Post Script to "A NEW LOOK AT MATRIX GAMES (Full Version)

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Wild Bill -> Post Script to "A NEW LOOK AT MATRIX GAMES (7/29/2003 11:16:14 AM)

I see we can't add to the post there so let me put it here.

You can't use any characters in a save name that the computer under DOS control used.

The Mega Campaign system was designed using the old DOS system. That is why your save has to be only 8 letters (or numbers) long and no more.

It also can't include slashes, dollar signs, or any of those. Just use letters, dashes and underlines.



rbrunsman -> (7/29/2003 11:54:50 PM)

As long as you're on the subject, are you going to allow "in turn" saves and autosaves at the end of each turn in the new Mega? Prohibiting these was the worst idea in the previous Megas. With crashes and such it makes no sense to block this feature. And, if I want to replay every turn until I play a perfect game, isn't they my business? Why prevent someone from doing this at all? I don't need "Big Brother" preventing me from "cheating" if I want to. It's a solitaire game after all.



Al Boone -> Amen! (7/30/2003 1:02:09 AM)

I agree 100% with the idea of allowing in-turn saves, even if you allow a lock0ut for PBM or other head to head play, but even then allowing end of turn saves. I have always suspected that while there are "workarounds" for this that I have used (eg Control Alt Del), these seem to affect scoring and endplay results. There are just too many distractions which can take place during a long game turn that can seriously disrupt one's attention, to say nothing about simple plain stupid mistakes or erroneous key punches. The perfection should be in the game strategy, not even keypunch ability, phone juggling or memory during doorbell responses.



Wild Bill -> (7/30/2003 1:14:28 AM)

I also agree but I was voted down by the programmer. I would let him defend his reasons to you but I'm not sure how often he visits here anymore.

The alternative I've found that works at least partially is to make a temp directory inside Megcam directory.

I save at the start and the end of each battle. I give it a special name, like NA-B3-St (MCNA-Battle3 -Start), and save. Then I move it to the temp directory. That way I keep my saves and can reload them at my pleasure.

So far it works. Not the easiest way to do it, but better than the other, of having to start over again...WB



Al Boone -> Does this affect Scoring? (7/30/2003 1:21:40 AM)

Bill, I use the same method as a work around. Unfortunately, after suffering some strange end of battle game scoring results, I suspect that this method may be the cause. I can not confirm this, but I am "suspicious".



Wild Bill -> (7/30/2003 1:31:48 AM)

And you could be right on that one, Al. I've seen the same thing.

WB



rbrunsman -> (7/30/2003 4:06:20 AM)

WB, could you paraphrase the programmer's logic? I fail to see any valid reason for protecting the player from himself. It's not as if the computer is going to get hurt feelings even if someone did abuse a simple save button feature. Is the programmer some sort of Facist/Communist who knows what's best for the playing public?;)

I would allow the programmer his foibles [U]if[/U] he could produce a crash free MC, but since that's not likely I think it fair that we get end of turn autosaves. Playing for several hours and having a crash is infuriating enough without having to start over from Turn 1 if you haven't gone through the process of exiting, saving, backing up the files, restarting the game and loading the scenario. Besides, if you crash and have to start from the beginning, you already know where the enemy is located and it's not much fun to have to redo the battle. It's madness I tell you! Madness!



Wild Bill -> (7/30/2003 5:58:26 AM)

The worst thing I could do would be to paraphrase Michael Wood. He would be quite upset.

I think I can that this is how I interpreted his thoughts. If one can save every turn and have multiple saves, it makes the game too easy.

Now you and I have put my neck in a noose and I hope I don't get a blasting call from good old Michael.

Michael if you do read this, post your own feelings about saves in the MC game.

WB



Wild Bill -> (7/30/2003 6:00:34 AM)

And let me say that your point is well taken. I would have to agree. The player should not have to start over again and fight his way through already fought battles.

I'm working hard to see if we can avoid this in the upcoming MC.

I'm hoping for some programming help a little later but that is doubtful.

Don't despair. We'll make it as bug free as we can, at least from the design and composition standpoints.

WB



rbrunsman -> (7/30/2003 6:57:41 AM)

Well, you do your best and that's been quite spectacular for some time now. I'm sure my sentements reflect everyone else's. Let's hope Michael comes to his senses. :)

Thanks for your hard work and dedication.



junk2drive -> (7/30/2003 8:37:36 AM)

i dont own a mega so i'm confused. but i was ready to buy one or more. are you saying you cant save a game whenever you want to? i live in desert storm country. power outages are commonplace. when i see a strom coming or lightning striking i save my turn, then continue playing. that way if my puter goes down at least i have some starting point. i also save at bedtime to restart the next night. unconfuse me please.



Wild Bill -> (7/30/2003 8:54:20 AM)

You can save a game in progress during its play. The point here is taht you can't have multiple saves.

Some folks like to save each turn so that if they "mess up," they can load the previous turn in and overcome that mistake.

The game does not lend itself to that very well. When you save, it overwrites what you have saved before.

WB



Hrappur -> (7/31/2003 5:23:12 PM)

Gentlemen
I agree with the comment on having multiple saves of the same campaign. It should be a option. It for one thing litterarly prevents one from exploring the multiple alternative battles that are possible without actually going back to the beginning - unless the tedious backup routine is performed in the OS. Owning both Lost victories and desert fox MC's I often ask myself why I have'nt progressed any further than a feew battles into each campaign (save the lack of time to play!) and possibly preventing me from purchasing the third or fourth MC - I simply got bored of my mistakes (the silly ones and CTD related ones) and was forced to live with them - while in real life this has to be taken for granted, I would like to have the option as a armchair general to have it both ways - after all ITS ONLY A GAME!

Regards

Hrappur



tmac -> (7/31/2003 6:11:39 PM)

I am playing my first mega currently, which is Lost Victories. I have just purchased (and FINALLY was able to get loaded correctly and start) Desert Fox. I have had some success thru trial and error to do what Col Wilder mentions above; that is , save every turn. I put a seperate folder on my desktop that stores the saves (with internal folders for each battles turns). I have created a shortcut on the desktop to the save folder for the mega in SPWAW. Each turn I play until I am ready to finish my turn and click to let the AI go (in other words, arty scheduled, all moves made, ranges set for opfire, etc). I then exit the entire game, open the 2 shortcuts, and copy/paste the turn from the mega into the seperate folder. I then re-enter game, proceed to turn, re-name it when prompted (ie, if my save file is LVbattle2t3 for Lost Victories battle #2 turn #3, I would change it to LVbattle2t4)and open up that turn. I then hit the hotkey for starting the AI's turn and play the next turn to the same point, then repeat. It is kinda a pain in the a**, but really doesn't take too long, and offers me the opportunity to try alternatives or not lose much to a crash. If I want to replay or redo a turn I reverse the process, ie, copy/paste from the seperate folder back into the mega save after deleting the turn I wish to re-try. The only real question I have is whether the scores are somehow changed or screwed up by this, but I haven't noticed it yet. I'm not really familiar with the scoring to be honest, and I care more about the victory level than the points anyway. This has worked for me for a few battles in LV so far, and the first in DF. Any comments from wiser, more grizzled grognards?

Thanks,
Tim



rbrunsman -> (7/31/2003 11:45:25 PM)

tmac, I'm pretty sure that the only scoring issue arises when you have "per turn" VHs. In those scenarios, to get full credit for all the turns you held the VHs you have to play the whole scenario in one sitting without exiting/saving the game. Every time you exit/save the scenario you lose all your per turn points.

I don't save [U]every[/U] turn like you do. I just save near the end of one scenario and then in Turn 1 of the next scenario. This only causes me hours of lost time in case of a rare crash, rather than the days of lost time when I first started MCLV. I don't worry about where my decisions lead me since this is my first time through the MC. I just wish I had a better "save name" routine. I have just been doing "Scen10T1" etc. rather than the scenario's actual name which would be better for going back or helping someone out who has screwed their system and needs a shortcut to where they were in the game before they lost all their save files.

My backup folder resides right in the save folder. I do this with PBEM saves too. That way you don't have to worry about what save file you have available when setting up a PBEM game.



Voriax -> (8/1/2003 12:21:42 AM)

tmac, when I played through the LV the only bug I noticed was that one of my Stug's suddendly lost all its kills. But as the exp level stayed as it was (115+) I didn't care that much about it.

Some time ago I tried to figure out why the score is sometimes very odd...I think it was version 6.x times. One thing I found out was that when a tank dies its full crew is counted as casualties, even if the all bail out. And if this crew is killed then they are again counted as casualties... That's one reason for strange scores..but a small one, I think.

Voriax



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