ABDA Oil (Full Version)

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viking42 -> ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 4:23:48 PM)

Hello,

I'm trying to load oil and fuel on TK form any allied nationality to evac ABDA but it seems it is quit einpossible to load.

Only sometimes when i reform the TK TF's the ships will be albe to load. What is it all about?

I'm running the last patch
Thanks in advance



Chris21wen -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 5:13:45 PM)

I can't find this in the manual although I'm sure its there somwhere. The allies can't transport Oil. Basically they don't need to they effective get an unlimited amount of fuel. The Japanese however heve to ship the majority of the ABDA oil to Japan so that it can be converted to fuel etc.



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 5:41:49 PM)

I have never had any trouble loading Oil in DEI on TK.



tsimmonds -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 5:45:37 PM)

quote:

The allies can't transport Oil.

Not so. It can load onto Allied TK same as Japanese, just click "Load Resources."



Chris21wen -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 5:46:54 PM)

I've just had a another look in the manual and I can't find what I thought I was looking for which was only the Japanese can load oil so I think I'm wrong.



rogueusmc -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 5:59:02 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chris H

The allies can't transport Oil. Basically they don't need to they effective get an unlimited amount of fuel.

The allies DO need the oil. Maximum production in US is taken care of...but OZ is a TOTALLY different story.



freeboy -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 6:04:45 PM)

maybe it was ak cannot load oil but can load fuel?



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 6:07:37 PM)

I dont see a need to transport oil to Australia, except the oil you can rescue from DEI. The pool of HI is so high I dont think the allied war machine ever runs out. It is more economical to run fuel and supplies to Australia, though I do take the 51 thousand or so oil extra in San Diego and run it to Australia. AT 500 extra oil a day it is gonna be a long time before it builds up to enough to worry about another run.



rogueusmc -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 6:12:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: freeboy

maybe it was ak cannot load oil but can load fuel?

correct..AKs can load troops, supplies, resources and fuel.



viking42 -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 6:46:41 PM)

i just wanted to evacuate oil but mostly can't load it in the TK



tsimmonds -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 6:49:45 PM)

quote:

It is more economical to run fuel and supplies to Australia

Actually it is more economical to run oil to OZ. You make one supply point and 1.333 fuel points in OZ for each oil point you take there. Clearly the oil takes up less transport capacity than do supply plus fuel. Since you need the stuff there anyway, why not make it there instead of on the west coast?



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 6:54:32 PM)

Once again, the US has a measly 580 or less excess in oil production, so we are talking one TK every 30 or so days to Australia. If your counting on that to run your war your gonna be sadly let down.

Now dont get me wrong, it doesnt hurt to send that TK every 30 plus days since you have excess TK anyway. But it isnt gonna run much in the way of your economy.



pompack -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:02:11 PM)

Never had a problem loading oil (either from US, Karachi or anywhere in the DEI) onto allied Tankers.

Per the manual, ONLY tankers can load oil however.

Just as an aside, the type of TF doesn't matter as long as it contains a tanker.



Captain Cruft -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:02:25 PM)

It's not the HI points that Oz produces that's important, it's the supply/fuel.



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:09:27 PM)

Every 30 or so days you can send 18000 oil to Australia, which is more effective? Sending AK with supplies from a never ending source in West Coast as long as your AK hold out, or once a month sending one tanker with oil to Australia?

Again, it is fine to send the tanker because frankly after the first big push to resupply the south Pacific, you have a lot of excess TK. But that lone tanker once every month isnt gonna supply much in Australia. It sure wont run your war effort on the supply and fuel it produces.



Chris21wen -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:17:18 PM)

[:o][sm=00000028.gif]Dam! Dam! Dam!

Been playing this all wrong. Very little oil in Aus. Must rush some there.



tsimmonds -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:19:07 PM)

quote:

Once again, the US has a measly 580 or less excess in oil production

Who says the USA has to run at full capacity? Why let Oz capacity sit idle for lack of oil?



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:21:06 PM)

So now your advocating taking oil from already producing sites to send on a month long trip to Australia where it can eventually be used?



tsimmonds -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:23:30 PM)

Absolutely. The supplies and fuel would have to make exactly the same trip, taking up much more shipping capacity.

Unless of course you were my PBEM opponent. Then I would recommend that you send no oil to Oz at all.[;)]



Bradley7735 -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:24:43 PM)

He's saying that the US produces enough supply and fuel that the extra that comes from HI isn't as necessary in the West coast as it could be in Oz. Send oil, supply and fuel to Oz. Sending oil is more efficient, but you still need to send supply and fuel to suppliment what Oz produces locally.



Chris21wen -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:25:26 PM)

I've just add up the total amout of oil in Aus = 2165.



freeboy -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:26:53 PM)

that is a nice figure, care to share the DATE?



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:28:19 PM)

I dont see the point. It takes days to load all the Oil since it doesnt all go to a single port, in the mean time you can have loaded a TK in 2 days and have it on its way to Australia. Useing one TK every 30 days is fine as it is excess anyway. Waiting around to load a TK with oil the rest of the time is wasting resources and time.



Chris21wen -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:32:12 PM)

2 nov 1943. Note I'm play sen 12 which starts 28 June 1943 and I have not transported any oil anywhere.



pompack -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:34:58 PM)

Think of it this way:

Once a month I have to send 3X supplies and X fuel to Oz (my ratio, your's may vary but the principle remains).

I can send 3X supplies by AK and X fuel by tanker

OR

I can send 2X supplies by AK and X OIL by tanker and have a few supplies to spare.

Whatever the ratio, I have used less shipping and the loss of US HI doesn't matter because I have fuel and supplies going to waste on the West Coast (US).



tsimmonds -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:37:20 PM)

Clearly far more trouble than it's worth. You're right, it's not as if those AKs could be useful for anything but hauling supplies from the West Coast to Oz.....[;)]



Twotribes -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:41:16 PM)

Your ignoring the fact that the oil doesnt arrive in large numbers at any port, except the starting excess you will only see a few thousand oil at any port and that will be drawn down by loading it. You will waste time waiting around to load it and you wont be producing any HI ( though not sure that even matters). It is quicker to send the AK and TK loaded with supplies and Fuel to Australia.

It is Early April 42 in my scenario 15 and Noumea is loaded to the top with fuel and Australia has about 200,000 fuel between Brisbane and Sydney. more than enough for any operations I intend to conduct. Supplies are lighter. About 150k Supply in Australia and around 300K in Noumea. Why waste time with drawing oil to send?



Buck Beach -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 7:54:20 PM)

One of the tricks to loading oil is to form the TF at the port that produces oil and not set a destination and click do not unload. The TF will load the oil stored at the port and the oil produced/accumulated that turn. I think it loads at 4000 tons per turn. The tricky part is that if the tanker sucks the port dry that turn you you have to give in orders the next turn to load it again. The oil shows on the tanker as a red (I think I am color blind) number in the fuel loaded on the tanker. When full or where the next load will fill the hole set the destination to where it can be used and click unload again. Do the same for your AKs loading resources but be careful not to forget and click the load supplies on a subsequent turn.

As I understand in oil is not only used for fuel production, it is needed for industry.

I am still trying to figure out the excess oil produced in the US to ship to Oz. I am sure I'm sending too much at times but don't know what to look for, for any negative effect. My supplies at SanFran are 999,999 but I don't think that is all I need to worry about by sending too much. If any body has an answer to this I would appreciate it. Someone mentioned like the US only had 450 excess per turn but if I'm loading 4000 per turn it is stealing it from being used somewhere.

Buck



Central Blue -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/14/2004 8:00:28 PM)

Twotribes....

I'm in early May '42 and I note that the oils seems to pile up in San Diego on the order of 25-27,000 every 30-40 days. When it gets that high I drain it off with one of the big oilers.

I like to think of this as one more little obsessive detail to manage rather than wasting time.



BartM -> RE: ABDA Oil (9/15/2004 12:48:02 AM)

I'll bleed the dutch east indies dry and send anything I can to OZ, this in turns leaves very little for the Japaneese when they capture it. Shorter trip then west coast to OZ.

Palembang starts out with 700 oil and 900 resources, send tankers and AKs there, and as
Buck mentioned, set them to load, and "DO NOT UNLOAD". as oil and resources are being made, they will load it, once full, send them to OZ, click "UNLOAD CARGO" and your set :)
Batavia
Soerabaja
Balikpapan
Tarakan

as some others, very close to OZ, and you have time unless against a very agressive player to evacuate all that oil and resources, leaving Japan to sit and wait (and of course target with B-17's to damage once you loose them).

This gives the US some time to store up their oil and resources and you can easily send a first run of supplies and fuel to OZ from here, basically bloating OZ tremendously



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