003 8:34:25 PM)

I don't think you should write off the game because of
one messed-up invasion. I mean, if everyone did that
there'd be no players left. And I should know, I've had the game
three weeks and you name a mistake - I've made it (God help
me when I take on a human in PBEM), including transports
turning up for an invasion with no troops on board!

It's worth remembering what the game is: a strategic simulation
where the player takes the role of theatre commander, eg
Ghormley, MacArthur, Yamamoto.

What the game is not, is a simulation of carrier or naval tactics.



Drex -> (6/9/2003 8:35:03 PM)

Perhaps your TF commanders were not rated high enough. Co-ordination among different TFs is probably the most difficult operation to accomplish in UV. Strong leaders are needed to approach the enemy and stick around.



Yamamoto -> (6/9/2003 9:16:54 PM)

Set your surface group to “Patrol/do not retire”, as mentioned earlier in this thread. Also, don’t send them 90 miles south of Gili Gili to cover an invasion there. Assign them to “follow” the invasion task force”. That way they will attempt to engage any surface groups that enter that hex. If you have them sitting in another hex they might miss the enemy surface group. Also, by putting them in the same hex as the transport group you can set one squadron of zeros on LR-CAP and it will cover both groups.

This is an operational game. Carrier Strike, which I also loved, was a very tactical game with 20-minute turns. I think we can all agree that UV would be quite unplayable with 20-minute turns.

Yamamoto



Von Rom -> (6/9/2003 9:27:56 PM)

Elrod:

Here are a few helpful suggestions:

1) If 1 day turns are too long, you can set the turn limits from 1 day to 7 day turns in the options menu.

2) Surface fleets - I have found that if I set my surface fleet to Bombard - Patrol/Do Not Retire - that it will not only bombard the enemy hex (such as Gilli-Gilli), but will remain on station (in the same hex as my invasion transports) and will engage enemy ships that enter that hex.

3) CVs - If you are providing air cover for your invasion TF, remember that your planes may not attack the enemy surface fleet if that enemy TF is set to defend a friendly base (ie it automatically intercepts your ships at its friendly base).

Also, if you want your CV TF to remain on station, set it to Patrol/Do Not retire and simply move your CV TFs one hex each turn (ie move it one hex in a back and forth movement each turn).

As has been mentioned, also place your Carrier fighters on LR-CAP to cover your transports and surface fleet.

It goes without saying to watch out for enemy subs, LBA and CVs.

It's a bit tricky and takes a bit of getting used to, but UV is well worth the effort.

We all went through the same game "pain" as you did. Once you learn the internal logic of the game, it will flow better :)

Cheers!



Elrod -> Oh I'm not giving up (6/9/2003 10:27:20 PM)

Thanks for the replies guys and not to worry, I'm not giving up on the game, I'm way to stubborn for that, and my invasion example was just one of several :).

I think the biggest issue that several people point out is the retire / patrol options. I clicked on the interface screens for the fleets to change their settings and such but didn't play around with it enough I guess to get it right. I'm printing 8.X of the manual now to re-read in hardcopy versus trying to follow it via Adobe.

I'm sure that just getting those few things straightened out will raise the fun and drop the frustration level 100%.


Thanks guys and I will be hunkered over the keyboard until late tonight trying to figure out the mechanics and run the dastardly American swine out of the Pacific.

So anyone up for a PBEM game with an easy target?

Thanks: Buckethead



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