USA owed OZ money at war's end. (Full Version)

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stubby331 -> USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/11/2004 9:04:29 AM)

The website states that "Australia was the only nation in the world to which the United States owed money at war's end." Found out that interesting fact on part of the Australian Merchant marine Website. (see link below).

"3000 Aussies volunteered to serve with US army small ships section in SWPA. Mainly on ships comandeered from Australian ports."

read on...


http://www.merchant-navy-ships.com/index.php?id=0,52,0,0,1,0




Bosun -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/11/2004 9:15:13 AM)

Given a long history in the American Merchant Marines I really liked the link you provided. I can almost see some of those old salts sailing their "small ships" into "Harm's Way".




tigercub -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/11/2004 11:34:24 AM)

cool thanks!




Don Bowen -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/11/2004 4:26:18 PM)

The South West Pacific Area (SWPA) Fleet was formed by the United States Army in 1942. Note that the U.S. Army operated a very large number of vessels during World War II - transports, supply and accommodation ships, local mine planters, and a vast fleet of small craft. They were operated by the Quartermaster Service, Transportation Corps, Corps of Engineers, Coast Artillery Corps, Signal Corps, and the Army Air Forces.

These ships were either:
Army owned - the larger ones known as U.S. Army Transports and carrying the USAT designation
chartered - civilian ships hired, sometimes complete with crews, for extended periods
allocated - Primarily foreign ships and new construction allocated to the army by the War Shipping Administration.

These ships had civilian crews but U.S. (and, in SWPA, Australian) army personnel served aboard many of them as gun crews, radiomen, or other specialists. In some cases the original civilian crews refused to serve in combat areas and were replaced by locally acquired crews – Australian and other merchant seamen and some military personnel. The SWPA fleet gave excellent service, both in coastal transport along the Australian Coast and in combat zones in New Guinea. Particularly noteworthy was the service of the KPM ships.

The SWPA operated two distinct fleets:

The Permanent fleet consisted of larger, ocean-going vessels that were either assigned to SWPA or simply retained after they had delivered their cargos (to the resentment of their crews and the consternation of logistics planners who counted on the ships to carry other cargos). These ships were assigned local designation numbers beginning with “X”. The permanent fleet included:
130 U.S. Flagged vessels (plus 6 or 7 more that served temporarily and did not receive X numbers)
21 Dutch KPM ships (Koninklijke Paketvaart Maatschappij shipping company from the Netherlands East Indies)
5 other Dutch ships (plus 1 or 2 temporary)
5 Philippine
4 Chinese
5 Norwegian
1 Italian
1 Danish
2 British

The “Catbird Flotilla” consisted of smaller craft, locally acquired, and used extensively in New Guinea. They were assigned identification numbers beginning with "S". In July, 1942 the Catbird Flotilla consisted of:
19 Trawlers
4 Harbor Boats
4 Steamers
2 Speed Boats
2 Ketches
2 Motorships
1 Cabin Cruiser
1 Schooner
1 Powered Lighter



Australian vessels known to have been operated by the U.S. Army include:
2 small freighters (used as repair ships)
2 passenger steamers converted to barracks ships
24 motor freighters
22 steam freighters
3 schooners
16 ketches
51 trawlers
2 luggers
2 powered scows
19 tugs and towboats.


Primary Source: U.S. Army Ships and Watercraft of World War II ISBN 0-87021-766-6


SWPA Small Ship S-82 in her daytime hideout, 1943 (Australian War Museum 055775)

[image]local://upfiles/757/Yw673037702.jpg[/image]




stubby331 -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 11:47:18 AM)

thanks for the follow up Don.

Really interesting story.




sveint -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 12:03:04 PM)

Norway was the only country that repaid it's debt to the US fully.




Halsey -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 12:46:47 PM)

I believe Canada also has repaid the war debt. If not, we have made it back in revenue from trade over the last 60 years.[:D]
As for the Australians, the money we owed you for the war effort was invested in the Foster Brewery.[;)]

By the way, we love the Norwegians over here. The only country that supported non-socialist partisans in WWII. Some of us haven't forgotten this.[;)]




strawbuk -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 12:55:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sveint

Norway was the only country that repaid it's debt to the US fully.


And of course you give us that really cool Christams tree for Trafalgar square every year.




Hipper -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 12:56:16 PM)

Hasley

boy youve never been to Norway if you think its "non socialist" in ethos. Of course if you mean non communist then lots of countries had rightist resistance movements Poland, Greece, Yugoslavia (as was) even France. granted the wernt popular in 45 when the comunists took over in eastern europe

cheers




strawbuk -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 12:58:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Halsey


By the way, we love the Norwegians over here. The only country that supported non-socialist partisans in WWII. Some of us haven't forgotten this.[;)]


!!!!! Yes damn those commies, only the really effective operators in France, Yugoslavia, Italy post Benito etc vs Germnas, tieing down units who woulde otherwise be killing my Granddad and yours.




Halsey -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 1:55:05 PM)

That's because the communists were looking at the big picture. They wanted control of Europe, and that was their way of sliding in. Oh, and the socialist governments have done a real bang up job of running their countries. How is the health care? How are the taxes? How is the countries infrastructure?

Oh yes I've actually been to Norway, plus a few other places I'm not at liberty to speak of.[>:]

My grandparents are all gone, and I'm probably a lot older that you.[;)]




strawbuk -> RE: USA owed OZ money at war's end. (10/12/2004 3:23:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Halsey

That's because the communists were looking at the big picture. They wanted control of Europe, and that was their way of sliding in.
My grandparents are all gone, and I'm probably a lot older that you.[;)]


Possibly - and they were also patriotic, brave men and women who were going to be shot at best, tortured or gassed often if caught (together with their kids and Great Auntie Amilie who had darned their socks aka 'helping the terrorist'). Mattered not if they were Comms or Gaullists. And just a reminder that the great commie guerilla mess that became Yugoslavia was hardly fully in favour with the old SovBloc.

In Italy it was very lucky for us all (and the Italians) that USA fixed the post war election system to keep socialists and communists (there was and is a difference) out of power, so establishing a system of inherently unstable Italian govts of great help to corruption, the Mafia (the guys who introduced drugs to your kids) etc topped off by Berlusconi whose media and political manipulation makes the Fox/chads/Florida thing look like a school boy prank.

Your turn but I hereby withdraw and apologise for edging in to politics in forum.

S

ps
Age is not wisdom by default (not that young myself)

pps I like spending my taxes on health care - with just enough to the spooks and SAS to keep Osma out of my life.

ppps I hate our UK random US haters, know I am not speaking German 'cause of USA, but please - not all is rosy in Home of the Free, espeically when you don't stay home.




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