Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome

Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (Full Version)

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HardLuckYetAgain -> Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 5:20:53 PM)
Hell on Earth part 2 is another game as Germany to see if I can get the German Army to survive till 1944. I have no "Illusions of Grandeur" of a quick victory in this game nor my first game with Jubjub. M60 and I are hashing out a few more minor details of the game settings but should be pretty standard with the exception we are playing with Enhanced TB on. Please follow M60 when he posts his AAR mirroring this one. I am headed to the store to get some cushions for my butt from the butt kicking I am getting ready to get in both of my Hell on Earth games for Germany. Here we go.

jubjub -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 5:31:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain Hell on Earth part 2 is another game as Germany to see if I can get the German Army to survive till 1944. I have no "Illusions of Grandeur" of a quick victory in this game nor my first game with Jubjub. M60 and I are hashing out a few more minor details of the game settings but should be pretty standard with the exception we are playing with Enhanced TB on. Please follow M60 when he posts his AAR mirroring this one. I am headed to the store to get some cushions for my butt from the butt kicking I am getting ready to get in both of my Hell on Earth games for Germany. Here we go. It's really a fitting title btw. Playing the Germans is three months of glory, followed 3 years of pain. Really looking forward to this one. I'm sure M60 will be wiser to your tactics than me.

M60A3TTS -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 5:34:45 PM)
My first choice for a server password was "thistimeyoudie" But having a record of 0-2 against HLYA made me feel that would be putting the cart before the horse. We'll just have to see where this goes, but just surviving until First Winter will be a start. Time to buckle up!

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 6:09:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS My first choice for a server password was "thistimeyoudie" But having a record of 0-2 against HLYA made me feel that would be putting the cart before the horse. We'll just have to see where this goes, but just surviving until First Winter will be a start. Time to buckle up! I have NO doubts this time you will have your revenge. The game is stacked against me this time. But hey, I just have to try.

AlbertN -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 6:32:08 PM)
This looks interesting. Master Axis player vs Master Soviet Player!

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 6:36:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AlbertN This looks interesting. Master Axis player vs Master Soviet Player! I am "not" a master Axis player. Other people are far better than I ever will be as Axis.

M60A3TTS -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 6:42:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain I have NO doubts this time you will have your revenge. Could well be, but the immortal words of C3PO still might ring true. [image]https://i.imgur.com/VFETvWY.jpg[/image]

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 6:46:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain I have NO doubts this time you will have your revenge. Could well be, but the immortal words of C3PO still might ring true. Only if you do multiple stupid things in the game can I see you not kicking my ass all over the place. Personally I don't think that is even going to happen, meaning you aren't going to be making mistakes.

OberGeneral -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/19/2021 9:56:39 PM)
Awesome!

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 9:51:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OberGeneral Awesome! I don't know. I already feel the pain and haven't even accepted the game yet. Trying to come up with a strat against M60. I have a couple in mind but not sold on what I 100% want to do. Been testing some things and... Well I need more testing, lol

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 9:52:59 PM)
I did find this interesting. So "IF" I am able to take a location where the factories never evacuated in real life I kill that production. At lease that is how I am reading it and maybe someone can confirm or deny this. [image]local://upfiles/53556/607B3673643F4DB0BA6B290DF9A63ACE.jpg[/image]

M60A3TTS -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:01:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain Been testing some things and... Well I need more testing, lol Just about have mine wrapped up. [image]https://i.imgur.com/bfT6x39.jpg[/image]

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:04:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain Been testing some things and... Well I need more testing, lol Just about have mine wrapped up. [image]https://i.imgur.com/bfT6x39.jpg[/image] can't read gibberish, For all i know this is how to boil water. ;-P

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:06:11 PM)
You really think the Soviets are that powerful?

Aurelian -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:27:13 PM)
nvm

loki100 -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:30:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aurelian quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain I did find this interesting. So "IF" I am able to take a location where the factories never evacuated in real life I kill that production. At lease that is how I am reading it and maybe someone can confirm or deny this. [image]local://upfiles/53556/607B3673643F4DB0BA6B290DF9A63ACE.jpg[/image] Just as if the Axis forced it. It just takes longer to come back if you move it. No. The rule is as written [;)], so if a factory was never relocated it can't be relocated. Now that is not the fantastic game winning concept it might appear. To be doing damage, you have to be taking cities that never fell and really, apart from Moscow, they are a long way East. Or in other words, by the time this is working in your favour you should have the VP for an auto win - or such a high HWM that you'll win in Dec 44

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:40:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 quote: ORIGINAL: Aurelian quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain I did find this interesting. So "IF" I am able to take a location where the factories never evacuated in real life I kill that production. At lease that is how I am reading it and maybe someone can confirm or deny this. [image]local://upfiles/53556/607B3673643F4DB0BA6B290DF9A63ACE.jpg[/image] Just as if the Axis forced it. It just takes longer to come back if you move it. No. The rule is as written [;)], so if a factory was never relocated it can't be relocated. Now that is not the fantastic game winning concept it might appear. To be doing damage, you have to be taking cities that never fell and really, apart from Moscow, they are a long way East. Or in other words, by the time this is working in your favour you should have the VP for an auto win - or such a high HWM that you'll win in Dec 44 So just to be clear, Moscow did not evacuate thus if taken all those factories are KIA permantly. Thank you for the answer. Yet another reason to take Moscow over Leningrad :-)

OberGeneral -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:51:16 PM)
This seems to indicate that in some cases all factories could not be evacuated by the time Germans captured the areas that they were in. https://michaeltfassbender.com/nonfiction/the-world-wars/big-picture/the-transfer-of-soviet-factories-during-world-war-ii/ How were the ones historically moved determined for the game?

M60A3TTS -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 10:58:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 quote: ORIGINAL: Aurelian quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain I did find this interesting. So "IF" I am able to take a location where the factories never evacuated in real life I kill that production. At lease that is how I am reading it and maybe someone can confirm or deny this. [image]local://upfiles/53556/607B3673643F4DB0BA6B290DF9A63ACE.jpg[/image] Just as if the Axis forced it. It just takes longer to come back if you move it. No. The rule is as written [;)], so if a factory was never relocated it can't be relocated. Now that is not the fantastic game winning concept it might appear. To be doing damage, you have to be taking cities that never fell and really, apart from Moscow, they are a long way East. Or in other words, by the time this is working in your favour you should have the VP for an auto win - or such a high HWM that you'll win in Dec 44 So just to be clear, Moscow did not evacuate thus if taken all those factories are KIA permantly. Thank you for the answer. Yet another reason to take Moscow over Leningrad :-) Fine, and if I see so much as a single panzer regiment that doesn't belong north of the Daugava, I'll know what to make of that statement. [8D]

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 11:00:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain quote: ORIGINAL: loki100 quote: ORIGINAL: Aurelian quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain I did find this interesting. So "IF" I am able to take a location where the factories never evacuated in real life I kill that production. At lease that is how I am reading it and maybe someone can confirm or deny this. [image]local://upfiles/53556/607B3673643F4DB0BA6B290DF9A63ACE.jpg[/image] Just as if the Axis forced it. It just takes longer to come back if you move it. No. The rule is as written [;)], so if a factory was never relocated it can't be relocated. Now that is not the fantastic game winning concept it might appear. To be doing damage, you have to be taking cities that never fell and really, apart from Moscow, they are a long way East. Or in other words, by the time this is working in your favour you should have the VP for an auto win - or such a high HWM that you'll win in Dec 44 So just to be clear, Moscow did not evacuate thus if taken all those factories are KIA permantly. Thank you for the answer. Yet another reason to take Moscow over Leningrad :-) Fine, and if I see so much as a single panzer regiment that doesn't belong north of the Daugava, I'll know what to make of that statement. [8D] You dont have to worry. Moscow is priority target 1. There you know what I am coming for.

AlbertN -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/23/2021 11:40:37 PM)
Many Cities that never fell still had their factories widely evacuated - Leningrad for instance!

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 12:40:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AlbertN Many Cities that never fell still had their factories widely evacuated - Leningrad for instance! Yup, but I want the ones that didn't evacuate. In this case Moscow, North Moscow, and West Moscow. Just been checking the Factory evacuation and those factories don't evacuate, see below. Like these Sturmviks. For me it is Moscow or bust this game. I want all that production "dead". [image]local://upfiles/53556/3FE78BE1A7A9433895BFE377D7DDA25D.jpg[/image]

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 12:41:30 AM)
Here are the factories. Moscow [image]local://upfiles/53556/0694CBBDBFA74B45A4E726D339A098DA.jpg[/image]

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 12:41:51 AM)
North Moscow That is A LOT of factories not moving! They may convert or move and I am still in the process of checking them out. [image]local://upfiles/53556/BB60CBA57DE74288B4EB81E720BA4283.jpg[/image]

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 12:44:17 AM)
West Moscow This alone makes Moscow priority #1 over Leningrad any day of the week for these 3 hexes. At least in my book it is. Not to mention you kill the NSS in this hex & supply has to travel further and I would gain all the Level 2 railyards :) [image]local://upfiles/53556/BF90C666D87F46F3A080AE199D831020.jpg[/image]

jubjub -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 12:47:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain North Moscow That is A LOT of factories not moving! They may convert or move and I am still in the process of checking them out. [image]local://upfiles/53556/BB60CBA57DE74288B4EB81E720BA4283.jpg[/image] Pretty sure the MiG factories disappear. Edit nvm, they move.

AlbertN -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 12:52:45 AM)
I think that is something that will be 'fixed'. Presently the system is binary - which I feel it is wrong. Soviets -should- lose some Factories for good / permanently if they're caught by the Germans or are manually evacuated before the time. Not just some extra damage that may translate in a minor inconvenience (Especially as they can emergency repair and the like, I assume.). But at the same point to just lose a whole chunk of production because ... it was never evacuated it is silly. Same type of concept for which I refuse to play without the Advanced Theather Management; and that others pointed out too. Your healthy division gets sent to rest to France, whilst your mauled one sticks on map. Or your vanguard Panzer unit is the one selected for relocation to Tunisia, instead than the one refitting already in the rearlines.

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 1:08:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AlbertN I think that is something that will be 'fixed'. Presently the system is binary - which I feel it is wrong. Soviets -should- lose some Factories for good / permanently if they're caught by the Germans or are manually evacuated before the time. Not just some extra damage that may translate in a minor inconvenience (Especially as they can emergency repair and the like, I assume.). But at the same point to just lose a whole chunk of production because ... it was never evacuated it is silly. Same type of concept for which I refuse to play without the Advanced Theather Management; and that others pointed out too. Your healthy division gets sent to rest to France, whilst your mauled one sticks on map. Or your vanguard Panzer unit is the one selected for relocation to Tunisia, instead than the one refitting already in the rearlines. The game is modeled after real life events. I just play with the constraints. I am sure M60 will stop me way before I get into Moscow anyway.

HardLuckYetAgain -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/24/2021 1:12:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain You really think the Soviets are that powerful? M60's silence on this question is deafening ;-P Of course he thinks they are that powerful.

erikbengtsson -> RE: Hell on Earth part 2 (A) HLYA vs (S) M60 All are welcome (8/25/2021 5:25:36 PM)
Has this happened yet? If not, get on it ! (Please ;))

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