What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (Full Version)

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Rigafan -> What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (8/29/2020 5:19:36 PM)

Hello,

Obviously I know about this game, but I am curious why it is so famed and what makes it so good? The reason I ask this is that I was watching some YouTube tutorial on the Minsk campaign yesterday, as I am very interested in purchasing but...

The player was just clicking around as fast as possible saying things like "well I don't want to confuse people, so I'll just play it quick and let you see the results!"

All it seemed he was doing was moving units forward and attacking, we no regard for anything?

I've read plenty of reviews and the people with 1000+ hours can't be wrong, I'm sure but is this game just better because it has a lot of numbers or is it actually better

I'd say the most complex wargame I've learnt is the John Tiller series so far.



Telemecus -> RE: What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (8/29/2020 6:11:49 PM)

John Tiller is certainly of the same category of grognard games as Gary Grigsby.

Ultimately War in the East has the closest fidelity to the actual historical war on the eastern front. In as much as you can genuinely say what happens in this game has some say in what the alternative what ifs of history could have been. As a result it is not just played by heart of iron players who want a less arcadey game. But for some this is the first and only game they ever played. They are the many older players who also play this and often are ex military or came to this with a long time military history interest.

The game also has emergent properties that are not obvious from the detailed play mechanics, or indeed were ever intended by the developers. This means there is a very different subtle level of appreciating a campaign at a zoomed out level.



Jemus -> RE: What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (8/29/2020 8:25:57 PM)

I totally agree, this game has the closest possible feeling to real historical problems. You have to plan ahead. A typical example - like it really was! - is the whole year 1942 for the axis. You know that you aren't strong enough to fight everywhere so you have to put a main emphasis or focus in an area where you think you can achieve a decisive victory. Additionally the whole war changes a lot. In 1941 the soviets fight for surviving but afterwards it changes and suddenly the axis will be in the defensive role.

To sum it up: This game represents the actual historical problems very good. It is deep and complex. For example every single weapon is calculated in a fight and it definately matters where you put in your most modern or most experienced units.



CapAndGown -> RE: What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (8/29/2020 9:01:03 PM)

As opposed to a quick and dirty, might I suggest my play list for the German first turn? Although the audio is poor in some of the videos, I do try to explain not only what I am doing, but why.



eskuche -> RE: What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (8/29/2020 9:11:22 PM)

Another example: was listening to a podcast where a panelist said they were trying to plan ahead for Guderian's push in '41 and grabbed a history book which turned out to describe exactly the situation and solution that the player was in.



Rigafan -> RE: What makes this game so 'complex' or better than the others? (8/30/2020 12:18:27 PM)

Thanks for the replies and info.

Game is on sale on GOG so I bought it, Also thanks to Larry for his videos



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