How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (Full Version)

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Feinder -> How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 4:29:42 PM)

Just curious.

US West Coast has about 20 Large AKs at it's disposal on turn 1. You get a bunch more of them in a few weeks.

How many do you convert, and to what auxillery ships?

I'm thinking ARs and AVs are the most useful. A couple AS and MLEs also. I don't worry so much about ADs, since most of my combat fleets are operating out of the larger ports anyways (so reloading torps isn't so big a deal).

So how many do you convert, and to what?

And do you (can you, would you), convert PG Charelston to an AGP?

Then there's also the concerns about getting garrisons to the Noumea chain, and actually bringing supplies to both PH and the Noumea chain. Lots to think about, not as many assets as you might think.

What do you do?

-F-



Tom Hunter -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 4:36:19 PM)

Now that I have played the game enough to understand ship repair I am going to do 4-6 of them to ARs in the first turn and a bunch more later. I would do 12 but I need some of them for supply work.

I wait a bit to do the AVs and other ships that I need. Fast conversion to ARs helps me get the Allied BBs back into ciculation as well as the many other damaged ships I have.



tsimmonds -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 4:47:30 PM)

quote:

And do you (can you, would you), convert PG Charelston to an AGP?


Huh! In my PBEM vs Halsey, Charleston has already (3/15/42) sunk 2 of my subs (out of 10-12 total). I wish he'd convert the damned thing!



Feinder -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 5:01:33 PM)

I -like- the Charleston. It might have something to do with the fact that...
1. That's my birthplace.
2. It has has the teeth of a CL (6" guns)
3. It has radar.

Now if only they had put two hamsters in the engine room, instead of just one, she'd be great. But gawd she's slow.

-F-



LargeSlowTarget -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 5:41:13 PM)

I instantly convert two large AKs into MLEs (one for Noumea, one for Townsville), four into AS and six into ARs. I concentrate four AS and four AR at Pearl, and sent any remaining surviving/newly converted AS/AR to Sydney until this port also has four of each type. Any surplus is sent to forward bases. I never convert AKs into AVs, there are enough AVs and AVDs on map or under construction. And I keep the Charleston, but convert the other PGs.



madflava13 -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 5:44:11 PM)

I convert at least 10 to ARs... I figure I'm going to have repair ports in Noumea, Pearl, and probably Brisbane. 4 ARs each. I'm also toying with the idea of putting an AS and a few ARs in Midway once the port is expanded to service my subs. I'm of the mind you can never have enough ARs...

And I always convert the Charleston because you get an AGP about 6 months faster that way...



pompack -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 5:46:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Feinder

I -like- the Charleston. It might have something to do with the fact that...
1. That's my birthplace.
2. It has has the teeth of a CL (6" guns)
3. It has radar.

Now if only they had put two hamsters in the engine room, instead of just one, she'd be great. But gawd she's slow.

-F-


It's a Washington Treaty thing. The State Department wanted cruisers to cruise around South America, calling at all the ports, showing the flag and generally supporting US business interests in the area. The Navy did not want to tie up several of it's CA/CL units and the tonage of CA/CLs was constrained by treaty. By reducing the hamsters, money and tonage were saved and a case was made (unsuccessfully IIRC) that the cruising cruisers were outside the treaty limits. Since no one cared much how slow the cruising cruisers cruised, it was considered a cost-effective trade to reduce hamster power. Some logs were rolled and some pork was pulled and the cruising cruisers were the result. This data was extracted by reading between the lines in Friedman USCruisers: a Design History.



Twotribes -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 6:05:29 PM)

I need AK for supply, though the 4500 will do in a pinch. I convert 6 to AR and 2 to MLE as I recall, when I get the 90 plus AK in January I convert some to AD and a few more to AR, havent decided how many MLE I really need. As for AS that varies on whether or not Manila got hit and if I lost an AS anywhere else.

I do not like randomizing the reinforcements , it hurts more than it helps ( the allies). I prefer to know when all those AK are arriving and not spread them out over 4 months ( 60 day variable track)



Halsey -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 6:14:07 PM)

Don't make any AGP's . They're worthless.

AD's are useful for repairing DD's also. Don't just look at it as a rearming thing.[;)]

2 or 3 MLE's are more than enough. By the time they arrive most of your good ports are going to be level 9's already.

Dec 8 conversions:
12 AR
3 AD
3 AS

When the Liberty's start arriving I convert all of them to Aux ships in 1942. Makes them more valuable.

When the next big group of AK's arrive I throw in 2-3 MLE's and 2-3 more AV's.
Then 2 more groups of 4 AR's, 1 AD, and 1 AS. This number is the maximum for effectiveness at any port.



Twotribes -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 6:18:32 PM)

I toyed with the idea of converting the Charleston, but no way, it has depth charge racks ). I do try and save and send the ones in the East home for conversion, they have no Depth charge racks and no real weaponry worth a lick., I tack them on to a cargo fleet headed back to the States if I get them alive to Noume.



PeteG662 -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 6:23:50 PM)

Use the Charleston for something better like maybe in the Solomons chain for barge busting and antisub patrol with PCs and the Aussie/Kiwi PGs. Run the other crappy PGs to SF to convert. Any PG with depth charge racks is an asset and Charleston with the 6" guns is more useful than the others.

I convert AKs to ARs, MLEs, and ADs. I do a few the first turn and when I can get a few more 7K AKs in from the front I convert some more. I use 4.5K AKs for frontline service and 7K for shuttle service to Forward Supply Depots.



Halsey -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 6:29:25 PM)

AGP's are only useful for resupplying PTs' at a recently captured base. They're very vulnerable.



Sardaukar -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 6:38:35 PM)

My game against AI is now in Sept 1943, and so far I have:

4 AR in Kiska, Pearl Harbor, SF, Noumea, Sydney, Brisbane, Derby, Darwin, Trimcomalee, Colombo..and couple odd ones in Midway and Suva. Lot of ARs..and I still did order 8 more for forward repair bases.

And 2 AS in Kiska, Wake, Darwin, Derby, Brisbane. Those are my major sub bases. Most have MLE too, unless size 9 port.

And PH, SF, Noumea, Sydney and Brisbane have 2 ADs too. ADs are very good in repairing DDs (and I think they may help with CLs too.)

So, I thought I did convert too many AKs in January...but it turned to be too few...[;)] In Dec 8 I did convert only 5, one extra AR to PH and 4 for SF, all to help repairing the damages of ships in PH raid.

Cheers,

M.S.



bradfordkay -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 7:10:47 PM)

I probably do not convert enough ships to ARs in the early going (I think in my latest game it was four of them, with four going to MLEs). I felt that most of the AKs are needed to get supplies quickly to Oz, but the game may be proving me wrong there. It looks like I'm getting a good supply base built up at Brisbane and Noumea long before the japs are threatening those areas. PBEM could be different.

I do convert any PGs with no depth charge racks to AGPs. I had no idea that they would upgrade to ships with depth charges later, and I'm willing to risk the death of an AGP in an exposed port if it helps the PTs control the seas around forward bases. My present game is now in MArch '42 and I think that I still have a PG or two headed to SF for conversion.



Graccus -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 8:03:58 PM)

As a newbie, I have a ? for all you experienced gamers.

I'm playing the Guadacanal scenario and want to convert some of my AKs. Am I able to do so on the small map? If so, where and how? Thanks for any help you can give.[&o]



ckk -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/8/2005 11:42:08 PM)

Sorry you can only convert at SFO or Osaka



eMonticello -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 1:32:51 AM)

Of course, this begs the question ... why wasn't she classified as a CL in the game? Also, why can't LSTs be converted into AGPs? There were probably an equal number of LST-conversions as there were PG-conversions...

quote:

ORIGINAL: pompack
It's a Washington Treaty thing. The State Department wanted cruisers to cruise around South America, calling at all the ports, showing the flag and generally supporting US business interests in the area. The Navy did not want to tie up several of it's CA/CL units and the tonage of CA/CLs was constrained by treaty. By reducing the hamsters, money and tonage were saved and a case was made (unsuccessfully IIRC) that the cruising cruisers were outside the treaty limits. Since no one cared much how slow the cruising cruisers cruised, it was considered a cost-effective trade to reduce hamster power. Some logs were rolled and some pork was pulled and the cruising cruisers were the result. This data was extracted by reading between the lines in Friedman USCruisers: a Design History.



Cmdrcain -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 3:13:15 AM)

I convert all of mine, at least 8 AR, 4 AS, 4 AE, 2 MLE and 2 AD

I also get all my AK's moving to West coast that are at Pearl, and other ports, to concentrate them there and start moving supplies out.

The AR are valuable, as they repair all ships, you need the AS for Subs, Your going need AE's for replenishing, and MLE for laying mines..

When I get the slew of more AK's later, I convert some of those too.



LargeSlowTarget -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 11:01:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: eMonticello
Also, why can't LSTs be converted into AGPs?


Take your religious zeal somewhere else - I don't want to be converted... [;)]

Okay, would be a nice option to have, but I think there are already more than enough AGPs/convertable PGs in the game. There are some LST-converted-into-AGPs in the construction queue, they start showing up in mid-1943. IMO LSTs are more useful in the original amphib role, I wouldn't convert any of them into an AGP.



Sardaukar -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 11:07:39 AM)

I don't find AGPs very useful. One can rarely get them before Japanese run out of steam...and PT boats are not very useful in attack. PT boats are only last-ditch defense, and AGP is toast when IJN comes to visit anyway.

Cheers,

M.S.



Ron Saueracker -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 5:09:35 PM)

I'm a weirdo regarding this. I convert based on need but I only convert ships with like names. AK Mercury becomes an AR, so does Maine and Vermont, perhaps Atlantic and Pacific, Olapana and Onomea become Otus class ASs, Diamond Head, Mauna Loa and Mauna Ala become AEs, Aroostook an AV...etc. Really weird but what the hell.

Need, for the Allies, has a lot to do with what was lost at Manila and what is available. If I want an AR for Royal Navy, I'll convert a Brithish AK



WhoCares -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 5:37:21 PM)

Just curious (as Jap Fanboy), can allies accellerate the ship arrivals?
(waiting for an updated manual before I read it again [:'(])



mc3744 -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 6:10:31 PM)

At least 4 AR, 2 AD and 4 MLE.

I'm a freak for mines. Give me a MLE and a few subs and I'll mine the entire world! [sm=crazy.gif]



Oliver Heindorf -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 9:13:59 PM)

I convert as much as possible in the beginning.

I usually have 16-24 AR's ( remember you need for max efoort 4 AR's per Port )so you have Seattle, SF, LA, Diego, PH = 4 each = 20 AR's Then comes Sydney & Trico.....another 8 ?
So the more the better !

then I put in action 4-8 MLE's to have forward mining capacity - I want mines, I want tons of them and I want them fast where I need them. When I need to mine PM, Brisbane is too far away for me.

I convert 4-6 AV's just in case if I loose some later

I convert 4-8 AD's

I convert 4-8 AS's

Charlston I sometimes convert, sometimes I wont.



Ron Saueracker -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/9/2005 10:47:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Oliver Heindorf

I convert as much as possible in the beginning.

I usually have 16-24 AR's ( remember you need for max efoort 4 AR's per Port )so you have Seattle, SF, LA, Diego, PH = 4 each = 20 AR's Then comes Sydney & Trico.....another 8 ?
So the more the better !



Plan on getting your ass kicked? Holy expectation of MASSIVE losses!



Tristanjohn -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/10/2005 3:07:03 AM)

Well, in my first PBEM I converted four AKs to ARs and sent those straight off to Noumea, where I've established a strong base for future operations. At present it's a 6 port and doing good repair business! I also sent an AS there.

Also right off the bat I put three MLEs into the pipepline, and couple of ADs and two or three AVDs, I forget (for getting around fast with extra aviation support in the early part of the war).

I then made a bunch more ARs when that large batch of AKs hit SF, plus a few more MLEs, a couple more ASs just in case I wanted to use smaller bases for sub ops, and several more AVs to spread around. I think I made two AGPs. I also have a few AEs coming, but I forget how many.

At the moment I could use those MLEs but they're not ready yet.



Central Blue -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/10/2005 6:13:40 AM)

at the begining of the game I convert all 7000 ton AK's at Frisco. Mostly AR, but also a *few* AD and AS. After numerous trips through the early months of the war I don't feel a crushing need for any of the other types.

There are enough 4500 ton AK's at Frisco to set up convoys to most existing bases. There are other AK's on the west coast that can be consolidated at Frisco over time -- but I handle Midway and North Pacific supply from Seattle. Against the AI there is time to get oil out of DEI to Australia with tankers in the region. When that is no longer feasible you'll have merchies and tankers out your ears.

In a PBEM I think I would add a few PT tenders. I don't need them, or PT's, against the AI, except for what I already have in PI and DEI. Against a human opponent they might be usefully expendable here and there from time to time.



Tristanjohn -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/10/2005 8:00:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Central Blue

at the begining of the game I convert all 7000 ton AK's at Frisco. Mostly AR, but also a *few* AD and AS. After numerous trips through the early months of the war I don't feel a crushing need for any of the other types.

There are enough 4500 ton AK's at Frisco to set up convoys to most existing bases. There are other AK's on the west coast that can be consolidated at Frisco over time -- but I handle Midway and North Pacific supply from Seattle. Against the AI there is time to get oil out of DEI to Australia with tankers in the region. When that is no longer feasible you'll have merchies and tankers out your ears.

In a PBEM I think I would add a few PT tenders. I don't need them, or PT's, against the AI, except for what I already have in PI and DEI. Against a human opponent they might be usefully expendable here and there from time to time.


In my PBEM I've sure gotten good use out of my PTs.



Oliver Heindorf -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/10/2005 9:28:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ron Saueracker

Plan on getting your ass kicked? Holy expectation of MASSIVE losses!


No, just to cut down the yard time. remember, its war, so the warships belong to the sea, not to the yard [;)]



bradfordkay -> RE: How many Large AKs do you convert on first turn as Allies (3/10/2005 10:07:02 AM)

" I don't find AGPs very useful."

C'mon... you've got to build those society yachties their seagoing yacht clubs! Where are they going to gather for drinks if you don't build them some tenders? Most of the game the PT crews have nothing to do, so you may as well give them a place in which to do it. [;)]



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