No Hitler Factor for The Germans

No Hitler Factor for The Germans (Full Version)

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Gordonshq -> No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 10:10:39 AM)
I really don't understand why there is no Hitler factor it appears for the Germans in this game. I am playing a couple of PBEM games which are OK, but I also started the Stalingrad to Berlin Campaign as the Russians. On my first turn, I surrounded the 6th Army in Stalingrad and the AI then began doing what was impossible under Hitler. It immediately began withdrawing from the Caucasus, the Rzhev bulge and the Demyansk pocket, obviously to straighten its front line and create reserves. This is complete nonsense and was never allowed until much later under Hitler. This man started WWII and how it can be played without his input into situations beggers believe to me. Surely it would have been very easy to lock all these units in place until such time as they were released historically. I think otherwise this is a really good game perhaps let down a little also by weekly turns that can make it hard to recreate history. Gordon

karonagames -> RE: No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 10:31:00 AM)
Large sections of the front line are frozen for 2-3 turns in the StB campaign. Without the ability to shorten the front at Demyansk and Rzhev and transfer units to the south, it is very hard, if not impossible for a human to stabilise the AGS front at anything like the historical frontline. The AI can move stuff further and faster so it may create a stronger Southern front than a human can. The lack of a Hitler factor, particularly against the AI is going to make no difference to the outcome of the game - you will be in Berlin before the end of 1944.

xhoel -> RE: No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 10:35:52 AM)
The Hitler/Stalin factor is modelled in the way VPs work. You are judged on your performance based on how well or bad you do with the capture and holding of VP points. Other than that, the player is free to make his own decisions and pay for it by losing VPs. The Hitler factor that you want to see in game is something that would put the game on rails and drop replayability a lot. If you want that added, you should also be ok with Soviet players being forced to counterattack all the time in the Summer of 1941 and take horrific losses doing so along with all the other interference Stalin was fond of. Playing the AI is a whole other can of worms as the AI does what is needed to form a defensive lines and perform well against the human player. You are ofc free to play a HvsH game where you can impose whatever house rules that you want to have, or just play the game hotseat vs yourself.

Aurelian -> RE: No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 2:18:42 PM)
There's no Stalin factor for the Soviets either. If there was, on both sides, the why buy the game when I already have several books?

MakeeLearn -> RE: No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 2:54:40 PM)
Want to see the Hitler or Stalin Factor? Look in the mirror. As for the AI, variability would be more desired!?

Bamilus -> RE: No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 3:08:13 PM)
Someone suggested this before and I agree it'd be cool but I think the game already models it to some degree, as others have stated. But it'd take an entire re-design to make it more like DC:Barbarossa, which models Hitler frequently changing his mind (and subsequently victory point cities and priorities). For now I think the VP bonuses for taking cities and the sudden death is enough to emulate the political demands and requirements of Hitler/German government. On the other hand, players dislike this for the reason that they want a sandbox so it appears you can't fully appease both sides. If you really want this then I'd recommend playing DC: Barbarossa which is a fantastic game and also Dark Valley, which is a chit pull board game that is more or less on rails but does a good job of emulating what happened (for example, the Soviets have a chit that forces mandatory counter attacks).

Gordonshq -> RE: No Hitler Factor for The Germans (6/7/2021 7:20:30 PM)
OK, I understand a little better now that the VP's are supposed to represent to some extent what I thought was missing. I was hoping though that this would be more of a simulation than just a game. Never mind it's a great game anyway and so much information available in it. I have started a Hot seat game and hope to follow the timelines I have in various books and try to make my own simulation. It's very interesting doing it this way but I wonder if I will ever finish it. I would have really liked the AI to do that but I realise now it's not that advanced yet. I guess I won't be around if they ever get an AI that good sadly, so I will have to do it myself then. Thanks for the replies. Gordon

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