Delicate Question (Full Version)

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sedecula -> Delicate Question (10/12/2004 12:30:45 AM)

I find myself in an economic crunch; about three weeks ago I bought this game, and I'm selling darn near everything out of my PC game collection. Since I only bought the download version is there a legit way to re-sell? I want to honor Matrix and the law, so I'm asking. If this isn't the right forum for this question, then please email me with an answer or let me know how to approach. Burning a CD and selling it with the code feels a bit too much like piracy for me, so I'm asking on the up and up.

Thanks.



toddtreadway -> RE: Delicate Question (10/12/2004 1:42:22 AM)

Good question. I've wondered that myself. Not for BiN, but for WitP, which was a bit too much for me.



cesteman -> RE: Delicate Question (10/12/2004 3:59:52 AM)

I am going to take a stab at this and say NO. The reason for this is because someone who downloaded the game could burn as many copies and they wanted and then write the S/N and sell them. If you had a physical CD with jewl case and S/N I think that would be a different matter. Just my two cents I'm sure someone else will dive into this one. Later!
Christian



dinsdale -> RE: Delicate Question (10/12/2004 4:54:01 AM)

This game is sold by license the same as any other piece of software. AFAIK they can't disguise it as any other kind of sale, and thus cannot override the laws applicable regarding licensing.

When you buy boxed software, you are purchasing an identical license to downloaded, and thus will be governed by what ever laws of those sales apply to you. So, if you're allowed to sell boxed software in your country/state, then you should be able to sell downloaded software under identical conditions.



sedecula -> RE: Delicate Question (10/13/2004 7:48:35 PM)

Having not heard, publically or privately, regarding this question, I can only assume its okay. My plan is to include my printed-out internet bill of sale with the CD and the key number. I can understand why Matrix would not want to answer this publically, since an early resale market hurts first time sales.

Seems like a fine game for its genre.



Owen -> RE: Delicate Question (10/13/2004 11:13:02 PM)

You are almost certainly entitled to resell your copy of a game you purchase. You might want to read over the License for BiN and see if resale is explicitly prohibited. But, if not, you should be fine reselling it.

One thing you could do would be to send Matrix an email notifying them that you have transfered your license and affirming that you have erased or destroyed all other copies of the game.

Of course, I'm not a lawyer, and this is just my humble personal opinion.



sedecula -> RE: Delicate Question (10/16/2004 7:11:30 PM)

I read in the EULA that the license is non-transferable, and no mention of re-sale or explicit permission to re-sell is given. Does this kill my ability to re-sell this game?!?

I definitely hope not; not only for my current situation, but future buys from Matrix, since ability to re-sell is important for my personal gaming economy; with the money from re-sales I am able to buy a few more games each year than I normally would.



Owen -> RE: Delicate Question (10/16/2004 11:54:36 PM)

The EULA clearly prohibites resale if it forbids license transfers. Basically the license to play is what you would be selling.

On the other hand that part of the EULA may not be legal where you live. I believe that some states do not allow product licenses to prohibit resale. But, of course, now you are on murky ground. Software companies know that they can put all kinds of restrictive clauses in their EULAs because consumers cannot afford to test them in court.

In my case the prohibition of resale pretty much seals my decision to not buy BiN. A very high purchase price combined with no demo, no returns and no ability to trade or resell is NOT a policy I'm going to support. Matrix makes same nice products but they are not going to find many customers for them unless they come up with policies that are more customer friendly.



sedecula -> RE: Delicate Question (10/17/2004 12:24:42 AM)

Yes, in my case "all sales are final" has more meaning... Last game I buy from Matrix if that's the policy. It also irks me that I gave Matrix an opportunity to resolve this privately, and they haven't replied in the least. They could have at least clarified the policy to me by private email, and I would have been glad to leave the matter drop. Now I'm a bit more disappointed.

I'll honor the EULA. I wish Matrix well, even though I'm disappointed. They seem to make fine games and support them better than most companies. I know they're likely on the edge financially, and trying to hold on by protecting their sales. So am I. Sixty dollars is a huge investment for me, and without the possibility of recouping some of that money in resale, I'm done.



David Heath -> RE: Delicate Question (10/18/2004 2:26:53 AM)

Hello

I am sorry for the late reply I just got everyone off to Germany for Spiel 04. There is really no way for us to support any type of license transfer. With a boxed product we didn't allow this it but it was more simple for you to do and we did really have a problem with that. It is just impossible now with us doing digital downloads and us having the serial number needed to be register in order to receive updates. There is no way for us to know who is real valid customer and who is not. We offer this service to make it easy for our customer purchase our products. We are sorry if you are disappointed and we will be looking into this in the future to see if we can find a way to handle this better in the future.

David



Fred98 -> RE: Delicate Question (10/18/2004 3:10:01 AM)

I reckon David tried to say the following:

If you need to download a patch, you will need to insert your username, password and registration number.

If you sell the game, the new owner doesn’t know your username and password, so, even with the registration number, they cannot download the patch.

In theory, the new owner would need to register to download a patch and this feature is not yet available at Matrix, but David has hinted they thinking about it.

-



sedecula -> RE: Delicate Question (10/18/2004 3:33:05 AM)

So is there a 30 day money back guarantee?

Seeing as how I am forbidden in reselling something, it sounds like I just paid a $60 one time rent fee for a piece of software I no longer want.

Why hasn't Blockbuster thought of this?



2gaulle -> RE: Delicate Question (10/18/2004 3:58:15 PM)

Interesting question. in fact is the subject studying by my wife. She is a lawer.

there is one major problem with the license. As a customer we never accept the license condition before the payment. So the license have no value. So I'm sorry David Heath but your system allow everybody to do what they want. It's true in Europe as in USA.



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