RE: Best way to play each power (Full Version)

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Empires in Arms the Napoleonic Wars of 1805 - 1815



Message

Joisey -> RE: Best way to play each power (9/15/2006 5:47:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardonic


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey

I agree, Russia just doesn't have to worry about Turkey at the beginning of the game.

Turkey has no money, so you can be sure those feudal troops will be taking foraging roll losses as they march into the Russian steppes. When they do, you get extra cossacks. At the beginning of the game, France will be too busy building out its corps to spare any for Turkey.

Yes, you may lose some local income for a short time, but when you clash with the Turk, you'll probably give him a good spanking so consider the lost gold your purchase price for political points.

Once his feudals have vaporized, it'll be the Turk asking for a CP.

I've never seen a game of EiA yet where the Turk passed up going for Syria and Egypt to pick a winter war with Russia out of the blocks.

Re: Russian participation against France. As GB, I would demand that Russia contribute AT LEAST an equal amount of troops as the fully built out Swedish Corps that they are getting in the deal. Ideally, I'd want the Russian to cough up 4 infantry corps, a calvary corp, and Kutusov.


With a pledge to replace my losses (if any) and to allow me to use my fleets in the Baltic to supply the advance,
sure why not? But I think Sweden is a bit weak at the start? I am unsure.

Of course this requires either Prussia or Austria dont object.
But Kutusov isnt gonna beat Nappy. Get over that.
I iwll send him sure, but he wont win.




True enough, but he's better than the clunkers that Austria and Prussia has for leaders.



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (9/21/2006 5:45:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardonic

I dont think that Turkey will have or maintain a 2/1 advantage on his own resources.
I dont think Turkey can solo force a surrender. So I am not worried about Turkey.
His army is crap. I can crush it.

As for the bounty...that would be as British.




In the example we had it actually is a 1,878:1 advantage (already including the new cossacs). An no one was talking about a solo work of TU. Me, as FR, I would gladly spend some $ on keeping RU out of the war! Even if it costs me a couple of INF or a CAV or two.
Just think of it: 2 less CAV on my side vs. 20 army-factors less on their side! I think it's worth it!

And yes, the TU army is crap (or maybe even worse)! But in our example I think it could work out for TU. And even if it doesn't come to a CP. It will hurt RU a great deal!

About the new cossacs...
They are just 1 army factor. They can be really annoying, but if you do some good logistics they are not too much trouble after all!

But I must admit:
I've never seen it been done - and there has to be some luck on the side of TU.
Just have seen the thread of it once - that's all.

Maybe I'll try it next time! [:)]



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (11/30/2006 12:48:33 AM)

I have been reading all of these entries, damn it puts me in the mood for a game!
I am typically a quiet french player, usually not even declaring any pre-existing dow's, for about the first year. It takes time to fill out the guard and artillery! then look out!
I normally let the pr and au players romp around in the germanies and italy, I can clean them out later. I usually try to get spain and turkey as allies.


Hey anyone on the west coast?[8D]



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (11/30/2006 3:28:48 AM)

By the way, the Turkish army may look like crap but don't under estimate chit and luck. As Turkey I once destroyed a Russian stack of 40 factors with feudal corps. On another occasion I put Wellington to flight at Oran with the Nezami Cedid and Syrian Calvary!



yammahoper -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/2/2006 9:58:17 PM)

Fr should always hit Pr in 1805.  Pr has awful leaders, making conquest of Pr that much easier.  From 1806 on, Pr has Blucher, a fine general.

yamma



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/2/2006 10:14:55 PM)

Yes, when I play prussia an can't wait to retire the old men I have as leaders once Blucher arrives! But as the French, in the grand campaign (1805 on) you start nearly at the top of the political point scale. So, with france I don't go to war so much to gain pp but to denie it to others. Typically I start france with most of the inf in garrison (avoid atrit and cost in maintaining corp). I place nappy with the art and guard corp in Strassbourg along with a healthy amount of cav. and inf. garrison. This gives nappy the best flexibility to hit either Austria or Prussia. Then I place Soult with a cav. corp and health inf. gar. in Kleves and Davout with the same in Lombardy. The rest of the inf I garrison in paris and where ever the fleet is. With this set up I can save $ for use in building the guard and art. Maybe a little left to finance some turkish mischief. I can also negotiate with au and pr about dividing up germany and italy. A few quarters of econ manip. and france can be at the top of the pp scale and thereafter only need denie pp to the other powers. Also bear in mind I NEVER bid more then single digits for getting any country.



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/2/2006 10:24:41 PM)

I am a nice frenchy, really! I would never hurt my Germanic neighbors![;)] It's all greedy Britian and Russia's Fault!



Joisey -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 4:39:16 AM)

I believe it is important as France to not let the Austrian and Prussian armies link up.  Move quickly and destroy one or the other, it doesn't really matter which one.

France must set the tempo of combat right away and never let it's adversaries recover.  Keeping it's neighbors on staggered forced peace conditions guarantees that they can never form an effective coalition against France.

I also like to cultivate Spain as an ally at the outset.  It's a pain in the butt to have to invade Spain, and gaining the Spanish fleet gives France the only real chance it will have during the game to challenge British naval supremacy.  It has to be done at the beginning, before Britain starts laying keels down.  France will never catch up in the naval arms race.

Ussually, Spain demurs, but every once in awhile you'll get a Spanish player with cajones.  The naval battle will be a matter of pure luck, but if you win, you'll win big.

I'll treat Turkey as an ally as France, but really it's ussually nothing but a dance.  A good Turkish player will play both sides for maximum benefit.  Any Turk who aspires to put together the Ottoman Empire will ultimately hesitate to cross the British navy, however, as the Royal Navy will utlimately control the Med.



megalomania2003 -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 11:50:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
I believe it is important as France to not let the Austrian and Prussian armies link up.  Move quickly and destroy one or the other, it doesn't really matter which one.

But how, any intelligent Austrian and Prussian players will set up so that they can join before France can reach them

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
Ussually, Spain demurs, but every once in awhile you'll get a Spanish player with cajones. The naval battle will be a matter of pure luck, but if you win, you'll win big.

What about the Russian navy - what will you promise the russian? Allied to Spain and France it will actually give a good chance of victory, Allied to Great Britain it will doom thos chances.



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 12:12:32 PM)

First things first:
It's been a long time since I've played FR. I prefer going against Napi to playing him...
But now to the point:

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
I believe it is important as France to not let the Austrian and Prussian armies link up. Move quickly and destroy one or the other, it doesn't really matter which one.

Total agree! If you can get RU or TU to aid you - choose the enemy they can help you with. If neither is going to help you, I'd always prefer AU. In the beginning they are the stonger part - in my opinion!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
I also like to cultivate Spain as an ally at the outset. It's a pain in the butt to have to invade Spain, and gaining the Spanish fleet gives France the only real chance it will have during the game to challenge British naval supremacy. It has to be done at the beginning, before Britain starts laying keels down. France will never catch up in the naval arms race.

I had a deal with SP when I last played FR. I promised and gave them most of Italy! For a little help against AU and keeping GB off my back! SP is never a naval match to GB, but GB will be pretty cautious to put lots of his few army factors on ships when you've got the SP and FR armadas lying nearby...

After the PR/AU-problem is done, you can even help him in Africa. TU is going to be baught by GB in the long run! It's better to make him stay low!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
Ussually, Spain demurs, but every once in awhile you'll get a Spanish player with cajones. The naval battle will be a matter of pure luck, but if you win, you'll win big.

I don't think it'll work out with only FR & SP fleets. You should have someone else on your side (e.g. RU). If you don't I think it's not worth it! The thread to sink his fleets as soon as he gets troops on them far outweights the risk of giving him the total naval advantage!
If you'll get RU to sign on - CRUSH HIM!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
I'll treat Turkey as an ally as France, but really it's ussually nothing but a dance. A good Turkish player will play both sides for maximum benefit. Any Turk who aspires to put together the Ottoman Empire will ultimately hesitate to cross the British navy, however, as the Royal Navy will utlimately control the Med.

As seen above - I disagree! Like you said: TU is playing both sides! Build up SP and make him an ally for sure! He'll never gain from a war against you! But he can gain BIG TIME by being you ally! I'll pick this one up later.
Keep Tu to the ground and you might even get RU to help you! SP gets North-Africa - Ru gets some provinces from TU and you'll get the PPs! Now that's a deal I can live with! And I think there is no better fight than a dominant FR against a TU that is in a three front war.... :-)

Now back to the benefits of SP being your ally! The situation is something like this (long time ago, SRY):
Alliances: FR-SP, AU-PR
Wars: FR-GB, SP-TU, FR-TU, GB-SP

I crushed AU/PR with some luck! Cond. surr. from PR / AU didn't want it... so: unconditional. But I was fair with them. So they were quiet for 24/26 months (and got passage through AU).
SP and I were massing our fleets near GB and he was concentrating his forces there too. There was just 1 small fleet of mine in Marseilles - which I took to block Gibraltar - SP from the land side. After 2 turns of starving there SP moved in and voila - Gibraltar was spanish.

Believe me - things like this make an ally stick with you to the end! Whichever it is!



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 12:30:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: megalomania2003

But how, any intelligent Austrian and Prussian players will set up so that they can join before France can reach them

What about the Russian navy - what will you promise the russian? Allied to Spain and France it will actually give a good chance of victory, Allied to Great Britain it will doom thos chances.


Right and right!

To the first: Get SP on you side to attack AU from the south. Or TU from the east. That'll draw some forced off your frontline! If it doesn't - build up a static front for now and wait for SP/TU to occupie some cities. Will cause big probs for AU.

Concerning the second: Get RU on your side for sure! Promise him Scandinavia, even Denmark! And promise them provinces of GB! Because if you get to crush the GB fleet, make sure he'll never recover!
Invasion of GB is no.1 priority!
Unconditional peace:
C4 - Take 3 Provinces!
C6 - Remove that crappy Admiral!
C1.c - Remove the 2 lagest fleets (I'd recommend that one - but it's up to you)

Just think about GB with Ireland, Scotland and Wales not belonging to the "Empire". That's a loss of 21$ and 7MP. Leaving him with 30$/9MP. And you've got him where he belongs: An inch below your feet - just waiting to be crushed again....



Joisey -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 2:55:04 PM)

Getting Russia to join a Spanish/French alliance would be nice theoretically, but I've never seen it happen.

But I have seen plenty of Austrian and Prussian players fail to set up their armies near one another.  In fact, I've seen the Austrians mass in the Tyrol for the terrain advantage (and the Tyrolian Korps) more often than I've seen them set up on the Prussian frontier.



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 6:06:48 PM)

Give me one year of peace as Fr in the grand campaign and I don't care if Pr and Au unite!
But, as france I think that it would be a glorious thing to see the Prussian flag flying in cities like Copenhagen, Stockholm and Riga!
And who could argue against the poor and down troden peasantry of Italy, Sicily and Odessa being better off under Austrian Rule?
Does the Au or Pr want a fleet? I will help them build them!
If I can turn one or both of these countries to my side as Fr. I need not fear for the rest of the game!
If they give me a year of peace in the beginning, almost as good! Just let the Au and Pr spend the PP to declare war.

If playing Pr or Au, I tend to grab up all the minors I can. Because when you loose the first clash with Fr, you had better have something to offer!



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 6:22:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: morvwilson

Give me one year of peace as Fr in the grand campaign and I don't care if Pr and Au unite!
But, as france I think that it would be a glorious thing to see the Prussian flag flying in cities like Copenhagen, Stockholm and Riga!
And who could argue against the poor and down troden peasantry of Italy, Sicily and Odessa being better off under Austrian Rule?
Does the Au or Pr want a fleet? I will help them build them!
If I can turn one or both of these countries to my side as Fr. I need not fear for the rest of the game!
If they give me a year of peace in the beginning, almost as good! Just let the Au and Pr spend the PP to declare war.

If playing Pr or Au, I tend to grab up all the minors I can. Because when you loose the first clash with Fr, you had better have something to offer!


If PR/AU give you a year in the beginning - they've done something dead wrong!
An PR in Sweden? You MUST be kidding... There is RU and GB who want to have it! And one of them will surely get it!!!
What about AU in Italy... Well if FR is done with - AU might be going for it and might be able to keep it. With FR raging in europe - there is absolutely no way for AU to keep Italy against FR and SP!

If either PR or AU join the "dark side" (meaning FR-side) of the force - the game is done before it started! You'll crush the other unconditionally (=36 month) and than the one who was dumb enough to follow you (= another 24 / 36 month). And when you think it's time to go for them again. First take one, than the other! Seriously, to have either PR or AU on FR's side, that one must be as dumb as can be....
As PR/AU I've always declared war without losing PPs. Right before the game started! Clear front there!

And by the way: You should always gather as many minors as you can get! Not only as AU/PR!

My two cents!



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 10:20:49 PM)

(picture deep sea diving breathing equipment sound effects here) Join with me Au/Pr and side by side we will rule the galaxy![:D]
Of course part of this is kidding around, if it wasn't fun why do it? Just a little thinking outside the box.
Br and Ru will typically fight Fr to the last drop of germanic blood. Econ wise, Fr can be pretty generous. Plus it costs nothing to give away some-one elses land!
Drive to the East! (can't spell it in German) Maybe Fr can use Au/Pr as buffers against Ru.



megalomania2003 -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/4/2006 11:46:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey
But I have seen plenty of Austrian and Prussian players fail to set up their armies near one another.  In fact, I've seen the Austrians mass in the Tyrol for the terrain advantage (and the Tyrolian Korps) more often than I've seen them set up on the Prussian frontier.

Bad play can happen and will often negate even the best plans (together with bad/good luck).

An Austrian player who prefers the terrain advantage to joining with the Prussian corps should shoot himself and save the French the trouble - not that we are talking about much trouble.

I agree that getting Tu or Spain to aid you is fine, but the Allies should still be able to hold off the other while the majority of their force ( together with the Russian if he can be bought - Poland anyone)



Joisey -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/5/2006 12:21:46 AM)

Has anyone made such a Faustian deal with France as Russia?  Was it worth it?  I suppose if you thought you could become a dominant power it would be tempting, but helping to subdue Prussia and Austria is like a quarterback stabbing his offensive line in the back.

Plus, if Russia crosses G.B., the Royal Navy can do evil things to the Russians when they try to take Sweden.



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/5/2006 1:38:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joisey

Plus, if Russia crosses G.B., the Royal Navy can do evil things to the Russians when they try to take Sweden.


As the Fr, this is exactly the type of conflict I would love to see!
Divide you enemies, let them rip each other apart, then walk in and clean up the mess!



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/5/2006 10:45:49 AM)

@Joisey
Yes I've seen the deal you discribe aus "Faustean"! Unfortunately I was PR! I had to decide which front to torn to... And as I must admit, FR offered the better deal:
- Conditional peace
- Saxony, Hesse, Duchies, Hannover and everything north he left to me!

So I made a quick deal with TU, pissed off GB by taking Scaninavia and had a quick war against RU which ended unconditionally (he didn't accept the CP when it was offered)!
But of course this meant that there was actually no one to stop FR. We tried to get up an alliance AU/GB/PR/SP later in the game but the logistics killed us befor we were even near!


Just one more thing in general:
As PR do you offer Poland to RU to buy him? IT costs you provinces! And I always like to have those polish provinces in case I need just one more criterium to get dominant....



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/5/2006 6:05:13 PM)

For me, if Ru wants me to give up territory, I am going to talk to Fr! One of the problems with Pr is you are cash starved (not to mention leader starved!). In my opinion, Pr just can't afford to surrender territory.
Of course, they also can't afford enemies both to the east and west, and if Ru wants me to surrender provences, he is no friend of mine!



megalomania2003 -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/5/2006 11:44:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: morvwilson

For me, if Ru wants me to give up territory, I am going to talk to Fr! One of the problems with Pr is you are cash starved (not to mention leader starved!). In my opinion, Pr just can't afford to surrender territory.
Of course, they also can't afford enemies both to the east and west, and if Ru wants me to surrender provences, he is no friend of mine!

In my gaming group we generally do not play with alternate dominance rule. They are simply to easy to block.

With regards to Russia I would say that if he wants Poland for nothing then it is unfriendly, but what if he offers a serious assist against France in exchange for Poland - and to sit doing nothing (for or against you) if he isn't given something. As Russia I would never aid Prussia and Austria for free.



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/6/2006 1:04:49 AM)

Against a smart Fr player, Ru wanting Au/Pr to pay them for help, will play into the Fr player's hands. Because as FR I would offer PR territories like Hesse, Duchies and Hanover and assistance with a Danish and Russian campaign (Including loan of leaders). To AU I would offer Bavaria, Wurtemberg, Baden and anything they want in Italy plus assistance with a Russian campaign or Bulkan Campaign. Plus I am not the type of FR to back stab once I have one or both of these powers on my side.

Now picture yourself the AU or PR and which offer looks better to you?



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/6/2006 11:52:12 AM)

@morvwilson
Just my opinion!
If there's a price tag to RU help, it cannot be PR provinces!

But maybe PR help in a RU campain for scandinavia or AU help against TU is reasonable...



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/6/2006 5:07:07 PM)

Thus the conclusion, there has to be a lot of reasonableness and a minimum of greed if FR is going to be defeated. If Ru needs help, it should be supplied by BR not AU or PR they have enough work on their hands just surviving!



megalomania2003 -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/6/2006 11:30:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: morvwilson

Against a smart Fr player, Ru wanting Au/Pr to pay them for help, will play into the Fr player's hands. Because as FR I would offer PR territories like Hesse, Duchies and Hanover and assistance with a Danish and Russian campaign (Including loan of leaders). To AU I would offer Bavaria, Wurtemberg, Baden and anything they want in Italy plus assistance with a Russian campaign or Bulkan Campaign. Plus I am not the type of FR to back stab once I have one or both of these powers on my side.

Now picture yourself the AU or PR and which offer looks better to you?

Except that to win the game they have to fight France at some point. Going against Russia and with France is not going to make Russia or Great Britain disposed towards offering assistance - so they likely have to fight the French alone.

I agree that this is an option against a very greedy Russian, but in this game France is more a problem for Austria and Prussia so some price for Russian help is reasonable.



megalomania2003 -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/6/2006 11:47:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: McGuire

@morvwilson
Just my opinion!
If there's a price tag to RU help, it cannot be PR provinces!

But maybe PR help in a RU campain for scandinavia or AU help against TU is reasonable...

The price does not need to be Prussian provinces, but if the offer is help in a scandinavian campaign this can be done by Russia without help. The swedish army or navy is not that large.

Help from Austria is an option, money from Great Britain would also be nice.



yammahoper -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/7/2006 12:50:23 AM)

I'll say it again, Fr NEEDS to hit Pr, HARD. Fr doesn't need territory from Pr, though that would be nice, what Fr NEEDS is to reduce the Pr cav by a considerable number, which greatly taxes his resources later/throughout the game to replace, a cash drain likely to occur from GB. GB main power is its cash, and Fr does very well when it bleeds GB as much as possible, limiting ships and cash on hand for whatever the GB player has in mind. Also, if Pr gets out of the war with cav intact, then it must face a good army with a great general. Cav wins battles in EiA, make no mistake about that that.

yamma



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/7/2006 2:13:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: megalomania2003


quote:

ORIGINAL: McGuire

@morvwilson
Just my opinion!
If there's a price tag to RU help, it cannot be PR provinces!

But maybe PR help in a RU campain for scandinavia or AU help against TU is reasonable...

The price does not need to be Prussian provinces, but if the offer is help in a scandinavian campaign this can be done by Russia without help. The swedish army or navy is not that large.

Help from Austria is an option, money from Great Britain would also be nice.

This sort of went into the wrong direction. I did not mean Pr help in a french invasion of Ru but a french help in a Pr invasion of Ru. The idea is to get PR and AU to march east instead of west.



McGuire -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/7/2006 10:51:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: megalomania2003
The price does not need to be Prussian provinces, but if the offer is help in a scandinavian campaign this can be done by Russia without help. The swedish army or navy is not that large.

Help from Austria is an option, money from Great Britain would also be nice.


Huh??
I'm a bit confused! Are you thinking about GB money for a RU campain for scandinavia?

I don't see that'll happen! RU wants it - GB wants it, too! But what has PR to offer for RU help against FR! Poland, help in scandinavia,... Anything else I haven't thought of??



morvwilson -> RE: Best way to play each power (12/7/2006 4:53:46 PM)

My original train of thought was in the event of a Pr/Fr Allaince.
Usually, in the games I have played, Russia's first move was to take out Sw and if Br has not taken Denmark they take that next. Meanwhile Pr is busy grabbing up germanic principalities and possibly helping out in pounding AU.
In order to win the game you need PP so you can rack up VP and minor neutrals only get you so far. So, around spring of 06 say, Fr lends assistance to a PR invasion of RU, to gain PP for PR. Then as a peace condition, PR can demand SW or maybe some of RU's polish provences.
There are two places on the board where I have a tough time finding reason for the French army to go, that is Spain (as another has already pointed out) and Russia, especially if FR can get Pr and/or AU to do it for them.



Page: <<   < prev  4 5 [6] 7 8   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI
6.1875