Flak Losses and Ground Attack (Full Version)

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fighterf4u -> Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 4:10:14 AM)

So today I booted up the Vistula-Berlin scenario as the Soviets and I gave each air army a Ground Attack directive at some German frontline units


As you can see in the image, I lose 2000 planes of which 1700 are due to flak.

These losses seem way too high. Keep in mind that not a single German plane rose to intercept and each GA directive is set at a very high attitude (20,000 feet).

Given these flak loss numbers, is there any use for GA directives except for turn 1 Axis? Right now, it feels like any directive except ground support is highly situational. The new air war mechanics are fantastic and its a shame that the game discourages you from using them fully.


I'm playing on 1.02.13 by the way.

[image]local://upfiles/76826/875C28B16C9C49178FDD4CB8CC029B77.jpg[/image]



fighterf4u -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 4:17:01 AM)

Flak losses

[image]local://upfiles/76826/AC237D97C5244AD1B2BC1A0C8899F033.jpg[/image]



Zovs -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 5:24:18 AM)

What did you select for # of strikes and area AC(Esc)?



Stamb -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 8:10:19 AM)

fighterf4u GA is not intercepted, there is some bug.



actrade -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 11:32:29 AM)

There are issues with the .13 build with overpowered Flak losses. Joel is aware of this and they're currently working on a fix that hopefully will be out this week.



Joel Billings -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 3:25:21 PM)

The scenario designer chose to have the German air force on rest at the start of the game so it would not engage the Soviet air force on turn 1. As for flak, yes, we're aware that flak is too high and needed some additional changes. We've got a version in testing now. At the same time, it is very possible to run the Soviet air force into the ground on turn 1 given all the attacks that take place. In a recent test game of 1.02.13, the Soviet AI took 668 flak losses and 1265 total losses. In the version we have in test now, the Soviet AI took 336 flak losses and 968 total losses. It is possible to lose many more depending on how much ground support you want to fly. The Soviets lost 13,300 aircraft in 1945. Given 16-17 hard weeks of combat, that's around 800 aircraft a week. Probably more were lost on the first week of the major offensive. We hope to get the new beta version out soon.



Stamb -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 3:57:41 PM)

Ground attack is not auto intercepted even if fighters are in range and not on a rest. We (me and Lovenought) had to house rule it.

From this AAR: https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=5118497
Post #: 14

"T02.
The Soviets did a massive amount of interdiction which cost them some LB and caused 1-3 level interdiction on quite a few hexes. No fighter intercepts. I don’t think this is too damaging at this stage of the game but could be more serious once the front line tightens up. This is what caused us to change the house rules."

Also my thread in a tech support:
https://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=5121139



Joel Billings -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 5:44:57 PM)

I missed your thread in the tech support area, sorry. If there is a difference in intercepts of Bomb City versus Ground Attack, I'd really like to see a save that I can use to see that. We know that detecting air mission in the air phase can be difficult and probably needs some work when Pavel can get to it after the editor work. But there shouldn't be a difference between bombing a city and bombing a ground unit when determining detection and intercepts.



Stamb -> RE: Flak Losses and Ground Attack (1/11/2022 7:46:12 PM)

It is server game, I have no saves. But I think any GA in GC is not auto intercepted.



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