AP cost for moving supply? (Full Version)

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Jagger2002 -> AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 6:03:20 PM)

In section 4.4.3 in the manual, there is reference to an illustration demonstrating AP cost for a supply source to reach a certain hex and the effect of a supply base. The illustration appears to be missing. Is it possible to get us a copy of the illustration.

I am trying to understand how to determine AP cost for supply movement. Anybody know how to do that?



ZygfrydDeLowe -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 6:34:32 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jagger2002

In section 4.4.3 in the manual, there is reference to an illustration demonstrating AP cost for a supply source to reach a certain hex and the effect of a supply base. The illustration appears to be missing. Is it possible to get us a copy of the illustration.

I am trying to understand how to determine AP cost for supply movement. Anybody know how to do that?


If you select any hex, and hover the mouse pointer over the hex illustration, you will get more detailed info, like in the attached picture.
The supply movement differs for different road categories (the one in the picture is for the best road type available). I don't know what alternative supply movement is, but the cost seems to be the same (I haven't checked for other hex types).

[image]local://upfiles/49974/5F32AE6D3DB2499997FE2D57A900B021.jpg[/image]



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 6:48:48 PM)

Great! That is a big help.

Basically I am trying to determine how far away from the primary supply source and where I should create a supply base. Since supply movement cost is 1 AP on main road, then anything located further than a 100 hexes by main road from the primary supply source will receive reduced supply. So I am guessing a supply base should be approximately 100 hexes away from the main supply source and on a major road. Possibly a bit less if expecting traffic jams.



ZygfrydDeLowe -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 6:54:28 PM)

Enable the supply filter and you should see the color coded supply availability. You can click on any hex and you will see the route the supplies take. It's rare that the trucks will go 100 hexes on main roads. You might consider creating a supply base on the border between color changes.



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 6:54:33 PM)

What I would like is to select a unit and find out how far away the unit is in APs from the supply source.



ZygfrydDeLowe -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 6:57:50 PM)

Yeah, that would be really helpful



ZygfrydDeLowe -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:03:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jagger2002

What I would like is to select a unit and find out how far away the unit is in APs from the supply source.


Well, would that do the trick? :)
[image]https://i.imgur.com/b5XCWy3.jpeg[/image]

I checked the math, it seems to be correct.
Unfortunately, it doesn't refresh properly when I change hexes until I select a supply source different than the one currently selected, although it might be only an issue when there is a single supply source, perhaps.



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:12:39 PM)

I am examining the logistics network closely because in my St. Vith scenario masses of my troops ran out of fuel despite being within the green supply zones. Going back and looking at the fuel statistics, it appears I simply ran out of fuel. I was down to 5000 fuel points a turn which is apparently not enough to keep everyone fueled. However within game, I simply did not realize I was running out of fuel until units starting going red and unable to move. So the green supply zones don't necessarily mean you are actually getting needed supplies. So what I am trying to determine is how I could have got the most out of the available fuel.

One thing I didn't do which might have helped is change the Bullingin supply dump to deplete once fuel became a problem. Also I captured the Stavelot supply depot as well but it was on the last turn of the game. It would have provided a tremendous amount of fuel. I think Stavelot needs to be a priority objective. Possibly much more conservative on transportation movement might have helped. Still speed is important in this scenario.



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:21:28 PM)

quote:

I checked the math, it seems to be correct.
Unfortunately, it doesn't refresh properly when I change hexes until I select a supply source different than the one currently selected, although it might be only an issue when there is a single supply source, perhaps.


Hehe, that is it. So much info right before my eyes in the game and yet, somehow I missed it.

What exactly does the information mean--Selected hex: 23AP/250AP-Free 0AP? Does it mean only 23 AP to get to unit. Is the free AP a reference to AP from supply bases? What does the 250 AP indicate?



ZygfrydDeLowe -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:29:40 PM)

The color coding is only for the supply AP, not for the supply availability, as you already know.
It's a good practice to check your stats at the beginning of every turn to see if your units are getting all the requested supplies and fuel and whether stocks will suffice - usually there is a steady decline in available fuel.
E.g.
Overall fuel situation- the green line is important
[image]https://i.imgur.com/krYzfW7.jpg[/image]

Overall supplies situation - the uptick comes from capturing an Allied strategic supply base
[image]https://i.imgur.com/7yst3nt.jpg[/image]

Unit fuel consumption - as you can see lees fuel has been delivered than requested by the units
[image]https://i.imgur.com/RT7mVDh.jpg[/image]



ZygfrydDeLowe -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:42:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jagger2002
Hehe, that is it. So much info right before my eyes in the game and yet, somehow I missed it.

What exactly does the information mean--Selected hex: 23AP/250AP-Free 0AP? Does it mean only 23 AP to get to unit. Is the free AP a reference to AP from supply bases? What does the 250 AP indicate?


Yeah, you got that right - the cost for your logistical network to get supplies to the selected hex from the chosen supply source is 23 AP. 250 is the absolute limit, no supplies will be delivered past that cost. Supplies will be reduced after 100 AP, and fuel is binary - either it is delivered fully, or not at all. The chance for full delivery is equal to the percentage of normal non-fuel supplies that will be delivered.
Free AP is the bonus AP from passing supply bases acting in a regular or build-up mode.



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:51:21 PM)

My fuel supply stocks dropped to 5000 by 19 Dec and stayed at 5000 till end of game. Clearly I was something wrong. I did capture both the Bullingen and St Vith supply dumps and I didn't convert them to deplete but together they only had 4200 fuel points. Wouldn't have made much of a difference.

Added...Stavelot had 15,000 fuel. That would have made a difference.



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (11/30/2021 7:55:28 PM)

quote:

The chance for full delivery is equal to the percentage of normal non-fuel supplies that will be delivered.
That makes fuel delivery tricky...unreliable.

Although the problem in the St Vith scenario is that I ran out of fuel. No problems with non-fuel supplies if I remember correctly.



pedro0930 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (12/1/2021 5:10:32 AM)

I am almost sure you cannot extend supply AP with additional supply dump as German because all major route out of your supply source already passed through strategic supply depot going west, giving them their maximum possible free AP. You might be able to build supply dump to distribute supply locally, but that sounds very slow going and the range of supply through local depot is very small.



Jagger2002 -> RE: AP cost for moving supply? (12/1/2021 1:35:43 PM)

quote:

I am almost sure you cannot extend supply AP with additional supply dump as German because all major route out of your supply source already passed through strategic supply depot going west, giving them their maximum possible free AP.


Good point. In St Vith, there is that strategic supply depot. I think my primary problem was not using fuel efficiently and not capturing Stavelot until the last turn. I am going to try that scenario again focused on the fuel situation and see how I can compensate.



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