Admin movement and interdiction (Full Version)

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Gam3r -> Admin movement and interdiction (12/15/2021 9:05:43 AM)

Clarification needed.

How exactly it works?
I do not see any reduction in MP costs for 161st ID.

It cost 3 MP to enter pending hex, but 1 MP for interdiction level of 40.

isn't the 22.2.1 saying that any level of interdiction turn that hex MP cost as the in 'pending'?

[image]local://upfiles/78197/6E20255CEF424CA5B18C557BB27ED2A5.jpg[/image]



loki100 -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/15/2021 10:02:16 AM)

WAD

Intediction at level 4 imposes no movement cost on non-motorised units - table in 38.7.2

admin movement reduces costs by the paragraph below the bit you have shown, it can't be reduced below 1 MP

pending is different to interdiction - actually by design you will never see interdiction in hexes that were enemy controlled at the start of the turn

Roger



Gam3r -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/15/2021 12:14:13 PM)

But the manual says:

Movement in friendly hex cost less then in pending hex UNLESS there is interdection of ANY level > 0.



Joel Billings -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/15/2021 9:48:51 PM)

Not sure what rule you are pointing to, but if you mean admin movement, it can't bring the cost down below 1. Non-motorized movement in clear or light woods is 1, so not having admin movement doesn't save you anything. Light amounts of interdiction are most useful in bad terrain situations (or for when crossing rivers), as normally the admin movement could reduce MPs but with any interdiction would not. If there's a rule that's unclear, can you point out where in the manual it is. Thanks.



Gam3r -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 8:02:18 AM)

So how i reafing this:

"Rear area administrative movement cost is reduced ... in friendly controlled hex and be 1mp instead of 2-3 mp in pending hex.

And that reduction will apply when:

1.
2.
3. No enemy interdiction at ANY level >0"

So if there is interdiction in friendly hex, then - that reduction from 2-3 mp to 1 mp should not apply. Thats how manual suggest.



[image]local://upfiles/78197/4429639D5CEA49F0AEA296CCAC2DEEEC.jpg[/image]



loki100 -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 8:18:24 AM)

the cost of that hex for a non-mot unit in clear weather is 1 MP regardless of whether it can access admin movement



Gam3r -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 8:28:45 AM)

if it pending it cost 3 mp for infantry to enter that hex. Reduced to 1 mp when admin movement rule apply



loki100 -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 8:57:32 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gam3r

if it pending it cost 3 mp for infantry to enter that hex. Reduced to 1 mp when admin movement rule apply


Hi

this the key point, admin movement - by definition - cannot take place in a pending hex. The first bullet pt (which you crossed out) 'hexes that were friendly controlled at the start of a turn'

The other bit is the hex with the 4 interdiction only costs a non-mot unit 1 MP (in clear weather), this is the table I raised in the second post. So again admin movement is not being used.

If it was a motorised unit or a supply trace (ie trucks) then yes it matters and the rules apply as you indicate

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gam3r

But the manual says:

Movement in friendly hex cost less then in pending hex UNLESS there is interdection of ANY level > 0.


I think you are mixing up the fixed charge for a pending hex (varying by unit size and possibly morale - see 38.7.1), the variable effect of interdiction (varying by intensity and unit type - 38.7.2) and the base cost for a hex.

So a light woods hex in clear weather costs a non-mot unit 1 MP (38.7.3), interdiction at level 4 adds on 0 MP for a non-motorised unit (38.7.2) so the cost is 1 MP. Admin movement can't reduce the cost below 1.

If that hex was light mud then the cost would be 1 (base)+1 (light mud) + 0 (interdiction). So 2 MP, if admin movement had been available (& its not as the interdiction denies this) the cost would have dropped to 1 but since there is interdiction it stays at 2 MP.

Roger



Gam3r -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 9:12:57 AM)

Yes, i'm understand that admin takes place only in friendly hexes.

Second: manual suggest that admin move is faster. Faster than what? Faster then in pending. It is just logical conclusion and manual support it.

Third: admin rule only apply if there NO INTERDICTION at all! That is how it written in manual, hence your table in 38.7.2 is irrelevant. Because it describe what happens IF interdiction levels reach certain treshold.

So ANY interdiction makes frendly hex MP cost as if it pending. (3MP instead of 1 MP for infantry) With additional penalty at the higher levels of interdiction as in table in 38.7.2.

That actually makes sense. 'cause you can't march on the road with enemy fighter-bomber makes strifing run on your column.




loki100 -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 9:32:53 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gam3r

Yes, i'm understand that admin takes place only in friendly hexes.

Second: manual suggest that admin move is faster. Faster than what? Faster then in pending. It is just logical conclusion and manual support it.

Third: admin rule only apply if there NO INTERDICTION at all! That is how it written in manual, hence your table in 38.7.2 is irrelevant. Because it describe what happens IF interdiction levels reach certain treshold.

So ANY interdiction makes frendly hex MP cost as if it pending. (3MP instead of 1 MP for infantry) With additional penalty at the higher levels of interdiction as in table in 38.7.2.

That actually makes sense. 'cause you can't march on the road with enemy fighter-bomber makes strifing run on your column.




I'm afraid this is wrong,

2) no, admin movement is a reduction on the standard cost, however that reduction cannot take the actual cost below 1 MP - so there are hexes/situations where admin move or not is irrelevant

3) no interdiction does not make the hex 'pending', this is key. A pending hex is one you have captured this turn. The higher cost in those hexes is a reflection of low level ongoing combat, need to patrol (just in case) and so on as opposed to a hex you held in your turn

But fundamentally the concepts of interdiction and pending are completely different. By definition in the game engine they can't co-exist.

Roger



Gam3r -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 9:36:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: loki100

2) no, admin movement is a reduction on the standard cost, however that reduction cannot take the actual cost below 1 MP - so there are hexes/situations where admin move or not is irrelevant


so admin move does nothing most of the time? or at least for a clear hex in good weather?



loki100 -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 9:40:09 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gam3r


quote:

ORIGINAL: loki100

2) no, admin movement is a reduction on the standard cost, however that reduction cannot take the actual cost below 1 MP - so there are hexes/situations where admin move or not is irrelevant


so admin move does nothing most of the time? or at least for a clear hex in good weather?



for non-mot units, yes in clear hexes/good weather. In poor roads its usually useful for mot units (& thus in the supply system)



Gam3r -> RE: Admin movement and interdiction (12/16/2021 9:51:41 AM)

ok then, i thought it was to remove pending hex movement penalty.



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