BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (Full Version)

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Hairog -> BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/14/2019 7:08:33 PM)

I've been watching Bill and Hubert's AI's use of air units and I'm impressed. I'd like to explore recreating the Battle of Britain and potential Sea Lion on a division, squadron scale. Each airfield that held a squadron would have it's own hex and the scale would be addressed accordingly.

I need help with a SC3 map of the correct scale covering the area that a 109 could fly a combat mission using drop tanks. From my calculations the attached Google Earth screen shot would do the trick... The map making part of Modding is beyond my patient level.

Can any of you map makers assist with the project?





[image]local://upfiles/751/D70A8966B7B04628A039E4B59F35FBED.jpg[/image]



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/21/2019 12:23:55 AM)

Nobody?!?! Do any of you map makers know how to make this job easier? Any tips and tricks. The manual is pretty much worthless on this subject unless I'm missing something. Has anyone done a tutorial?



SIPRES -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/21/2019 7:03:24 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hairog

Nobody?!?! Do any of you map makers know how to make this job easier? Any tips and tricks. The manual is pretty much worthless on this subject unless I'm missing something. Has anyone done a tutorial?


Hi Harry

I can make an extract of my Napoleonic war map (scale is 20km/hexes)
You will have to add some railroads and do some fine tuning to adapt to your campaign.

In case you want a different scale then you can try "Map Scanner", this is a small utility program (I believe its available on WIE beta forum.
Its not perfect as you will have to clean up coastlines, but its a good starting point for a campaign edit.




Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/21/2019 5:53:13 PM)

Thank you Sipres! I would like to try your extract first and then is that doesn't do the job I'll try the Map Scanner route.

Thanks again and I'm looking forward to receiving your file.

Harry

BTW I tried to download the 20 mile/hex map in SC3 Europe and the link appears to be broken.



SIPRES -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/25/2019 6:40:59 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hairog

Thank you Sipres! I would like to try your extract first and then is that doesn't do the job I'll try the Map Scanner route.

Thanks again and I'm looking forward to receiving your file.

Harry

BTW I tried to download the 20 mile/hex map in SC3 Europe and the link appears to be broken.


Hi Harry, I did update the link so you can crop the desired area for your campaign



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/25/2019 8:21:49 PM)

Hey Sipres, the download only has a cgn file. Is that all we need?



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/27/2019 3:49:06 AM)

Sheesh... Took me two days to figure out how to cut your map down to the correct size Sipres. Looks good, now to work on the airfields etc.

Thank you.

[image]local://upfiles/751/996D85C2287B4F4AB6B7A972D23D540B.jpg[/image]



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/31/2019 12:59:56 AM)

First look using Sipres 20km map cut to size but otherwise no changes. Thanks Sipres!

[image]local://upfiles/751/2255B302D763477191971E4E05B5653F.jpg[/image]



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/31/2019 1:08:18 AM)

For the RAF the numbers represent actual combat ready planes availble according to a number of sources. I have no such information on the Lufwaffle side. In fact I'm finding a dearth of information of the German's OOB and locations etc..

If someone has a source that is free and fast please let me know.

Now for the Luffwaffle



[image]local://upfiles/751/144CEDECB9594494A12ED1210182995E.jpg[/image]



sPzAbt653 -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/31/2019 5:13:48 AM)

http://niehorster.org/500_eto/40-09_sealion.html



Simulacra53 -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/31/2019 9:43:26 AM)

Fascinating, certainly a great subject.

If you are not familiar check this forum, most of the time you'll find the knowledgeable people helpful.
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/

Have collected quite an extensive library on the subject - although I haven't been studying / buying any new material for approx. a decade now.
But I'm always willing to give a Luftwaffe question a shot.



Simulacra53 -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (3/31/2019 9:49:06 AM)

On a critical note, the map scale is going to make this a very cramped affair, especially if you add the actual air, ground and sea units.

Meant constructively - I think you need 2x the scale, at least.
Also depends on your turn time.

Any way, daring to take this project on.



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (4/1/2019 3:55:18 AM)

This mod is for SC3 Europe.


Link to SC3 Europe thread.

Sorry about that.



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (4/1/2019 1:10:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Simulacra53

On a critical note, the map scale is going to make this a very cramped affair, especially if you add the actual air, ground and sea units.

Meant constructively - I think you need 2x the scale, at least.
Also depends on your turn time.

Any way, daring to take this project on.



Good link Simulacra53. I forgot about the Luftwaffe forum.

Yes you are right it will be very crowded which is why I'm just doing BOB air units for now and will have to figure out the land and sea portion later. Even at this scale you have to scroll in order to cover the range of the planes.



steevodeevo -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/2/2019 10:56:07 AM)

How are you getting on Hairog? Really intrigued by this mod, map and scale, as well as the specific campaign of course.



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/3/2019 12:05:06 AM)

The new upgrade has thrown my modding in tizzy. I can't get them to load or when they do, use the right graphics. I'm kind of waiting for a solution. All my work so far has kind of been wasted if I can't get things on track.

Some interesting developments cropped up in the BOB mod. The whole game changes if you give the Luftwafe drop tanks and extend the range of the 109. The RAF would have been in deep trouble.

Another conumdrum is accurate intelligence. In the game the Germans get some pretty accurate reports on damage done but in real life they were totally baffeled by the British and had virtually no idea of the results of the day's raids. I have not discovered a good way of modeling this yet.



ReinerAllen -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/4/2019 7:46:30 PM)

This looks very interesting. So, I guess you next attempt at modding will to mod the Battle of the Bulge. I'm surprised someone hasn't done it already. Anyway, I look forward to you completing this mod.



Hubert Cater -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/4/2019 9:06:02 PM)

Hi Harry,

If I can ask, what issues are you having exactly? Did you take a pre v1.16 mod and convert it using the v1.15 -> v1.16 converter tool? Did the conversion notes in the folder help?

What is the structure of your modded graphics in the subfolder, i.e. which ones are you modding and so on and how are they placed in the custom campaign subfolder?

This will give me a good idea on what to suggest if I see something amiss.

Hubert



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/4/2019 11:47:45 PM)

Hey Hubert, My copies of BOB won't conververt or even open in the converter. It's possible that the last save was in a version before 1.5 but I don't think so.

I've tried to install and older version so I can try and run it and upgrade etc. but I only saved the Beta copies and not the original game downloads I was given for being a tester. So I'm kind of stymied.

I run across a big one just before the upgrade. I've played out the mod a couple of times with both sides reaching zero morale but neither side declares victory or defeat. I was under the impression that when a country reached 0 morale it surrendered. Am I wrong? Is there a check box etc. I'm missing.



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/5/2019 3:08:49 AM)

Breakthrough! I found another file on a thumb-drive I forgot about. It converted, came up in the editor, but not in the game. Finally figured out it was because the scripts needed updating. It now works, so I'm back at it.

I still need an answer regarding the morale. It's the key to making this mod work. It's the only way I can see to have one side or the other win.



BiteNibbleChomp -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/5/2019 9:55:31 AM)

Hi Hairog,

Re Morale, In SC2* there is an entry in the victory conditions scripts with this format (below all the trigger, alignment, date, map position stuff) :

; #NATIONAL_MORALE_TRIGGER= Under what national morale situation will this event occur
; Format: country_id [national_morale_percentage] [above_or_below] (above_or_below values range [0, 1]; Above=1; Below=0)

If you wanted to have a victory condition where say UK (Nation ID =1) had <10% morale, you would enter that as:
#NATIONAL_MORALE_TRIGGER= 1 [10] [0]
(where the 1 represents UK, 0 represents "below 10%")

Just by looking through the files in WWI and my experience with the Civil War mod, it appears most NM-based surrenders are tied to a dummy decision event (basically a forced AI "yes" given under a certain condition), and activated by a Surrender 2 event with the "dummy=yes" condition. If you wanted to force a full surrender I could explain this further but it probably isn't necessary in your mod's case - all that would happen is the map would change colour and then the victory screen (and for battle of Britain, it isn't like the UK is being invaded anyway!).

*Note I haven't spent much time with SC3's editor (prefer the old game personally), so something might have changed in the new release. Unfortunately my time spent in SC2's editor won't be much help in that case.

Good luck!

- BNC



BillRunacre -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (6/6/2019 3:56:01 PM)

BNC is right, that is the way to create victory conditions triggered by National Morale falling below a certain point.



Hairog -> RE: BOB / Sea Lion on a Division/squadron scale (9/2/2019 11:59:47 PM)

I did it by the way. The Beta is on the SC3 War in Europe Mods HERE. Using the moral works quite well. HERE



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