japanese production (Full Version)

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bombata -> japanese production (9/10/2004 8:22:31 PM)

hi all,

although i have some problems with the game/my machine, i started playing the big campain playing the japanese. i planed to change the production and research with the plane upgrade list in mind.

so i did the following changes in the first 5 turns:

-changeing all A6M2N production into A6M2 ZERO.
-changeing all Ki-27 production into Ki-43Ib OSCAR.
-changeing all G3M into G4M1 BETTY.
-changeing all F1M2 and E13A1 into E7K2 ALF.
-increasing the production of ZEROS, KATES and VALS.
-changeing all Ki-line bombers into Ki-49 HELEN.
-did some resreach for A6M5 and Ki-43IIa OSCAR.
-interrupted all resreach for types like MYRT, GEORGE, FRANK.
-changed the production of the transporters into TOPSY.
-changed engine production to get mainly nakajima and mistubishi engines. then some hitachi, nissan and aichi but only slightly above the needed numbers.
-expanding the small factories into a size of 15-20.

is anything wrong here in your opinion? any ideas to optimize the production?

bye



kokubokan25 -> RE: japanese production (9/10/2004 8:45:00 PM)

I'am actually playing august 42 and my production is very similar but..
i produce a huge cantity of D4Y Judy in place to Vals as soon this type was available and this model use the AICHI motor engine. This means that i produce 130 units of this type from dec-41 for make a respectable pool in advance.
By other way, the Ki-84 Frank was the best of the best fighter of the japanese, i have the factory 1 of Gumma research that type also from dec-41, i think in 44/45 this plane is the only capable figther against the Hellcats, Mustangs, ETC..
Some units of Hayabusas upgrade to Ki-61. The research of this type seems necesary.
Besides, the C5M upgrade to Gekko. Again the research a small cantity of J1N1-R seems also necesary.
I'm also producing in cantity the Ki-49, of course, but the main bomber of the japanese is the Ki-67 and....once again, seems also VERY VERY necesary research that type in advance.

Respect the size of the factories, most people prefer small size. This is because this factories are more easy to repair and to change production without inflicted more damage in the process. More huge is the factory more damage to change.



2ndACR -> RE: japanese production (9/10/2004 9:01:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bombata

hi all,

although i have some problems with the game/my machine, i started playing the big campain playing the japanese. i planed to change the production and research with the plane upgrade list in mind.

so i did the following changes in the first 5 turns:

-changeing all A6M2N production into A6M2 ZERO.
-changeing all Ki-27 production into Ki-43Ib OSCAR.
-changeing all G3M into G4M1 BETTY.
-changeing all F1M2 and E13A1 into E7K2 ALF.
-increasing the production of ZEROS, KATES and VALS.
-changeing all Ki-line bombers into Ki-49 HELEN.
-did some resreach for A6M5 and Ki-43IIa OSCAR.
-interrupted all resreach for types like MYRT, GEORGE, FRANK.
-changed the production of the transporters into TOPSY.
-changed engine production to get mainly nakajima and mistubishi engines. then some hitachi, nissan and aichi but only slightly above the needed numbers.
-expanding the small factories into a size of 15-20.

is anything wrong here in your opinion? any ideas to optimize the production?

bye


I take it you are playing the stock Scenario 15. You should try Lemurs scen 26. It can be found at Spooky's place it is now version 4.0:

http://mathubert.free.fr/

As to your changes:

-Few units in the stock scen 15 use the Oscar 1b so you are building way more than you will ever need.
- You have groups for the A6M2N entering the game that will have no a/c to use.
- Let the Nells auto upgrade, just halt construction on turn 1
- You will need the F1M2 and E13A1. Not all groups upgrade to the Alf.
- You need the Mryt, George, Frank research. Never halt it.
- Increase AichI to about 60 engines, you do not need Nissan engines

I use only Lemurs scenario only now a days, so I am a little rusty on the stock scenario.



bombata -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 8:14:47 AM)

thanks for the feedback.

2 other questions:

-even after changeing all Ki-27 nate factories in japan into something else, i still have a production rate of 29 Ki-27 in the aircraft replacement pool. i checked all factories in japan, sachalin, formosa, but couldnt find this ghost factory.

any idea where it is?

and second question is about transporting ressources and oil back to japan. how should i handle this? how does ressource transport to japan works?

thanks and bye



mogami -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 8:38:49 AM)

Hi, There is a Nate factory in Manchuria. Hairban I think. You can use the intell screen production pool avaibilty and sort by factory to locate size and where abouts of everything.



bombata -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 2:07:55 PM)

thanks, mogami.

finaly i can stop producing this scarp heap.



worr -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 5:28:25 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bombata

-changeing all Ki-line bombers into Ki-49 HELEN.


I would think this would be a waste, since no KI line bombers can upgrade to the Helen, and there are so few squadrons in the game as is. I'm not sure how many new ones you get. Too bad, because the Helen is a good bomber.

Worr, out



pauk -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 8:14:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 2ndACR

quote:

ORIGINAL: bombata

hi all,

although i have some problems with the game/my machine, i started playing the big campain playing the japanese. i planed to change the production and research with the plane upgrade list in mind.

so i did the following changes in the first 5 turns:

-changeing all A6M2N production into A6M2 ZERO.
-changeing all Ki-27 production into Ki-43Ib OSCAR.
-changeing all G3M into G4M1 BETTY.
-changeing all F1M2 and E13A1 into E7K2 ALF.
-increasing the production of ZEROS, KATES and VALS.
-changeing all Ki-line bombers into Ki-49 HELEN.
-did some resreach for A6M5 and Ki-43IIa OSCAR.
-interrupted all resreach for types like MYRT, GEORGE, FRANK.
-changed the production of the transporters into TOPSY.
-changed engine production to get mainly nakajima and mistubishi engines. then some hitachi, nissan and aichi but only slightly above the needed numbers.
-expanding the small factories into a size of 15-20.

is anything wrong here in your opinion? any ideas to optimize the production?

bye


I take it you are playing the stock Scenario 15. You should try Lemurs scen 26. It can be found at Spooky's place it is now version 4.0:

http://mathubert.free.fr/

As to your changes:

-Few units in the stock scen 15 use the Oscar 1b so you are building way more than you will ever need.
- You have groups for the A6M2N entering the game that will have no a/c to use.
- Let the Nells auto upgrade, just halt construction on turn 1
- You will need the F1M2 and E13A1. Not all groups upgrade to the Alf.
- You need the Mryt, George, Frank research. Never halt it.
- Increase AichI to about 60 engines, you do not need Nissan engines

I use only Lemurs scenario only now a days, so I am a little rusty on the stock scenario.




you will find everything you want in thread named "Japanese aircraft production spreadsheet" by guke. i think this spreadsheet can be also founded on Spooky site



Sinjen -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 8:29:59 PM)

Don't the KI-27 factories eventually autoupgrade to something better? I had the Nell factories at Gumma autoupgrade to Betties. I was also wondering about the claude factory does it auto upgrade to zeros at some point?



tsimmonds -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 8:47:15 PM)

quote:

I was also wondering about the claude factory does it auto upgrade to zeros at some point?

Yes, same time the Nells upgrade to Bettys: 1/1/42



Xargun -> RE: japanese production (9/11/2004 10:46:59 PM)

The Claude factory auto upgrades into Zeros (A6M2) and the Nate factories auto upgrade into Oscar R&D factories. All of this happens on 1/1/42. I usually stop production and let the computer autoupgrade.

Xargun



Sinjen -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 5:55:37 PM)

My nell factory upgraded. However my Nate and Claude factories remain. Its several days now past 1/1/42. Is there some conditions that need to be present to trigger their upgrade?



Captain Cruft -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 6:05:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinjen

My nell factory upgraded. However my Nate and Claude factories remain. Its several days now past 1/1/42. Is there some conditions that need to be present to trigger their upgrade?


You never need to manually switch over superceded aircraft, they will all switch over within a few months. Manual switch over costs a LOT of supplies, reduces the capacity of the factories and should be avoided wherever possible.



Xargun -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 6:23:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinjen

My nell factory upgraded. However my Nate and Claude factories remain. Its several days now past 1/1/42. Is there some conditions that need to be present to trigger their upgrade?


Not that I know of.. They are supposed to switch automatically on 1/1/42.. I know they switch as in my PBeM they switched... I just don't know the exact date - using my new game to determine that, but I believe someone (Frag, Mogami, Nikademus, etc...) said that they are supposed to switch over 1/1/42...

Xargun



Mr.Frag -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 6:45:15 PM)

Why would your Nate's switch over?

Ki-27 Nates -> Ki-43-IIa Oscar 1/43, thats when they will change factories.

Factories look at the aircraft table to check for upgrade paths, not the air groups table.



Xargun -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 6:48:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

Why would your Nate's switch over?

Ki-27 Nates -> Ki-43-IIa Oscar 1/43, thats when they will change factories.

Factories look at the aircraft table to check for upgrade paths, not the air groups table.


I thought they switched over to R&D on the Oscars ? Hmmm.... or maybe I got the date wrong... 1/1/42 looks a lot like 1/1/43...

Xargun



Mr.Frag -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 6:51:23 PM)

quote:

I thought they switched over to R&D on the Oscars


No factories will switch to R&D ... they will switch when the unit is no longer R&D.

If that happened, you'd have no more aircraft production [X(]



bombata -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 7:10:51 PM)

i restarted the game completley and am again at the 5th day.

some of the feedback about the aircraft production/research here were very usefull. thanks.

now about the second question:

how do i transport ressources and oil back to japan?

do i need to create computer controlled convoys from oil/ressource rich bases back to a port in the japan?

bye



2ndACR -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 7:32:13 PM)

I would not trust the auto convoy routine to save my life.

After about a week of game time, the work load is much more managable. Form a transport convoy with a couple of escorts using AK's for resources and TK's for oil. Send them to where ever the res/oil is. Load it up and set the dest. You have 6 months (roughly) of res/oil in Japan. Depends on how much you expand your industry.

It is usually the 24th of Dec - Jan 42 before I am shipping stuff back to Japan and my other HI locations. I want as safe shipping lanes as I can get.



Xargun -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 7:55:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 2ndACR

I would not trust the auto convoy routine to save my life.

After about a week of game time, the work load is much more managable. Form a transport convoy with a couple of escorts using AK's for resources and TK's for oil. Send them to where ever the res/oil is. Load it up and set the dest. You have 6 months (roughly) of res/oil in Japan. Depends on how much you expand your industry.

It is usually the 24th of Dec - Jan 42 before I am shipping stuff back to Japan and my other HI locations. I want as safe shipping lanes as I can get.


I have to agree with ACR on this... The auto convoy just isn't up to the task for the japanese... At least not til the shipping lanes are completely clear... Even then you're better off designing the convoy yourself, then turn it into a computer controlled TF and let the computer run it after that... Watch where resources/oil piled up and thats where you want to haul it from.. In Borneo Brunei and Miri all collect in Brunei - which has the larger port. Supply TKs there (with escorts) and ASW assets (as well as CAP at both bases or the allies will bomb your newly gained oil into nothing) and haul away... You can make short runs north to vietnam or all the way home from Brunei - your choice...

When hauling resources/oil (especially oil) remember your bases in Thailand/Siam need some oil too, as well as formosa - which needs both oil and resources (but more oil than resources).. Easy thing to do on formosa is when you begin shipping oil / resources home figure out how much Formosa needs and drop off enough for a year or so at a time, so you don't have to worry about it very much... Also, Formosa is a nice stop on the way to japan for damaged merchies so you might get more oil/resources there than you think...

Also, at game start Japan can pull roughly 1000 resources out of china per day. So have some AKs at Shanghai to haul these home... Its a short run and a couple 7k AKs with some ASW escorts works fine... BUT, as you expand further into china you will be able to pull more resources - depending on what condition they are in when you capture them. CHina will provide a lot of resources for japan AND is close and easy to transport... so don't forget about it... From Shanghai to Sasebo its a couple day trip by AK, plus Shanghai has some nice repair facilities just the right size for merchie repairs as well..

Xargun



Oznoyng -> RE: japanese production (9/13/2004 9:26:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bombata

hi all,

although i have some problems with the game/my machine, i started playing the big campain playing the japanese. i planed to change the production and research with the plane upgrade list in mind.

so i did the following changes in the first 5 turns:

-changeing all A6M2N production into A6M2 ZERO.
-changeing all Ki-27 production into Ki-43Ib OSCAR.
-changeing all G3M into G4M1 BETTY.
-changeing all F1M2 and E13A1 into E7K2 ALF.
-increasing the production of ZEROS, KATES and VALS.
-changeing all Ki-line bombers into Ki-49 HELEN.
-did some resreach for A6M5 and Ki-43IIa OSCAR.
-interrupted all resreach for types like MYRT, GEORGE, FRANK.
-changed the production of the transporters into TOPSY.
-changed engine production to get mainly nakajima and mistubishi engines. then some hitachi, nissan and aichi but only slightly above the needed numbers.
-expanding the small factories into a size of 15-20.

is anything wrong here in your opinion? any ideas to optimize the production?

bye

So much depends upon the scenario and rules you are playing by...

I would keep the Rufe producing for a bit. It sucks as a fighter, but at least it is one and the initlal pilots at least are "free". As long as you don't try to shoot Hellcats and Corsairs down with it (laugh), it can provide rear area or convoy CAP. Not great, but useful.

I Halt the Nates. A year is along time to wait for them to switch, but I can expand other factories instead of coverting this one.

I Halt the Nell and let it auto convert to Betty. The production you can get by switching manually is simply not enough to make it worth the cost.

I do not change Float plane production much. Only the Dave (E8N?) upgrades to anything, so the F1M2 and E13A1 are still needed. If my losses suggest I have enough in the pool, I halt them.

I increase production on the Val, Kate, and Zero.

I pretty much left the bombers as is. I used the starting pool to immediately upgrade the really old ones (Ki32?), but left the rest alone.

Not using research at all, just don't feel it is done well enough to make it reasonable to be in the game.

My engine production scheme focuses on Nakajima and Mitsubishi with Kawasaki and Aichi production geared towards creating a stockpile for Tony and Judy production. I produce Hitachi's for a while to build out my Theresa's.

I also put alot of emphasis on H8K and Ki-46 Dinah production. These guys are your eyes and ears squadrons, and they need to have good equipment.



Captain Cruft -> RE: japanese production (9/14/2004 3:21:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oznoyng
I also put alot of emphasis on H8K and Ki-46 Dinah production. These guys are your eyes and ears squadrons, and they need to have good equipment.


This is so true, and may be neglected in the concentration on more glamorous fighter and bomber planes. In particular, at game start you have what I would call a fairly serious shortage of Dinahs. I am coming around to the idea of converting the lesser IJA transport plane factories to it.



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