RE: Oh no, another seniors master thesis game! (Full Version)

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bluemonday -> RE: Oh no, another seniors master thesis game! (7/2/2005 3:30:06 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

quote:

Is it true that there is a significant portion of gamers with no printer?


I have no printer either. Had no use for one or need until "direct download" "jewel case" BS started to appear.

That sounds like you only have the computer for gaming - I assumed people would have a printer for work (or for school if they are students).



wodin -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:13:06 AM)

Problem?

Easy, its ease of use for a start. print it yourself then you have countless A4 pages lying around. Buy more games from MAtrix the next minute you have endless amounts of A4.

Take to a printer shop they charge a ridiculous amount to have it printed in a book format thus adding a fair bit to the price of the game. Result, money spent on what should really come with a boxed copy.

If Matrix mainly dlet with say FPS or even RTS games then fair enough. Manuals on a whole dont need to be read. Wargames a manual is essential.

Matrix say they need to sort out a deal with regards to printing manuals. I want to know how they printed of a boardgame?



goodwoodrw -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:37:39 AM)

Hey guys, look on the bright side of things, if this game only come with a bright glossy manual, u wouldn't be complaining cos wouldn't have the game, cos the manual would be still at the printers. I too was a printed manual fan, but u gotta weigh up the good with the bad, decide u can't drop an electronric manual in the bath water [;)]



ravinhood -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:44:22 AM)

quote:

decide u can't drop an electronric manual in the bath water


Sure can if you're reading the pdf on a notebook in the bath. hehe



ravinhood -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:46:07 AM)

It gives me a brainstorm for a new product though, who wants to fund it, need a couple mil should tide me over. hehe

But, how about a pocket pdf manual machine? Does nothing but hold pdf files you can take anywere and read anytime and will have a magnifying feature so you can easily read the manul from the pocket pdf unit? Would work in the bathroom or in the bed easily don't you think? ;)



wodin -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:46:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

It gives me a brainstorm for a new product though, who wants to fund it, need a couple mil should tide me over. hehe

But, how about a pocket pdf manual machine? Does nothing but hold pdf files you can take anywere and read anytime and will have a magnifying feature so you can easily read the manul from the pocket pdf unit? Would work in the bathroom or in the bed easily don't you think? ;)


Fantastic Idea!

Get to it Batman.



ravinhood -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:52:24 AM)

Remember you read it first here if I ever need any witnesses it was my idea first. If the future of gaming is online direct download, then a pocket pdf reader is going to be necessary. ;) Woot I'm gonna be rich haha



goodwoodrw -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:54:18 AM)

How about a water proof screen to attach to your memory stick.



Hard Sarge -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:54:56 AM)

Well so far, I am liking the Game

don't understand or follow most of what is going on so far, but have read a little and am working on getting a feel for it then getting the info that I need

Battles can be strange, did a Charge with my Cav, do 4 and take 6, do another charge the next round and do 2400 and take 20, do another charge and do 2 and take 12

but over all, looks to be a very Detailed game, hassle is learning the details :)

think it really needs some Training Campaigns

overall, looks vrey good

HARD_Sarge



ravinhood -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:00:06 AM)

Heh I can't wait till I see what the socalled professional reviewers rate this game. I'll bet yah a nickel to a $ that it gets low scores on most sites because of it's complex and need to "read the manual". lol Most of the youngster reviewers don't like to read a manual, they want a game they can jump right into without having to use their brains much.



sol_invictus -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:15:54 AM)

I'm afraid you are right Ravinhood. I can imagine the comments in PC Gamer.



november -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:16:24 AM)

Couple of impressions. (I got the alt+tab to work so thats good.)

Played 2 hands-off campaigns (more or less) while I read the manual. As Spain I watched my ally France force Austria and Russia to sue for peace. France's glory was about 400 of the needed 1000.

Then, as France's army was spread out all over, England invaded northern France. She captured several provinces and then *France* was forced to the peace table. France's glory was cut in half. England had about 300 and I had a little less than her's (don't know how).

Then it was Spain's turn. England invaded and I lost a scribbled detail battle and called it quits.

In my second game as Sweden, the same thing happened. France forced Austria and Russia to the peace table for mucho glory. England invaded but this time she was repulsed. Then it was Denmark's turn to feel the French boot. I came next. This time the detail battle was a little closer. I even thought I had routed the superior French forces at one point, but it wasn't to be. So I called it day.

So far it looks very good. The strategic game reminds me of a Paradox game (that's good). And the detail battles seem surprisingly good--better than Imperial Glory's.



bluemonday -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:51:30 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

Heh I can't wait till I see what the socalled professional reviewers rate this game. I'll bet yah a nickel to a $ that it gets low scores on most sites because of it's complex and need to "read the manual". lol Most of the youngster reviewers don't like to read a manual, they want a game they can jump right into without having to use their brains much.

Two of the three reviewers for the major PC game magazines likely to review this game are almost 40. The other is over 50.



bluemonday -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:52:45 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

I'm afraid you are right Ravinhood. I can imagine the comments in PC Gamer.

You think Mark H. Walker won't like this game because it's not easy enough? Are you serious?



Hanal -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:52:50 AM)

Well I am enjoying the game very much as I continue to learn all that there is to know, and believe me, if you want maximum enjoyment from the game, you must read the manual carefully, so keep and extra copy in the bathroom.....[;)]..I am playing Sweden as my get acquainted nation as I think it makes learning the game easier...

The short violin pieces become a bit mundane, so I will toss some Beethoven, Berlioz, and Gossec into the music folder..I believe if I label them msc##.wma they will queue up on the playlist....

And this game is not very work place friendly as it is not easy to minimize the game (sometimes Alt-Tab works, sometimes not) and you cannot save the game during tactical battles....[:D]

All in all an excellent job!



dpazuk -> My Two Cents (7/2/2005 7:12:27 AM)

So far I am very impressed!

I started on Normal difficulty (the difficulity settings are MANY). After getting my but kicked on "Normal" I am amazed at the beta testers who were able to play and win on 'Nappy' difficulty level! [&o]

I am sure I will be able to do better as I learn the optimal strategies, etc, but the A.I. appears to be very challenging.

The game itself, is, in a word, deep.

For example, the diplomatic options you are presented with, from building your own treaties to the number of things you can do with your diplomatic units are, dare I say, staggering! Simply the most detailed diplomatic model I have ever encountered in any strategy game, period!

I have yet to explore the detailed combat, preferring to let my 'tactical' advisor move my men around. So I won't comment on that, suffice is to say from what I have read so far, it is very detailed. Someone mentioned SSI Battles of Napoleon, and I agree this is the closest I have come to that. Which is great! That was one heck of a game!

Downside:

I have experienced one bug so far, a CTD that occured during detailed combat after about 10 to 15 minutes. From the support section, you will see that it is occuring on a variety of different PC configs.

As this is version 1.00 of the game itself, this is to be expected and I am sure we will see a fix to this (and other bugs once discovered) with the first patch.

With the auto-save feature, this is not a game breaker however, so don't be discouraged by it.

Thats it for now!



sol_invictus -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 8:15:53 AM)

I'm just making a general comment on what I expect the mass gaming press to come up with. The game is a bit overwhelming when you first start but I like that. Makes me remember the days of my youth when I first started reading the manual for Third Reich.[;)] This game is destined to be a classic.

I agree dpazuk, the diplomatic options are staggereing. I only played a few detailed battles tonight, but the AI seems damn good on Normal level even. It outflanked my line to get at my artillery, forcing me to react to it's agressive maneuvers. I can't remember the last time I had to do that against an AI. If you get lazy; which most AIs let you get away with, it will pounce on you. After a patch or two, I can see myself playing this game years from now.



Queeg -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 9:10:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

Battles can be strange, did a Charge with my Cav, do 4 and take 6, do another charge the next round and do 2400 and take 20, do another charge and do 2 and take 12



I'm having trouble there too. I see numbers drifting above my guys and the bad guys during battle, which I assume are their respective casualties taken. But they do seem to vary wildly from round to round, even as between two infantry units that don't do anything but just trade shots at each other, and I'm having a hard time figuring out why.

Help?



Ralegh -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 10:27:35 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Queeg

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

Battles can be strange, did a Charge with my Cav, do 4 and take 6, do another charge the next round and do 2400 and take 20, do another charge and do 2 and take 12



I'm having trouble there too. I see numbers drifting above my guys and the bad guys during battle, which I assume are their respective casualties taken. But they do seem to vary wildly from round to round, even as between two infantry units that don't do anything but just trade shots at each other, and I'm having a hard time figuring out why.

Help?


There are lots of rational explanations for what you have described: for example:

In the first round, teh unit had used most of its movement point already, so it did less damage. (damage is proportional to unused movement points).
In the second round, it did full damage, and gor fatigued.
By the third round, they were tired and less effective.

There are other poosibilities. Note also that it is possible to do a 'critical hit' which does much more damage than usual. Eric actually modelled the casualty rates on real data, not just a made up bell curve!



nukkxx5058 -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 10:52:02 AM)

quote:

But, how about a pocket pdf manual machine? Does nothing but hold pdf files you can take anywere and read anytime and will have a magnifying feature so you can easily read the manul from the pocket pdf unit? Would work in the bathroom or in the bed easily don't you think? ;)




hummm sorry but it already exist. It is called electronic-books reader... the good new is that you can order one to read your e-manuals :-)

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-handle-form/002-2274619-2853665

It usualy also read mp3's ....




Franz von G -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 2:10:34 PM)

I'm impressed too, this is a great game that will make history for the genre..

I'm playing a 1796 with Spain, i have 400 hp (first, with France 2nd at 380 and Russia 3rd at 250) Papacy and Portugal are under my protection, and i'm actually at war with the Turkish Empire in Morocco.. the rest of Europe in in flame, war on all fronts..
i must return to my campaign now, some turks are waiting for me [;)]

GJ Matrix/Westciv![&o]



ASHBERY76 -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 3:37:20 PM)

My first impression is E.U II on steroids.Time to read the manual.



Naomi -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 3:49:54 PM)

It's not quite necessary to get every page printed; 18 pages came out of my ink-jet, and on a couple of sheets I copied the statistics (scattered over the manuel) with my own hands.



Titanwarrior89 -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 3:53:31 PM)

Excellent game! It will be a classic. Hats off to the guys that put this thing together. As for the manual, it would be nice too have one but I would rather have the game now.

Besides if it had a printed manual some people would be bitching about the price of the game then.[:D]



Naomi -> RE: First Impressions here please. (7/2/2005 4:06:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

I may purchase this game. I dont own a Napoleonic game but this sounds very interesting indeed.

Please post your first impressions and convince me that its worth buying when the boxed version comes out[;)][:D]


It's worth a purchase (if you like the feeling of being a student that is told to read heavily and memorise lots of figures). :p



Mr. Z -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 5:47:01 PM)


quote:

I'm having trouble there too. I see numbers drifting above my guys and the bad guys during battle, which I assume are their respective casualties taken. But they do seem to vary wildly from round to round, even as between two infantry units that don't do anything but just trade shots at each other, and I'm having a hard time figuring out why.

Casualties vary according to a number of factors (fire combat and charge combat modifiers are listed in detail in the "Detailed Combat" section of the manual). Changing morale can significantly affect casualties (morale tends to drop after receiving damage.)
Formation also significantly affects casualties (did you see whether they changed formation from column to square, for example?) Flanking is also significant. Type of unit vs. type of unit (heavy cavalry vs. light infantry, regular cavalry vs. regular cavalry, etc.) is also important. Terrain is also important. Facing is also important.

If, on the other hand, you have one isolated unit attacking another isolated unit, and neither one moves, and the next round you perform the very same attack against the very same unit with the very same facings in the very same formations, and you notice that the morales of each unit has not changed significantly, and the casualties are still wildly off from attack to attack, please let us know--we'd like to look into that sort of thing. Thanks!



bluemonday -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:37:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

I'm just making a general comment on what I expect the mass gaming press to come up with.

No, you're actually making a very specific comment about the likely reaction of one magazine (PC Gamer) with a staff wargame writer who has been reviewing wargames for over a decade and has designed his own boardgame (Lock 'n' Load).



Banquet -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:49:18 PM)

There is a US PC Gamer and a UK PC Gamer.. there may well be PC Gamers in other countries too. I don't believe the writers for the UK and US mags are the same so you may be talking about a different reviewer.



sol_invictus -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:58:14 PM)

bluemonday, of course you are correct; I should not have mentioned a specific source when it wasn't my intent to criticise that source. I have subscribed to PC Gamer for years so that was just the first example that came to my mind to represent the mass media as a whole. I do disagree with PC Gamer reviews quite often though and would not be surprised about what types of reviews CoG receives. This game requires a real commitment and effort; something that most gamers aren't willing to invest in, imo. I hope I'm both surprised and proven wrong.



bluemonday -> RE: print costs (7/2/2005 6:58:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Banquet

There is a US PC Gamer and a UK PC Gamer.. there may well be PC Gamers in other countries too. I don't believe the writers for the UK and US mags are the same so you may be talking about a different reviewer.

If he was referring to UKPCG then my apologies.



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