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RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/28/2005 9:26:41 PM   
Admiral DadMan


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quote:

An argument is, to quote the Monty Python sketch, "a connected series of statements to establish a definite proposition."



< Message edited by Admiral DadMan -- 12/28/2005 10:12:48 PM >

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Post #: 61
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/28/2005 9:45:21 PM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline 		My personal favorite is the fallacy of Irrelevant Conclusion.

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Post #: 62
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 12:06:05 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		Go figure.....

quote:

ORIGINAL: irrelevant

My personal favorite is the fallacy of Irrelevant Conclusion.



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(in reply to tsimmonds)
Post #: 63
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 2:36:03 AM   
Buck Beach

 

Posts: 1973
Joined: 6/25/2000
From: Upland,CA,USA
Status: offline 		Shame on him.

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 64
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 2:25:34 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Are you speaking for yourself?


Also quilty as charged !!

(in reply to Tristanjohn)
Post #: 65
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 10:00:20 PM   
doktorblood


Posts: 648
Joined: 2/14/2003
Status: offline 		My favourite part of reasonable arguement comes in 339 BC, after Athenians vote 280-221 that Sokrates is guilty of impiety. During deliberations about what his fine should be, Sokrates' "reasonble arguements" pissed off the Athenians so bad that they voted 441-60 to just kill him in lieu of a fine!

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Post #: 66
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 11:00:04 PM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: doktorblood

My favourite part of reasonable arguement comes in 339 BC, after Athenians vote 280-221 that Sokrates is guilty of impiety. During deliberations about what his fine should be, Sokrates' "reasonble arguements" pissed off the Athenians so bad that they voted 441-60 to just kill him in lieu of a fine!


Yes, That tends to happen when you tell people they're not real smart.

    Moral: If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.





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Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

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Post #: 67
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 11:08:43 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
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quote:

Moral: If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.


...



-F-

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Post #: 68
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/29/2005 11:46:00 PM   
Mynok


Posts: 12108
Joined: 11/30/2002
Status: offline 		I'm baffled that pasternakski hasn't showed up yet.......

< Message edited by Mynok -- 12/29/2005 11:47:20 PM >

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 69
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/30/2005 1:42:43 AM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline 		You're not paying strict attention. Our good friend has already generously contributed a ditty and some other choice remarks.

    (havepatiencemysonandheshallcomeagain)

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Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to Mynok)
Post #: 70
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/30/2005 1:52:33 AM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mynok

I'm baffled that pasternakski hasn't showed up yet.......

I'm trying to be nice to TJ. He's not only my pal, he's my hero. Just read what he has to say, believe it, make the sign of the "T" on your abdomen, and thank Ford that no one put alcohol in your decanting jar...

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to Mynok)
Post #: 71
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/30/2005 2:07:00 AM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline 		     (soendeththelesson)


_____________________________

Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to pasternakski)
Post #: 72
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/30/2005 3:35:06 AM   
Banquet

 

Posts: 1184
Joined: 8/23/2002
From: England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Not that you would or could appreciate that, but as long as we're pointing out "niceties" today. . . .

© Tristanjohn News Syndicate 2005




Ah, TJ is back. The wandering eye of the preacher man once more casts his gaze in our direction..

We lucky few..




(in reply to Tristanjohn)
Post #: 73
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/30/2005 8:19:26 PM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline 		Yeah, it's often "me against them" as it were, and you wanna know something? All things considered I kinda like it that way.

_____________________________

Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to Banquet)
Post #: 74
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/30/2005 8:44:54 PM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Yeah, it's often "me against them" as it were, and you wanna know something? All things considered I kinda like it that way.


Hi, That needed no admission on your part. We kinda figured that out months ago.

_____________________________






I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

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Post #: 75
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 2:10:14 AM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mogami


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Yeah, it's often "me against them" as it were, and you wanna know something? All things considered I kinda like it that way.


Hi, That needed no admission on your part. We kinda figured that out months ago.


If so (and I strongly doubt you comprehend the "why" of that dynamic) that might well be one of the few things "you" figured out months ago, for as far as I can tell the same silly arguments are still being forwarded to support the same silly points of view around here held by the same old crowd, almost as if education were a dirty word.



_____________________________

Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to mogami)
Post #: 76
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 5:15:41 AM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
almost as if education were a dirty word.

It's not? I mean, in the 21st century, it's not?

Shoot. I thought self-actualization and globalized values (not to mention using "-ize" words, which are so much fun, and convey so much meaning) were the only clean things we had.

Congratulations, my friend, on knowing when to use the hypothetical mood verb form. There can't be more than 10,000 users of the English language who remember that (and far fewer know why it matters).

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to Tristanjohn)
Post #: 77
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 6:21:05 AM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
almost as if education were a dirty word.

It's not? I mean, in the 21st century, it's not?

Shoot. I thought self-actualization and globalized values (not to mention using "-ize" words, which are so much fun, and convey so much meaning) were the only clean things we had.

Congratulations, my friend, on knowing when to use the hypothetical mood verb form. There can't be more than 10,000 users of the English language who remember that (and far fewer know why it matters).


It seemed when I was growing up that about half of all sentences started with "Ummm. . . ." Nowadays I hear "Obviously. . . " preface about half of all sentences," with an occasional "Ummm--obviously . . ." sprinkled in, possibly just to break the boredom, possibly to encourage the optimists out here to believe at least some people have not totally neglected their history.



_____________________________

Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to pasternakski)
Post #: 78
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 6:11:13 PM   
Skyros


Posts: 1570
Joined: 9/29/2000
From: Columbia SC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn


quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
almost as if education were a dirty word.

It's not? I mean, in the 21st century, it's not?

Shoot. I thought self-actualization and globalized values (not to mention using "-ize" words, which are so much fun, and convey so much meaning) were the only clean things we had.

Congratulations, my friend, on knowing when to use the hypothetical mood verb form. There can't be more than 10,000 users of the English language who remember that (and far fewer know why it matters).


It seemed when I was growing up that about half of all sentences started with "Ummm. . . ." Nowadays I hear "Obviously. . . " preface about half of all sentences," with an occasional "Ummm--obviously . . ." sprinkled in, possibly just to break the boredom, possibly to encourage the optimists out here to believe at least some people have not totally neglected their history.



You forgot, Like you know...like she said...like I was going to do that!

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Post #: 79
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 8:36:26 PM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
It seemed when I was growing up that about half of all sentences started with "Ummm. . . ." Nowadays I hear "Obviously. . . " preface about half of all sentences," with an occasional "Ummm--obviously . . ." sprinkled in, possibly just to break the boredom, possibly to encourage the optimists out here to believe at least some people have not totally neglected their history.

Ah, yes, the poor man's offhand citation to authority. "Obviously we could of won in Vietnam if we wanted to."

As an undergraduate, I used to enjoy the rich man's offhand citation to authority, uttered by a professorial type (not always a professor), starting with "Clearly," and containing a fluttering hand gesture reminiscent of the one used by those slutty-looking models on "The Price Is Right" presenting merchandise for bids (but, clearly, that's another story). The best one I ever heard, though, was in law school:

"Clearly," (fluttering hand gesture) law is an interpenetrating medley of social and cultural medians and mores without specific design, but exacting particular effect, on the sociocultural environment in which they, and it, exist, evolve, and are applied to arising and emergent issues."

There were dozens of people in the room, and not one had thought to bring a gun that day.

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to Tristanjohn)
Post #: 80
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 9:06:43 PM   
scout1


Posts: 2899
Joined: 8/24/2004
From: South Bend, In
Status: offline 		Apparently, this thread has NOTHING to do with dealing with a woman. Logic and Reasonable Argument will get you about as far as is did Sokrates. May be considered sexist, but it IS based on experience .....

(in reply to pasternakski)
Post #: 81
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 9:58:45 PM   
Skyros


Posts: 1570
Joined: 9/29/2000
From: Columbia SC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

The best one I ever heard, though, was in law school:



Oh how this explains so much

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Post #: 82
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 11:33:24 PM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: scout1

Apparently, this thread has NOTHING to do with dealing with a woman. Logic and Reasonable Argument will get you about as far as is did Sokrates. May be considered sexist, but it IS based on experience .....


You'll find no argument here.



_____________________________

Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to scout1)
Post #: 83
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 11:35:15 PM   
Tristanjohn


Posts: 3027
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Daly City CA USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Skyros


quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski

The best one I ever heard, though, was in law school:



Oh how this explains so much


We don't really want to go there, do we?



_____________________________

Regarding Frank Jack Fletcher: They should have named an oiler after him instead. -- Irrelevant

(in reply to Skyros)
Post #: 84
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 12/31/2005 11:58:54 PM   
ctangus


Posts: 2153
Joined: 10/13/2005
From: Boston, Mass.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
almost as if education were a dirty word.


Congratulations, my friend, on knowing when to use the hypothetical mood verb form. There can't be more than 10,000 users of the English language who remember that (and far fewer know why it matters).


I despair that the subjunctive be taught once again.

(in reply to pasternakski)
Post #: 85
RE: Logic and Reasonable Argument - 1/1/2006 2:18:25 AM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ctangus

quote:

ORIGINAL: pasternakski


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn
almost as if education were a dirty word.


Congratulations, my friend, on knowing when to use the hypothetical mood verb form. There can't be more than 10,000 users of the English language who remember that (and far fewer know why it matters).


I despair that the subjunctive be taught once again.

Don't make me pull the pluperfect out on ya, son.

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to ctangus)
Post #: 86
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