Mines effect on sub (Full Version)

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seblinselles -> Mines effect on sub (11/15/2004 12:47:24 PM)

I am playing a new 1.3 game as Japanese and I plan to sow minefields in swallow water to prevent allied sub to sail safely in the strait between Takao and Aparri.
Does mine have a chance to damage or sink a sub?

Thanks for any tip



Rainerle -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/15/2004 2:09:04 PM)

Yes, subs can hit mines (as I among others have found out). This has also been posted elsewhere.



Feinder -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/15/2004 4:11:00 PM)

Really? Subs can hit mines (in game)? Cool. Never seen it happen, but glad to know it's possible. About 5% of all sub losses were due to mines...

Betcha didn't know that, did you...?

-F-



dr. smith -> Ally Sub losses (11/15/2004 6:09:03 PM)

FYI (just looking at the first 3-4 monthes of war)
One Jap minefield sunk 2 Dutch subs, K XVII on 21 Dec and O-16 on 15 Dec.

Other losses:
K VII - sunk in air raid on Soerbaja
K XVI - sunk by I-66 24 Dec
O-20 - chased by 3 IJN DDs, scuttled in shallow water
S-36 - ran aground, abandoned
Sealion - sank in Cavite air raid
Shark - 3 Feb, near Malacca, by DDs Amatsukaze & Yamakaze
Perch - by DDs Amatsukaze & Hatsukaze

4 damaged subs scuttled in Soerbaja on 2 March just before capture
O-20 (damaged by DD Yugiri, Urunami, Ayanami)
K X - (damaged by DD)
K XVIII - damaged by depth charges after sinking Tsuruga Maru
K XIII - damaged in battery explosion in Singapore, taken to Soerbaja for repairs

So 13 total Allied subs sunk thru early March.
2 = mines
2 = air raid
1 = sub
2 = ASW (though 3 scuttled were in effect sunk by ASW)
1 = accident/error
5 = scuttled (tho see 4 really ASW, 1 accident)

Probably all full of errors, but a rough count for those interested in what REALLY happened to compare w/game results.

edit = left out K X sub



Feinder -> RE: Ally Sub losses (11/15/2004 6:19:09 PM)

I've got a book, "Janes Submarines" that lists pretty much every sub from every navy, and what happened to it. Excellent book to have in the bathroom. But yep, quite a few subs listed with "Final Disposition : Mined".

-F-



testarossa -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/15/2004 10:53:58 PM)

There is something strange to it. I spent first 6 months mining Jap's Central Pacific and so far sunk 1DD, 3AK, 2TK. Only one sub, I-9 hit the mine and it survived the mining to be sunk later near Townsville. By all means 1 hit is enough for the sub, right? Strange...



dtravel -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 12:43:00 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: testarossa

There is something strange to it. I spent first 6 months mining Jap's Central Pacific and so far sunk 1DD, 3AK, 2TK. Only one sub, I-9 hit the mine and it survived the mining to be sunk later near Townsville. By all means 1 hit is enough for the sub, right? Strange...


All the ships in the game are tougher to sink than IRL, the merchant types especially. Appears to have been a deliberate design decision by 2by3.



testarossa -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 6:15:48 AM)

I can see why. usually i get message AK @@@@-maru hit the mine at Tarawa. Than four-five turns later i see it sinking somewhere near Okinawa. So AI doesn't make an effort to dock it somewhere and attempt to plug the holes, just runs them to Japan - whith predictable results. Another thing which amuses me a lot that AI runs convoys through my LBA range, the Jawa see has real iron bottom now - 2BBs, 2CAs, 1CL, 4DDs, around 30 PG-PC, 8TK, 20 something AKs. And this is in two months of Big Scarabaja Fishing Fest(I have 6 Beaufort 1 sqdrs. there). It is a lot of fun, but not very realistic.



WhoCares -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 10:06:27 AM)

Just yesterday an AK managed to hit another of my mines (just laid by a mine TF). The same turn, in the same hex another AK of my TF gets hit by O19. The latter one sinks next turn while the 'mined' one has just 19sys and little float damage and will reach HongKong in the next turn......



33Vyper -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 10:06:43 AM)

I have a bit of a question....how do you know the status of a minefield??

Once you lay the damn thing how do you know if anything is left? Is there a way to manually calculate the degredation<sp?> once you have laid it? I have not played long enough yet in a game but does the lil red dot disappear after a period of time?



WhoCares -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 10:11:31 AM)

Yepp, the red dot disappears when the last mine is gone. Happens pretty fast in deep water hexes. In shallow water mines last a bit longer and in base haxes they stay pretty long. I think there is a formula in the manual, but I am not sure (only read it once in July...)



testarossa -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 10:51:46 AM)

Yea, something 5% per day in port, 10% in shallow and 15% in deep water? 6 days in deep water and your minefild is gone. I'm mining only ports, tried to mine strates in DEI -didn't do any good. Argonaut is one heck of the minelayer with superb MK12 mine - Iwish they had two.



tsimmonds -> RE: Mines effect on sub (11/16/2004 2:08:51 PM)

6.1.26 Mine Warfare

Rates of Mine Decay

  • Friendly base hex (minimum size 1 port) 1% per turn
  • Shallow water hex 5% per turn
  • Deep water hex 50% per turn

And no, that doesn't mean they will all be gone in two turns:

Example 48 mines X 50% = 24 mines
24 mines X 50% = 12 mines
12 mines X 50% = 6 mines
6 mines X 50% = 3 mines
3 mines X 50% = 1 mine (has to round down or it would persist forever)
1 mine X 50% = clear



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