What ever happened to 2D isometric? (Full Version)

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gunny -> What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 4:20:02 AM)

Turn Based Games. My dream game is a squad based 2D game with isometric icons. With the advent of this style of graphics in the panzer general days, you think we'd have seen more of this on a squad scale or fire team scale. Yet eveything is either top down 2D board style or real time 3D. One school of thought is the facing mechanics is lost, but not so. On hex maps or tile display isometric icons can still rotate facings. Too little info perhaps; well a bottom display for active unit selected solves this. Out dated graphics perhaps? Well if that's so then 2D top downs are super out dated then. Just strikes me as a little odd I spose.[>:]

[image]local://upfiles/8673/Xv640463239.jpg[/image]



ravinhood -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 4:27:35 AM)

Watch for "Strategic Command 2" (ack it has a #2 in it and I said watch for it) lol, I believe it is going to this 2d isometric and "squares", larger maps, blada blada blada.

I like the 2d style of units that can convert to the nato style units and back again myself. Gives players an option and choice.

Now, of course due to my stance on games being "repeats", even if "improved", I'll have to wait on SC2 until it's $10 or less like I did for SC origional. Heh, in fact I just bought SC origional not long ago for $5 on ebay.

I'm not saying it's a bad game, or will be a bad game, it's just a "same" game to me, thus my stance.

But, for you, you'll probably enjoy the 2d units. ;)



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 4:55:46 AM)

Maybe someday a certain Publisher might make an attempt to bring back a game similar to AGE of RIFLES, but based on WWII combat situations. I believe that was 2D, it was a great game to play.



OberJager -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 3:47:35 PM)

Ahhhh, Age of Rifles, Sigh.....

I'm probably in the minority but Man, I loved that game!

Now that would be a great resurrection.......



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 4:02:07 PM)

I still have it loaded on an old 3.11 machine.

With a large file of downloaded scenarios

Maybe this thread will wake up the minority?

Do ya think?



"AGE OF RIFLES" source code petition



ravinhood -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 7:26:16 PM)

Yah "Age of Rifles" was good, but, I can't get it to work on XP, have to use my Win98 setup and still can't get sound to work, any suggestions?

I'll be soooooo glad when they make an OS, all you do is drop in any CD/DVD and the OS setups your system to play the game, no matter how old it is. ;) I forget a lot of how I optimized my system for some old games to get them to work, over 1/2 my WIN95/98 games have to have some form of otimizing to get them to work properly. And DOS games? lol, XP does not like DOS games much at all. Some it will play easily others its coughs and chugs, like "Master of Magic", another I can get to run on XP, but, no sound.



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 7:35:02 PM)

ravinhood

I found that you have to have a true SBPRO or 16 sound card, It doesn't do well with any onboard sound codec's. It won't except them.

It might except Adlib. Don't remember.



ravinhood -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 7:46:48 PM)

I have a Creative Labs Soundblaster Live 5.1 gamer edtion sound card. Isn't that sufficient?



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 7:52:43 PM)

In AOR's sound setup, try, I think it says 100% soundblaster compatable, and use auto detect sound card



sabre100 -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 8:32:08 PM)

Why not use Dosbox to play those old games on Windows XP it runs great. dosbox.sourceforge.net



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 8:49:59 PM)

Your right Dosbox and also D-Fend work great on XP, I just found it easier to play the games in their natural environments, I have a thing about proper game speed.



ravinhood -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 9:05:27 PM)

Doxbox works with Master of Magic but it's soooooo slowwwwwwww for some strange reason. And I have the WIN95 version of Age of Rifles and I get a message that it doesn't operate in dos.

I can live without sound, was just wondering if there were a simple way to turn it on. I'll try that AOR sound setup, I think I already have and it says "not found". But, I'll give it another try.

I had to work with Master of Magic for hours with my WIN98 setup to finally get the sound to work and even then ever so often within the game it goes to static. So I eventually just turned it off.

It may also have something to do with the bios of my mother board and the built in sound drivers on it. Even though I have disabled them, they still could be conflicting. If I remove them, the system just recognizes them again when I restart my system and reinstalls the drivers. lol



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/11/2005 9:54:10 PM)

If you are fimilar with the CMOS area of your system, you can disable the onboard sound system. Windows will stop recognizing it at startup and not load the drivers.

Hit delete or F1 to enter setup or somting to that effect when the machine is booting up.

Also try Adlib in AOR sound setup if its there.

I have 3 old machines running to play old games. 386/17 running 3.11, 486/66 running Win95 and 586/ AMD K6-550 running 98se

Dosbox I'm sure has defined limits. It can't solve everything, I know it doesn't correct mouse problems. D-Fend might correct your sound problems Both together might work.



bartholimew -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 12:41:06 AM)

nope. never heard of isometric game for such a small scale. would be problematic dealing with building occupation me thinks. sure would look perty with some half decent command and conqueresque models no?



IainMcNeil -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 12:58:51 AM)

You can play Spartan & Gates of Troy battles in 2D if you want which works best for old PC's and some lap tops. The campaign game for both games is all 2D. Some people prefer the look of 2D to 3D. Its always crisper in 2D, though you dont to do the cool things like extra animation, effects, and camera angles that you can in 3D.



ravinhood -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 1:59:00 AM)

Yeah SPartan plays well in 2D or 3D, very colorful campaign map. Easy to see what's going on. And it's the single best overall strategy game to date. ;) (ducking)

You really should do more advertising Iain, don't let those big companies get all the glory with their half-arse games (RTW).

Should try at least an ad in Strategy & Tactics and Fire & Movement. If it's not too expensive.

Course I haven't had a PC gaming magazine in awhile now, so I don't know if you're adverstising in the likes of PCgamer or Computer Gaming World or not. ;)

But, Gamespy and Gamespot just really overlooked your game of Spartan/GoT I think, unfairly.

It's easily better than HOI. ;) (hiding)



Hertston -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 3:27:42 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OberJager

Ahhhh, Age of Rifles, Sigh.....

I'm probably in the minority but Man, I loved that game!



I think most who played it enjoyed it a lot... it was certainly one of my favourites. A good system, and amazingly versatile even outside the time period it was supposed to cover (it managed Napoleonics very well, for example). And what other game gave you the Crimean War and Custer's Last Stand (although I can't remember what it shipped with and what was fan stuff now)?

In an odd way (it's a totally different period, obviously), Tin Soldiers: Alexander reminds me a lot of AoR (and Civil War Generals 2).. it just has a similar "feel". All three were/are very easy to learn to play and flow quickly, but still manage significant depth.



IainMcNeil -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 11:50:39 AM)

Hi Ravinhood - I've never heard of these mags as we're in the UK. If you have some contact details for them that would be great. Even if we can't afford adverts we can try and get some coverage. If anyone else knows of places they think we should be advertising feel free to PM me! Being in the UK we tend to only know about the UK press & leave marketing in other countries to the respective publishers. Any history, wargames or computer game mags are of interest.



Marc von Martial -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 12:28:34 PM)

quote:

But, Gamespy and Gamespot just really overlooked your game of Spartan/GoT I think, unfairly.


Both are in our press pool, we even advertised various games there, but we canīt force them to do reviews [;)]. They did reviews for various of our titles, not all of them, in the past though. Sometimes theyīre simply late.



Marc von Martial -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 12:33:15 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Iain McNeil

Hi Ravinhood - I've never heard of these mags as we're in the UK. If you have some contact details for them that would be great. Even if we can't afford adverts we can try and get some coverage. If anyone else knows of places they think we should be advertising feel free to PM me! Being in the UK we tend to only know about the UK press & leave marketing in other countries to the respective publishers. Any history, wargames or computer game mags are of interest.


Gotta love the guys from the island [;)] they donīt know two of the biggest PC / Console gaming websites, worldwide [;)]

www.gamespy.com
www.gamespot.com


Cheers [:D]



IainMcNeil -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 1:22:24 PM)

Websites we're ok with as we can see them from here - its the print mags that are hard to get hold of over here ;)



OberJager -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 7:19:52 PM)

I'll second that petition ( and 3rd it and 4th it...)

Just now looking over some of the other Matrix forums alot of people are wishing for games based on the Franco-Prussian war, Russo-Japaneese war....

All subjets that IMHO were treated very well in AOR....



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 7:57:30 PM)

Yeah, I saw that post about Norm Koger new game & website.

He seems to be remaking his old games to new. That could explain why he won't give up the source codes to AOR.

I think I'll search around and find his site and see if theres any chance of an AOR revival.

Great Game worth every dollar.



ravinhood -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/12/2005 8:26:30 PM)

quote:

Any history, wargames or computer game mags are of interest.


Below for Strategy & Tactics
Decision Games
1649 Elzworth St. #1
Bakersfield, CA 93312

Also says advertising correspondence should be sent to:
Decision Games
P.O. Box 21598
Bakersfield, CA 93390

Phone: 661/587-9633

This is predominantly a board wargaming magazine published 6 times a year. But, it was a magazine like this one and Avalon Hills General (long out of publication) that got me into computer wargaming in the first place. It wasn't any computer gaming magazine, it was wargamers magazines and fliers.

Fire & Movement I'm not to sure if it still exists, but, the last contact information I have on them is as follows:

Fire & Movement
5374 Village Rd.
Long Beach, CA. 90808
Phone: 213/420-3675

Also P.O. Box 8399
Long Beach, CA 90808

This mag did reviews back in the mid 80's on board games and computer games. It lists Peter Hatton and Nicky Palmer as UK representatives and contributing Editors.

Heh amazingly this copy I am getting this information from has SSI's "War in Russia" as one of its games reviewed. And also "Crusade in Europe". LOL this mag is almost 20 years old.

Then for USA PCgamer: http://pcgamer.com/contactus.html

Then for USA Computer Gaming World: http://www.ziffdavis.com/about/contact

They even have a webpage listing their advertising rates: http://gamegroup.ziffdavis.com/rates/

Best I can do for yah right now. If I come across some others I'll let yah know.

Edit: Something interesting about the "War In Russia" review: "We have decided to print TWO reviews of this game as an experiment to show some RANGE OF OPINION and also illustrate the varying "focal points" various players have on a game.

Lol the two reviews are about as conflicting, black & white as you can get, I like this idea of two reviews. Tom Dworschak calls "War In Russia" SITS-KRIEG not Blitzkrieg. lol It bears about as much resemblance to the Second World War on the eastern front as chess does to medieval warfare. lol

Now, this is what is needed when a Paradox game is released. TWO REVIEWS to illustrate the varying "focal points" various players have on their games. ;)

A note on it's price $80 for this game back in 1986.



IainMcNeil -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/13/2005 10:22:25 AM)

Thanks Ravinhood :)



Fred98 -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/13/2005 11:14:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: gunny

Turn Based Games. My dream game is a squad based 2D game with isometric icons. With the advent of this style of graphics in the panzer general days, you think we'd have seen more of this on a squad scale or fire team scale. Yet eveything is either top down 2D board style or real time 3D.

[image]local://upfiles/8673/Xv640463239.jpg[/image]



To answer the Market Research bods; If a game were made in this style, I for one, would have no interest.
-



gunny -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/14/2005 2:33:15 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe 98

To answer the Market Research bods; If a game were made in this style, I for one, would have no interest.
-


Well I respect the opinion of others and am often persuaded by such. So I'm curious why you would have no interest in this. To make it clear I'm referring to turn based squad/platoon level games not RTS Isometric

[image]local://upfiles/8673/Lj237635785.jpg[/image]



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/14/2005 2:39:21 AM)

Gunny:

That looks fantastic.

My kind of game.

Shows us more.

I would certainly buy it and play the hell out of it.

Rick White



gunny -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/14/2005 2:45:10 AM)

[:D] ok sarcasm aside it doesn't exist.
But interesting Ideas from the AoR fans



RBWhite -> RE: What ever happened to 2D isometric? (1/14/2005 2:48:50 AM)

I know gunny

But if it did, I would still buy it.

Love AOR.

Sent an email to Norm Koger about reviving AOR, waiting for a reply.



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