Target Distribution Issues (Full Version)

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Command: Modern Operations series >> Tech Support



Message


TwarVG -> Target Distribution Issues (4/3/2019 5:45:20 PM)

I was wondering if there was a way, through the strike planner, to have targets be dropped from the target list once they've been attacked with a predetermined number of munitions or something similar? For me personally, it's the biggest barrier between myself and actually using the strike planner.

For a bit of context, I'm playing the 'Hit Hard, Hit Fast' scenario in the Shifting Sands campaign and the only reasonable way I can see myself carrying out the necessary number of strikes in such a short time span is to use a large number of land strike missions. In 1500 hours of playing I don't think I've ever successfully used the strike planner. It requires more micro than manually plotting strikes for generally poorer results, such as aircraft not flying at the correct altitude for their munitions release envelope. But with a scenario of this size, and using entirely unguided munitions, I would love to automate the huge multi-airbase strikes.

Now for hitting targets like tarmac spaces, I've set up the WRA for the necessary munitions, in this case 500kg bombs, to 1 round so that each target will receive 1 bomb. For a target like tarmac space, I don't expect to destroy it, and don't intend to, only to damage it but destroy the aircraft parked upon it. If my aircraft attack their targets simultaneously, this isn't an issue. 4 aircraft, carrying 2 bombs each, attacking 8 spaces, will drop a single bomb on each target, but only if their weapons are released simultaneously. This isn't always possible however due to the locations of the targets and the order in which aircraft are launched for example, and is certainly not something the strike planner automatically handles for you. The main issue is, if they attack in 2 separate waves of 2 aircraft each for example, the second wave will drop their bombs on the same 4 targets as the first because the targets weren't destroyed, only damaged and therefore considered fair game.

So what I was wondering is if there is a way to have a target dropped from the target list once it's WRA conditions, in this case 1 bomb, has been met to ensure that no other aircraft on that mission will target it? Regardless of whether it was hit and damaged, or missed completely. Or perhaps a way to pre-assign certain aircraft to certain targets which they will then attack as per their WRA settings. In this case for example, each aircraft could be assigned 2 specific tarmac spaces each, preferably in close proximity, within a larger parking area strike mission with a WRA of 1 round. Then they will only attack those targets and no others except for self defence against aircraft. Now I know this could all be done manually, but this is the exact sort of scenario that I feel the strike planner was made for, and I don't really have that much time or patience to micro well over 100 aircraft multiple times in such a short space of time for something the strike planner could theoretically handle on its own.

If a target distribution system isn't present or planned, I'd like to highly recommend one. I would definitely use the strike planner a lot more if I had greater ability to assign targets in the planning stages or ensure a way of preventing duplicate attacks. Thanks for reading, and my apologies if this is already very easy to set up and I've completely missed it.




TitaniumTrout -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (4/3/2019 6:19:19 PM)

You're looking to set your WRA depending on the platform. Right now all of the units in a flight will try to unload all ordnance on a piece of tarmac. So go in to your WRA's and reduce the ordnance expended according to what you'd like and how many planes you'd like. Then it'll look like this :

[image]https://i.imgur.com/6J5Zii6.gif[/image]

edit : But be aware that if you go to a single rocket expended you might have a jet doing figure 8's of death while he shoots off all 140 rockets or something.




TwarVG -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (4/3/2019 7:39:07 PM)

If all of your aircraft attack simultaneously like that it works out fine. The problem occurs when there's a delay between the strike aircraft, which happens a lot when you're launching dozens of aircraft at once per airbase. Once a bomb is in the air but hasn't hit yet, that particular tarmac space is no longer able to be targeted by the other strike aircraft because its WRA conditions of 1 weapon per salvo have been met, and the other aircraft will pick another from the list, which is exactly what I want. But once the bomb has landed, damaged the tarmac or missed but not destroyed it, that tarmac space becomes available to any subsequent strike aircraft on the same mission who have not dropped their munitions yet because its WRA requirements are no longer being met as there are no bombs in the air and it hasn't been destroyed. What I was hoping for is that once a target has been engaged by the desired amount of weapons per salvo, it will no longer be considered a valid target by subsequent aircraft on the same mission regardless of whether it's damaged, destroyed, or completely unharmed and dropped from the target list.




TitaniumTrout -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (4/4/2019 12:40:43 PM)

Right, I think I see what you mean. Flight Alpha comes in, shoots rockets at a dozen revetments, but as they are just concrete pads, survive. Bravo Flight comes in 2 minutes later and, because the revetments are not wrecked enough, shoot rockets at the exact same revetments. In the below photo I had two flights of A-4's the first attacked, decided two were unworthy of further ordnance, then the next flight dropped ordnance on the same line (minus the two).

[image]https://i.imgur.com/C7ETdwS.png[/image]

You could split up the inbound missions, group 1 strikes a southern pocket of targets, group 2 strikes the northern ones then add spots that your BDA notices as the flights come in. Unfortunately you can't easily tell how damaged a target is from the Mission Planner Target List (Feature Request?) nor can you double click and zoom in to the target. So it would make it difficult when you have a bunch of stuff with the same name (like a revetment).

In a perfect world the asset list in the mission planner would be color coded rather like aircraft damage and maybe an indicator of which thing contains an aircraft or asset. Depending how sophisticated you want to get you could also do this via Lua and triggers but that's another bag of worms.





TwarVG -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (4/4/2019 3:12:15 PM)

Seems that the only real solution at present is more micro, something I was hoping to avoid given the sheer size of the scenario in question and the rapid pace of events. Oh well. Thanks for giving it a look anyway, much appreciated!




Dimitris -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (4/21/2019 1:35:08 PM)

Thanks, logged. We'll see what we can do.




michaelm75au -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (6/13/2019 8:09:41 AM)

Is there a save with the WRA settings on a mission so we can run it as a test??




Dimitris -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (6/14/2019 12:06:50 PM)

Has this been fixed in B1009.31.1 ?




TwarVG -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (6/14/2019 3:26:52 PM)

I just ran a quick test and the target selection logic is exactly the same as it's always been in that targets aren't dropped unless they're either heavily damaged or destroyed. It's not really a bug, it's the way it was designed and it works well when using precision guided munitions or when trying to absolutely destroy a target. But if you're trying to drop cluster munitions on tarmac spaces for example where you'll inflict little damage to the tarmac itself, subsequent aircraft will keep attacking the target at the top of the list until it's heavily damaged or destroyed instead of going after the others. The only way around it is either micromanaging each aircraft onto the right targets, or try and get them to drop their weapons simultaneously which is difficult if you're not using stand off or guided munitions.

Ideally we'd be able to assign each aircraft on to a land strike mission a few targets from the list, where they will only attack only those targets and ignore the others. Either that, or a feature where once a target's weapon release parameters have been met, 1 bomb for example, it get's either removed from the target list or cycled down to the bottom so follow up aircraft on the same mission won't try to bomb the same targets again and will go for others regardless of whether the first aircraft hit or not.




Dimitris -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (6/14/2019 5:34:04 PM)

Why not just remove manually the sufficiently-attacked target from the strike list?




TwarVG -> RE: Target Distribution Issues (6/14/2019 6:07:05 PM)

Because the only time I'd use the strike planner would be for huge simultaneous strikes like in the 'Hit Hard, Hit Fast' scenario where I'm bombing half a dozen air bases, have numerous strike missions per base, with well over 100 aircraft attacking at once all over the area of operations. If I'm gonna have to manually go to the location of each bomb drop and keep pausing/unpausing to check which targets have been attacked and which targets need to be removed from the list to avoid duplicate drops then I may as well just plot the whole thing manually to begin with because that would be easier to micro and yield better results. I understand that by automating missions I should expect poorer results than if I do it manually, but the trade off should be that it'll take a few minutes to set up and require no further attention from me to get basic mission objectives met, like aircraft targeting each of the targets in the list.

The strike planner in its current capacity is definitely much better at handling modern strikes using guided munitions with some stand off range, even if it's just a few miles. But those strikes are so easy to micro that there's no point in using the strike planner and getting possibly worse results. I don't think being able to pre-allocate certain targets to certain aircraft is too far out of the realm of realism for a possible new feature, and it would fix literally every issue I have the system which prevents me, and possibly others, from ever using it.

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to dig up this old thread and check up on things, I really do appreciate the effort everyone puts into this game.





Page: [1]

Valid CSS!




Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI
1.171875