12th airforce AI bug in '44? (Full Version)

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brettermeier_bp -> 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (6/25/2021 8:04:30 PM)

I just won a long BTR '43 campaign with the Axis (In June '44, which is a pity. I should have allowed the AI to cause more industry damage to finally make it past Summer '44 in a playthrough :/).

Scrolling through the Allied order of battle, I noticed that all the units of 12th Airforce in the Med were not used after December '43. So in June '44, they stand in full force, last mission some 170 or more turns ago. I had already noticed during gameplay that attacks in Italy became weaker, tactical attacks being performed by weak British forces. 15th Airforce concentrated on attacking industry in Austria (which makes sense, of course).

Is it possible that there is a bug that causes the AI to leave 12th Airforce on the ground starting in January '44?

Btw: I can confirm my earlier observation that railway flak which has been stationed in an area that is lost to the Allied, is eliminated from the game at that point in time. No matter whether it has been moved to other areas still under Axis control soon enough. I had stationed the Sumatra flak units near the Anzio front. When the front broke in May '44, the railway AA guns had long been moved near Bologna, but still disappeared from the game.



simovitch -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (6/28/2021 2:50:33 PM)

I'm seeing some fair activity in early 1944 from 12AF in my AI-vs-AI game with the latest patch. The AI uses them mainly for tactical strikes on troops, radar and airbases though, not enough heavy arsenal to attack industry.

If your rail system is damaged/overloaded your rail-flak may be getting stuck in transit as the front line shifts north. Italy has only a few rail lines back to safety and they can get overloaded with supply runs to your troops. I'll take a look though, I still have one more shot at fixes before the next patch is released.



mark dolby -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (6/28/2021 5:13:02 PM)

I'm at 10/2/44 and still seeing attacks on the aero industry around Vienna, but no operations at all against the oil targets in Romania yet?



mark dolby -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (6/28/2021 5:14:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: brettermeier_bp

I just won a long BTR '43 campaign with the Axis (In June '44, which is a pity. I should have allowed the AI to cause more industry damage to finally make it past Summer '44 in a playthrough :/).



It does seem a pity to put so much research into the 262, 190D, 109K4 and Ta152 and hardly see any of them....



brettermeier_bp -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (6/29/2021 12:04:33 PM)

quote:

I'm seeing some fair activity in early 1944 from 12AF in my AI-vs-AI game with the latest patch. The AI uses them mainly for tactical strikes on troops, radar and airbases

Maybe the stop in attacks of 12th AF in my playthrough could be due to heavy losses of the recon squadrons? I just checked once more: 12th AF recon units are at zero strength for three squadrons, one has 5 pilots and planes left and another only started flying in May '44. On the other hand, 15th AF is completely bled dry (all four recon units at zero strength), yet their bombers have continued to attack industry until the end.


quote:

I'll take a look though, I still have one more shot at fixes before the next patch is released.

Thanks a lot, much appreciated!


quote:

It does seem a pity to put so much research into the 262, 190D, 109K4 and Ta152 and hardly see any of them....

Indeed. I was looking forward to the Do 335, the Ju 388 and the G.56 as well. Never saw them in action in the game.
Jets are too expensive enginewise, but I had finished researching the 109K4 and the 190D in March '44. In late May, the Ta 152H was ready, and just a couple of turns back in mid June I got the C version as well. Less than 100 produced, I couldn't really test it...



JeffroK -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (6/30/2021 9:16:21 AM)

So what do I have to do to get the Hawker Fury, dH Hornet, Avro Lincoln, P51H, P47N, B29 & B32??



simovitch -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (7/7/2021 1:11:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffroK

So what do I have to do to get the Hawker Fury, dH Hornet, Avro Lincoln, P51H, P47N, B29 & B32??

A heck of a lot of busy work both in the code and the data files. I don't think we have a green light from Matrix to add more planes.



JeffroK -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (7/8/2021 7:35:12 AM)

[8D]
I was being mildly sarcastic that a Luftwaffe player gets the wunderwaffe where as the Allies are anchored in reality.

why cant the accept the total disaster that was real life, instead of wanting to operate in world that could never have existed.



brettermeier_bp -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (7/8/2021 3:18:52 PM)


quote:

a Luftwaffe player gets the wunderwaffe where as the Allies are anchored in reality.


Well, that's the joy of historical simulations, isn't it? Curiosity about counterfactual history, testing interesting scenarios.

Also, it's not like getting the "Wunderwaffen" is easy in the game. You give up a lot of productive capacity for research for a long time. Especially engines are in short supply, and switching production takes up time, the more the bigger the production capacity. So all in all, the game makes you take some tough choices under conditions of scarcity.

Furthermore, the jet planes are most expensive, taking 4 engines to research and produce per unit. That is a heavy toll. Hence, I didn't research them, but went for 109k, 190D, G.56 and Ta152. Except for the Ta152, these are not exactly "Wunderwaffen", they merely somewhat reduce the disadvantage in terms of plane quality the Luftwaffe player faces.



mark dolby -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (7/8/2021 6:02:24 PM)

Earliest I got the 262 was June'44 and got @10 days production before the game ended. Best to concentrate on those regular types but the allure of the unknown is still strong!



JeffroK -> RE: 12th airforce AI bug in '44? (7/9/2021 8:40:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: brettermeier_bp


quote:

a Luftwaffe player gets the wunderwaffe where as the Allies are anchored in reality.


Well, that's the joy of historical simulations, isn't it? Curiosity about counterfactual history, testing interesting scenarios.

Also, it's not like getting the "Wunderwaffen" is easy in the game. You give up a lot of productive capacity for research for a long time. Especially engines are in short supply, and switching production takes up time, the more the bigger the production capacity. So all in all, the game makes you take some tough choices under conditions of scarcity.

Furthermore, the jet planes are most expensive, taking 4 engines to research and produce per unit. That is a heavy toll. Hence, I didn't research them, but went for 109k, 190D, G.56 and Ta152. Except for the Ta152, these are not exactly "Wunderwaffen", they merely somewhat reduce the disadvantage in terms of plane quality the Luftwaffe player faces.

Great, but only one side gets this option, how many Allied players would rather get the improved P51 & P47 models or B29 to replace some of the lower performance aircraft.
The Axis player gets the option, the Allied player has to live with what was really possible.



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