AMC and AMc uses (Full Version)

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ccombsly -> AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 2:52:39 AM)

How are AMC's and AMc's most commonly employed?



Anachro -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 3:02:18 AM)

AMc's are coastal minesweepers. You can use them to make sure strategic locations such as ports, or coastal areas close to key trade routes are devoid of mines. If a target is near enough, they can also act as expendable, cheap minesweepers before landing at the invasion beach. AMC stands for armed merchant cruiser and was in theory a cheap way of producing convoy raiders. In reality, they are pretty poor in this role against a modern (WW2-era navy). I use them in some cases as amphibious invasion vessels, as they usually have decent troop capacity and their armament means they do a decent job suppressing enemy coastal artillery.



Kull -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 3:38:52 AM)

The AMC also provides the "amphibious unload bonus" (see 6.3.3.3.2 on pg 127/128), which is a real benefit since it can unload at 2.4 times the rate of the xAK/xAP classes. The AMC is not listed in the manual as having this, but it was confirmed by a dev (it uses the AK/AP bonus values).



durnedwolf -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 3:55:04 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kull

The AMC also provides the "amphibious unload bonus" (see 6.3.3.3.2 on pg 127/128), which is a real benefit since it can unload at 2.4 times the rate of the xAK/xAP classes. The AMC is not listed in the manual as having this, but it was confirmed by a dev (it uses the AK/AP bonus values).


Hey Kull - do the AMCs for Japan get the Special Japanese early war bonus of 1200 also?



Kull -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 4:02:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: durnedwolf

Hey Kull - do the AMCs for Japan get the Special Japanese early war bonus of 1200 also?


Haven't tested that specifically, but it seems logical that they would.



jdsrae -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 4:11:31 AM)

My AMc are doing well at being hit and sunk by Dutch subs in forward ports.
My AMC are mostly used as amphib flagships or close naval gunfire support, but I did just send some on a raid of the southern Indian Ocean that bagged a few unescorted merchants.



GetAssista -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 4:52:38 AM)

Player AMCs are only good as additional firepower in amphibious forces. AI Ironman AMCs though are hell incarnates[:)]


quote:

ORIGINAL: durnedwolf
Hey Kull - do the AMCs for Japan get the Special Japanese early war bonus of 1200 also?

Every Japanese ship capable of transporting troops gets that




guctony -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 6:52:40 AM)

Also consider AMC for Fast transport options. I think in this role they shine as fast transport is providing decent landing multiplier, Its good for early war fast landing and late war unit extraction from contested bases. Also they can be used for supply run as fast transports intended. I normally group them after first action and use on additional landing or Fast transport tasks.



Sardaukar -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 7:52:46 AM)

AMCs also prevent subs attacking on surface, since they are heavily armed.



btd64 -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 8:42:43 AM)

Also, welcome and good morning. [:D]....GP



Zorch -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 10:03:42 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: btd64

Also, welcome and good morning. [:D]....GP

Illegal cross-thread post - you are penalized 15 posts. Do not pass Go; do not collect 200 dollars.



btd64 -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 12:03:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch


quote:

ORIGINAL: btd64

Also, welcome and good morning. [:D]....GP

Illegal cross-thread post - you are penalized 15 posts. Do not pass Go; do not collect 200 dollars.


Yup, guilty as charged....GP



HansBolter -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 1:31:59 PM)

AMc's should be deployed in every valuable port in a Coastal or Regular Minesweeping TF with a one hex patrol pattern set on the port. This is protection against sub laid mines and will also serve as a catalyst to get you accused of using trash shipping to set CAP traps.



Kull -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 1:43:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

AI Ironman AMCs though are hell incarnates


Sent a force of Dutch light cruisers and DDs to take out a Japanese convoy protected by PBs and a couple AMCs. Sat back waiting for the massacre. It happened....to me [:(]



dr.hal -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 2:10:07 PM)

AMcs are good for local port mine prevention but remember that this craft does NOT search hexes next to its own location like larger minesweepers. It searches only its own location hex. I tried to use Armed Merchant Cruisers as actual surface ships to attack merchant ships and had a VERY difficult time with zero success. Many merchants even early in the war have some form of anti ship armament. This was evident by the action of the SS Stephen Hopkins vs. the German raider Stier were the Hopkins in Sept '42, despite being badly outgunned (having only one 4 in vs the Stier's 6x 5.9 in) managed to sink the German (although she went down with heavy loss of life as well).



RangerJoe -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/16/2020 9:51:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dr.hal

AMcs are good for local port mine prevention but remember that this craft does NOT search hexes next to its own location like larger minesweepers. It searches only its own location hex. I tried to use Armed Merchant Cruisers as actual surface ships to attack merchant ships and had a VERY difficult time with zero success. Many merchants even early in the war have some form of anti ship armament. This was evident by the action of the SS Stephen Hopkins vs. the German raider Stier were the Hopkins in Sept '42, despite being badly outgunned (having only one 4 in vs the Stier's 6x 5.9 in) managed to sink the German (although she went down with heavy loss of life as well).


Well, if you are going to go down then take the enemy with you. Unless you can capture the enemy ship and use that!



Jorge_Stanbury -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/17/2020 12:05:28 AM)

AMCs can have better success with better captains; there are a few Japanese ones with torpedo tubes; with some luck they can sink a surprised merchant before the battle becomes a slugfest (which can sink both ships)

That said, I prefer to use Japanese AMCs for invasions fleets; as they are the equivalent to a AP with much bigger cannons. Allies mostly on convoy escort because few have troop or cargo capacity



Zorch -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/17/2020 12:44:03 AM)

See what happened when 2 Japaneses AMCs took on an oil tanker and its escort.

World War II In the Indian Ocean: Ondina and Bengal versus Aikoku and Hōkoku https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ujZemGqzJo&list=PLSnt4mJGJfGjOqKgHe1_b8pIq-bZewEfA&index=34



Lowpe -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/18/2020 8:10:41 PM)

Hans,

Supposedly minesweepers won't sweep if set to Patrol. This may have been fixed in one of the patches though. I remember testing it years back...but can't remember if it holds for both minesweeping task forces and coastal ms task forces.

I also remember a desire that AMcs' would sweep while disbanded in port much like ACMs' tending mines. I don't think this feature was ever enacted.



Peleliu -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/18/2020 11:41:30 PM)

quote:

Supposedly minesweepers won't sweep if set to Patrol. This may have been fixed in one of the patches though. I remember testing it years back...but can't remember if it holds for both minesweeping task forces and coastal ms task forces


Looks like it was not fixed. I had several TFs on 0 or 1 range patrol spend several turns trying to clear mines to no avail. I took them off patrol, cleared any destinations, made sure home port was the hex they were in, and set them to remain on station. That did the trick - they clear mines with no trouble now.



Scott_USN -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/18/2020 11:50:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dr.hal

AMcs are good for local port mine prevention but remember that this craft does NOT search hexes next to its own location like larger minesweepers. It searches only its own location hex. I tried to use Armed Merchant Cruisers as actual surface ships to attack merchant ships and had a VERY difficult time with zero success. Many merchants even early in the war have some form of anti ship armament. This was evident by the action of the SS Stephen Hopkins vs. the German raider Stier were the Hopkins in Sept '42, despite being badly outgunned (having only one 4 in vs the Stier's 6x 5.9 in) managed to sink the German (although she went down with heavy loss of life as well).



That story reminded me of the old frog and bird picture.

[image]https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Kg-WShUFyrk/V5KTVvcaRtI/AAAAAAAAATo/GDZuKdDVuOcxXOlr8HTECp1EnfrxJj0BwCLcB/s1600/never-give-up-frog.jpg[/image]



Ian R -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/19/2020 1:45:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: GetAssista

Player AMCs are only good as additional firepower in amphibious forces. AI Ironman AMCs though are hell incarnates[:)]



We should ask Andymac who Linda is!



Scott_USN -> RE: AMC and AMc uses (3/19/2020 3:29:49 AM)

SS Stephen Hopkins

https://youtu.be/3JKBKXIMGNE



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