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Supervisor -> (8/19/2001 12:17:00 AM)

Air Force Special Operations Command (AFSOC) First in, last to leave The un-seen quiet professionals



gdpsnake -> (8/19/2001 7:21:00 AM)

My Dad was a USN carrier pilot and I have nothing but admiration and respect for anyone who wears the uniform of his country in any capacity. But I was hoping for a little more friendly interservice rivalry.
Perhaps I retired at a good time. The military seems to be becomming more of a corporate job than a lifestyle. I don't know if that's good or bad. Any comments out there? Got to pass the time till the next patch or game comes out!



Supervisor -> (8/19/2001 8:28:00 AM)

The problem today is politics. The great US of A has made such a name for itself that the whole world expects us to fix and solve their problems with little or no support from those asking for the help. I have nothing but admiration for all of our services under todays philosophy (do much more with much less in more places all at the same time). I'm so sick of being deployed half the year because some jerk pissed over someone else's border. Only 3.5 to go so it's too late to bail now.



Charles2222 -> (8/19/2001 8:41:00 AM)

gmenfan:
quote:

The great US of A has made such a name for itself that the whole world expects us to fix and solve their problems with little or no support from those asking for the help.
Don't be so convinced that the US isn't helped in their aid because everyone wants a handout from us. Military aid is often wanted, but just like the Poles weren't great helpers of the Hitlerite invaders, many nations don't help because of, shall we say, US "social policy" imposed and/or propagandized on the populace, particularly on poor African nations.



Paul Vebber -> (8/19/2001 8:48:00 AM)

Hey, I resemble those Navy remarks... just made O-5 in the reserve...As for the Zoomies, Tip of the Spear - LOL - they have a bad case of Carrier P*nis Envy...You want Expeditionary, Naval Aviation has been there, done that, has the T-shirt "Air Expeditionary Wing"...Give me a break! Turnn of over the the USN and give em tail hooks, thats the only way they will ever be "expeditionary".



Randy -> (8/19/2001 3:30:00 PM)

Hey Gdpsnake, I resemble that remark-UUOORAHH!
However I wasn't a "ground pounder", I served with Air Wing ("swing with the Wing!"). I wasn't a pilot though, I flew a desk for 3 yrs, as a squadron S4. The ground pounders were a unique group. During an FTX at Ft. Irwin I saw an infantry platoon near by and noticed all the grunts, were playing "bull in the ring". I asked their Lt. what they were doing, and he said they had some time to kill so he had them tackling each other. I thought oh well, somebody has got to do it.



Mike Oshiki -> (8/19/2001 10:20:00 PM)

Congrats Paul! We've come a long way from the days of the Nu-Parable protest dancers at Madtown... Now that I'm in Squid country here in Hampton, I've got to ask where does the "Bravo-Zulu" expression come from? I understand it to be something akin to "good job," but don't know exactly what the acronym is all about. Let me know when your promo is and maybe I can work some TDY up there... Mike



Les_the_Sarge_9_1 -> (8/20/2001 3:56:00 AM)

oh man gotta insert a comment here hey gmenfan, without wanting to offend, but gotta say, if you want to be reeeeeally overworked you will never find it in the US military. You guys got it soft man. Try the Canadian army. Here we do more with less and expect ya to do it as good as you guys south of the border. And our guys dont even remember what their families look like by the time they get posted back home. Our gear is older than our troops, lousy quality, and in inadequate supply. Yet our troops can outfight ya in the wargames with it. Now of course wargames aint any way to measure what really counts, that being numbers. Remember we invented peace keeping. We merely let the US guard the UN buildings (had to put em somewhere eh, and hey with all that money you guys never pay yer bills either). Only guys in US military that know what work is are the Marines (cause they know what its like to use the crappy gear no one else wants).



gdpsnake -> (8/20/2001 5:08:00 AM)

Paul,
Congratulations on 0-5! Where did you find the time with all the gaming?
I respect the Canadian forces! The best parties are had on cross countries up north! Gotta keep warm to fight off the polar bear invaders. Trouble is, cross countries got scarce when a few heavy guys decided to go to a basketball game and made the news.
Zoomies rule!



McGib -> (8/20/2001 9:12:00 AM)

quote:

Originally posted by Les the Sarge 9-1:

Can anyone give me the particulars to handle a cash deal for a Canadian in Ontario (please include all conversions, postage, handling, cross border concerns as I hate surprises).
As I recall Les I paid approx $36.75 US for the CD and shipping(I had it shipped via US Post\Puralator), and recieved a bill from a brokerage about a week after I got the cd for $9 cdn. All told it added up to about $70CDN IIRC. Due to an order mistake at Matrix's end I received two cd's(the second one came in about a month and a half later). As it stands right now I wont be getting the next MC as I'm not a huge fan of them(repeatedly getting your butt kicked takes a lot of the fun out of it).



Les_the_Sarge_9_1 -> (8/20/2001 8:10:00 PM)

Hey McGib Thanks for the info. 36 bucks I guess that isnt to bad a price for an item if it is for something well liked. Hmmmm your not liking it is the first specifically negative appraisal I have seen yet. Most responses have tended to be of the gushing variety.
Getting whuuuupped all the time would admittedly tend to dull the fun factor. I must say though, winning all the time tends to be an intense bore as well heheh. So far my biggest concern has been that the product might have a few to many glitches. Glitches not bugs, glitches. A glitch to me is any element that interferes with the target item. That begins right with the sale of the item through delivery and into how well it installs and runs. Cosmetic appeal and panache mean something too. My concerns are not just how the game runs on the computer. I wasnt part of the stampede to get the first cd mostly because I have so few funds for anything other than a flawlessly executed purchase. I am thinking of getting the next cd. Expecting most of the "glitches" to be gone, hopefully at least.



Halgary -> (8/20/2001 8:34:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by gmenfan:
The problem today is politics. The great US of A has made such a name for itself that the whole world expects us to fix and solve their problems with little or no support from those asking for the help.
I think you guys also quite effectively fix problems that nobody wants you to fix. Or you do slight adjusting with a sledgehammer. I'd really like to know what do you americans think about this missile-shooting incident with Serbia few years ago? You know, the small happening where an entire country was shot to pieces.



Grumble -> (8/21/2001 1:07:00 AM)

quote:

I think you guys also quite effectively fix problems that nobody wants you to fix. Or you do slight adjusting with a sledgehammer.
yeah, probably true. HOWEVER, I point you to two recent incidents where we (USA) tried to disconnect ourselves from such "problems". 1995-US states it has no businss in Bosnia; cry from our NATO ("Not After Two O'clock", "Needs Americans To Operate" just to keep things on topic) about how necessary we were since the four of main military powers in Europe couldn't handle it.
Pres-elect Bush's recent admission that, geez maybe the US jumping in everywhere and for every purpose ISN"T the best use of our unique military and political position. H'mm what IS the whining in NATO? it's about the US taking a SMALLER role and thinking for itself.
Just something to consider next time, you hear/read about the US this, US that....



Halgary -> (8/21/2001 2:17:00 PM)

quote:

Originally posted by Grumble:
1995-US states it has no businss in Bosnia; cry from our NATO ("Not After Two O'clock", "Needs Americans To Operate" just to keep things on topic) about how necessary we were since the four of main military powers in Europe couldn't handle it.
Pres-elect Bush's recent admission that, geez maybe the US jumping in everywhere and for every purpose ISN"T the best use of our unique military and political position. H'mm what IS the whining in NATO? it's about the US taking a SMALLER role and thinking for itself.
I heard a good phrase once: "The biggest difference between US-Military and European one is the fact that american soldiers are willing to die for USA, but no european soldier is willing to die for europe." And I think that's absolutely true. Although at the moment I cannot imagine myself leaving my home to fight for the independence of greece, I think it's time that us europeans learned not to be finns, germans and french, but europeans. And this cannot happen if USA is always our "guarding big brother".



Les_the_Sarge_9_1 -> (8/21/2001 8:08:00 PM)

Even being hardly pro US, I will have to agree with the remark that the US being there, will tend to make others avail themselves of their presence. No one is going to do the work while the US is willing to foot the bill. The US needs to do what it does while ensuring that those they work with carry their own share. And in some cases the US should stay out of an issue, if its more logically the headache of one of its allies, who is more than capable of doing it themselves. I have yet to understand why the US was required to get involved in Yugoslavia. For that matter I have yet to understand why Canada had to get involved. This matter could have been dealt with by any number of European nations. And yes it would have been more expensive and more of a burden to them to do it alone. But that is their cross to bear. I just wish our ethnic communities could get used to the fact, that when they moved here, they stopped being Europeans, and stopped trying to force my country to run everyone elses. And that is it in a nutshell. I cant see it being any different in the US. And now my apologies for making this posts original thread become all but forgotten.



bradmbrown -> (8/22/2001 6:58:00 AM)

I recall Prime Minister Chretien's answer to a critic in The House Of Commons (Where our national government convenes, in Ottawa, Ontario) berating his (our) government for it's approval of US air strikes in "The Yugo." Mr Chretien said, "The United States are our allies." I am by no means a fawn, bent over, yankee lover either, but I know on which side of my bread the butter is. We Canadians do not have to agree with the USA, but we two are sisters. We are close. As far as I am aware, the last time our two nations had problems they couldn't work out, England was the boss of my country. Some may claim the USA is the boss of my country, I say, "HEY, I can smoke pot on main street!! Can ya do that in Dallas?" We got nieghbours who are fond of us, so fond, they let us be... and there is NO historic precident for that. Ever, anywhere. Allies? You bet! Yankees?: Good to know ya! Come drink beer with me, any of ya, anytime... and maybe we take a walk down Main Street.... Grin Vive l' difference



gdpsnake -> (8/22/2001 10:12:00 PM)

I think some people are forgetting that politics and National Policy are two different things. The US getting involved is not about what the American people want but what marketing and political gains can be gained by people in power. Perhaps more to the point, what lobby groups are filling the pockets of certain influential politicians. The same thing occurs in domestic politics. I'm reminded of President Clinton and his retoric to Europe to support the arms embargo in Yugoslavia while he was secretly funding and arming the Muslims. Why? You think President George W. Bush is opening protected lands for energy? He's doing it because he owes 'Big Oil' for getting him elected. They don't need it except for future profits. Oil companies are so awash in profit they can't find a way to spend it but gas prices the world over are still where they are. Don't get me wrong, I love my country and I think our system is a good one but I'm realistic. People are people and I never met a politician ANYWHERE who wanted to 'serve the people'. They always vote themselves more money, priviledges, whatever. They 'buy' political points by sending our military into stupid positions. Mainly it happens when the news media 'hypes' something. Remember Somalia and other African nations? You think less people are dying today than back then? Hell no, the media just isn't finding that an interesting story but the US military keeps deploying even when the reasons or need vanish. I could go on for hours but the bottom line is that History proves that 'intervention' decisions made in a graduated response or without decisive goals fails. WW2, Korea, Vietnam, many present day adventures continually prove that point. The only recent positive do it mostly right effort was Desert Storm where the goal was clear, OIL! What was the goal in Yugoslavia? Somalia? I wonder if better results couldn't be obtained by putting the goverment leaders of the involved countries in a room and seeing who comes out....



Grumble -> (8/22/2001 10:14:00 PM)

Good day, eh.
I would rather go up there and drink a beer, then have you come down here and force down the swill that passes for beer in the "Lower 48". That's enough to end any harmonious relations



bradmbrown -> (8/23/2001 9:55:00 AM)

Used to be I could buy this cool sudz from across the line, down in Washinton State:
Miller. I love the stuff. It makes a gluck-gluck sound when you pour it!! And it goes down like a beer made for DRINKING, as opposed to a beer made as a heroin substitute (our Canuck beer), meant to make you stagger and throw punches and hurt like hell when it causes you to vomit. Then one day a lousy stinking monopolistic (Labbatts) beer company of the Traditional Propped Up Old Rich Brewing Dynasty Families OF CANADA slimed a liscense to brew Miller up here. And you know what they DID to it? You should come up to Canada and TRY a Miller up here. They are DISGUSTING. US beer, it seems to me, isn't really meant for getting drunk on, it takes too much, you get too FULL... it is meant to enjoy a few and NOT go insane - and I am NOT talking about that poor people's drink, High-Test or Malt or fortified racehorse piss poor inner city men drink to get up the Dutch courage to go rob a store. Canuck beer is a REAL kick in the head. When I want a cool refreshing drink I have ONE. When I want to get loaded outta my mind, I stay away from it and get me a pint of whiskey. I don't have to drink a gallon of it and when it comes back up it comes in a whoosh and then I am done and can go to bed. Come on up Sir, bring some fine Sour Mash from down in Dixieland, I will go get some fine microbrewed canuck stuff, we will get rockin' and then down main street we go walkin'! Salute!



chief -> (8/23/2001 10:36:00 AM)

For the Gentleman who wanted to know where the expression BRAVO ZULU came from...its the flags that a fleet commander or so hoists for a "Well Done"...from a career sailor (who never spent a day on ship)but saw a hell of a lot of ocean and islands. By the way now that your in squid heaven you can eat hot meals instead of from a can... [ August 22, 2001: Message edited by: chief ]



Mike Oshiki -> (8/26/2001 11:26:00 PM)

Thanks, Chief. I knew all those flags meant SOMETHING . Mike



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