Venerian Microbes

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DeepBlack -> Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 12:21:56 AM)
There is going to be a big announcement tomorrow (Sept. 14th)concerning Venus. They (academic researchers) have found the chemical Phosphine in the Venusian atmosphere. Phosphine is a smoking gun for biological activity since there is no known way to produce it in the absence of life. Look at the UFO subreddit for more information. That is where the press release was leaked yesterday. Yes, I know that is a dubious provenance but it corroborates with other teasers. I cannot post links due to the forum's spam filter system.

RangerJoe -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 12:50:08 AM)
Phosphine is a poison gas that was used during the First World War. But if there are Venereal microbes, maybe that is where the Venereal Diseases come from? [8\|]

DeepBlack -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 1:08:04 AM)
Never heard of Phosphine used as a poison gas but Phosgene, certainly. If this story pans out, I wonder how a sample return mission would be quarantined to allay fears of an Andromeda Strain scenario.

Aurelian -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 1:39:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe Phosphine is a poison gas that was used during the First World War. But if there are Venereal microbes, maybe that is where the Venereal Diseases come from? [8\|] Phosgene. Not phosphine.

RangerJoe -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 2:48:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aurelian quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe Phosphine is a poison gas that was used during the First World War. But if there are Venereal microbes, maybe that is where the Venereal Diseases come from? [8\|] Phosgene. Not phosphine. My mistook. But don't put water on any phosphine pesticides nor feed any animals that have ingested it.

OldSarge -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 3:34:26 PM)
The Royal Astronomical Society is holding an official press briefing now. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1u-jlf_Olo

OldSarge -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 4:19:47 PM)
The RAS has a Venus Phosphine Factsheet on their web site. Pretty interesting discovery!

OldSarge -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 5:56:39 PM)
That is a good point. If this is true, it challenges almost of our assumptions about the conditions for life. Although, I'm old enough to remember being taught in science classes that there were dead zones on Earth where life couldn't exist. Now, we know life is pretty tenacious and, if given the opportunity, will adapt to almost any condition. Still, as Carl Sagan might say, we'll need to await further investigation.

GaryChildress -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 7:01:32 PM)
Interesting. I wonder, though, why is this the first time scientists are detecting it? I thought the ability to detect molecules of different types on distant planets has been around for a while. Did they only just now think of pointing their telescopes at Venus? [&:]

OldSarge -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/14/2020 11:32:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GaryChildress Interesting. I wonder, though, why is this the first time scientists are detecting it? I thought the ability to detect molecules of different types on distant planets has been around for a while. Did they only just now think of pointing their telescopes at Venus? [&:] For the longest time people were only thinking about life in terms of a planetary surface. It has only been relatively recently that the idea of life managing to live in the atmosphere became a question worthy of study and more importantly, precious telescope time. This study has been going on for some time, they needed to independently verify their evidence and observations which takes more time. So here we are. As Dr. Beverly Crusher would observe: 'Genuine research takes time, sometimes a lifetime of painstaking, detailed work in order to get any results.' Sorry, had to get a Star Trek quote in. [:D]

RangerJoe -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 12:06:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OldSarge quote: ORIGINAL: GaryChildress Interesting. I wonder, though, why is this the first time scientists are detecting it? I thought the ability to detect molecules of different types on distant planets has been around for a while. Did they only just now think of pointing their telescopes at Venus? [&:] For the longest time people were only thinking about life in terms of a planetary surface. It has only been relatively recently that the idea of life managing to live in the atmosphere became a question worthy of study and more importantly, precious telescope time. This study has been going on for some time, they needed to independently verify their evidence and observations which takes more time. So here we are. As Dr. Beverly Crusher would observe: 'Genuine research takes time, sometimes a lifetime of painstaking, detailed work in order to get any results.' Sorry, had to get a Star Trek quote in. [:D] But she and Bones could whip up a cure within an hour! Including time for commercials!

Neilster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 12:24:27 AM)
It looks like early in its history, Venus was much more Earth-like and it's quite possible that life developed then, before Venus had a runaway Greenhouse Effect. Now the surface is a very nasty place where it's about 450C, 100 atmospheres pressure and it rains sulphuric acid but simple life may be hanging on in the much more benign upper atmosphere.

Neilster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 12:27:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Grognerd_INC quote: ORIGINAL: OldSarge The RAS has a Venus Phosphine Factsheet on their web site. Pretty interesting discovery! You know what I think could be exciting - If this were to hold true, life finds a way on even inhospitable rocky worlds. Makes the Drake equation bulge with life! If life is shown to have evolved multiple times in one solar system, it will truly change our perspective of the universe around us. But it has to be corroborated first. Heck maybe life started on Venus and major impact events moved microbes from planet to planet. There's the caveat that from what we now know about exoplanets, our solar system seems to be very unusual and particularly conducive to life. It's all a very complicated topic and involves the fascinating Fermi Paradox. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox

Zorch -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 1:18:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GaryChildress Interesting. I wonder, though, why is this the first time scientists are detecting it? I thought the ability to detect molecules of different types on distant planets has been around for a while. Did they only just now think of pointing their telescopes at Venus? [&:] Remember that we're talking about trace amounts that would not be detectable from far away.

RangerJoe -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 1:36:18 AM)
With the atmosphere and pressure, there could be a lot of chemical reactions going on.

Zap -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 2:26:21 AM)
Here is food for thought. So life, maybe there? Hypothesis!! There is no evidence yet and the scientist are hypothesizing Venus had a green house effect. Venus is Barren. A runaway theory that has many trying to give it legs. Tiresome, until there is some credible proof.

Neilster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 3:20:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zap Here is food for thought. So life, maybe there? Hypothesis!! There is no evidence yet and the scientist are hypothesizing Venus had a green house effect. Venus is Barren. A runaway theory that has many trying to give it legs. Tiresome, until there is some credible proof. Positing hypotheses and looking for evidence is how science works. The fact that there is phosphine in the Venusian atmosphere is potentially evidence for life. You seem sceptical about the concept of any kind of greenhouse effect but they are very real. Venus has an incredibly powerful one, which is why its current conditions are so harsh. Whether you believe in anthropogenic climate change or not, the Earth has a natural greenhouse effect. From Wikipedia... "An ideal thermally conductive blackbody at the same distance from the Sun as Earth would have a temperature of about 5.3 �C (41.5 �F). However, because Earth reflects about 30% of the incoming sunlight, this idealized planet's effective temperature (the temperature of a blackbody that would emit the same amount of radiation) would be about −18 �C (0 �F). The surface temperature of this hypothetical planet is 33 �C (59 �F) below Earth's actual surface temperature of approximately 14 �C (57 �F)." This greenhouse effect is caused by gases in Earth's atmosphere; chiefly water vapour and carbon dioxide. The always excellent Scott Manley has done a video on this phosphine discovery... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWj85r02Oiw

warspite1 -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 5:53:33 AM)
Well I don't know too much about this so I'll just watch and learn. However, what I would repeat is for anyone interested in space, to look at the 5-part, 2019 series The Planets (BBC). This was an absolutely outstanding series. It also told how Venus and Mars were once teaming with water but for a variety of reasons that didn't last. I must confess, given everything that was said about Venus, I would be surprised if there was any possibility of life on Venus but then I don't pretend I understood a lot of what Professor Brian Cox was saying! Here is a snippet from the web page. VENUS Venus� thick atmosphere traps UV radiation from the Sun creating an extreme greenhouse gas effect and making it the hottest planet in our solar system at a scorching 462�C (864�F). Spinning incredibly slowly, almost upright on its axis, Venus has the longest rotation of the planets and experiences almost no seasonal effects. This means one day on Venus is equivalent to 243 days here on Earth! Do try and watch this if you can https://www.bbcearth.com/theplanets/

Zap -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 2:58:02 PM)
It will take more then minuscule amount of phosphine to be credible. We know there were dinosaurs, we have proof. That's the kind of proof that has credibility. Its prudent to be skeptical regarding the possibility of life on other planets in our universe. After so many years of false claims. I'll wait for the plant, building or other being living or dead to be found.

Lobster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 4:59:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RangerJoe But if there are Venereal microbes, maybe that is where the Venereal Diseases come from? [8\|] [:D]

RFalvo69 -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/15/2020 8:53:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OldSarge As Dr. Beverly Crusher would observe: 'Genuine research takes time, sometimes a lifetime of painstaking, detailed work in order to get any results.' Sorry, had to get a Star Trek quote in. [:D] Well, for what it is worth... Indiana: This site also demonstrates one of the great dangers of archaeology; not to life and limb, although that does sometimes take place. I'm talking about folklore. [:D]

Neilster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/16/2020 12:08:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Zap It will take more then minuscule amount of phosphine to be credible. We know there were dinosaurs, we have proof. That's the kind of proof that has credibility. Its prudent to be skeptical regarding the possibility of life on other planets in our universe. After so many years of false claims. I'll wait for the plant, building or other being living or dead to be found. That's why no-one with any credibility is getting carried away. More investigation is necessary. Venus was already of increasing interest to planetary scientists and there are several proposed missions in the advanced planning stages. It's highly likely that a mission with a heavy emphasis on detecting biosignatures and capable of sustained operation in the high Venusian atmosphere will now be prioritised.

balto -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/16/2020 2:16:22 AM)
Check out 'Vixens from Venus' for more accurate information on this subject.

Neilster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/16/2020 3:16:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: balto Check out 'Vixens from Venus' for more accurate information on this subject. Vixens from Venus is obviously a scientifically correct cinema masterpiece. I also think Stacked Racks From Mars is an underrated gem [;)]

Zorch -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/16/2020 1:30:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Neilster quote: ORIGINAL: balto Check out 'Vixens from Venus' for more accurate information on this subject. Vixens from Venus is obviously a scientifically correct cinema masterpiece. I also think Stacked Racks From Mars is an underrated gem [;)] Ah! But nothing compares to 'Mars Needs Women'.

Lobster -> RE: Venerian Microbes (9/16/2020 3:46:49 PM)
William Shatner has already been to Venus and found life floating in the clouds. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_Hands,_Warm_Heart

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