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Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 5:40:12 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		Question: What strategy do players use to protect the Empire against the submarine menace? Specifically:

*Best use of Aircraft. You get alot of float planes, Jakes set on ASW at 1000 feet, is that the way to go? Is there another aircraft that works better on ASW?
*I've been creating ASW TF's consisting of 1 DD and PC/PG's, the DD so her captain can be the TF leader. Even so, we've hit several subs but never sank any. Typical?
*I get that you should use irregular convoy routes and large convoys to minimize the damage
*Embed an AV in a large convoy with planes set to ASW

Anything else to add?

Thanks in advance!
Post #: 1
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 5:50:46 PM   
niceguy2005


Posts: 12523
Joined: 7/4/2005
From: Super secret hidden base
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Question: What strategy do players use to protect the Empire against the submarine menace? Specifically:

*Best use of Aircraft. You get alot of float planes, Jakes set on ASW at 1000 feet, is that the way to go? Is there another aircraft that works better on ASW?
*I've been creating ASW TF's consisting of 1 DD and PC/PG's, the DD so her captain can be the TF leader. Even so, we've hit several subs but never sank any. Typical?
*I get that you should use irregular convoy routes and large convoys to minimize the damage
*Embed an AV in a large convoy with planes set to ASW

Anything else to add?

Thanks in advance!

I'm an Allied player, but have some general ideas.

1. Planes set on ASW do very little unless pilot skill is well over 75, usually over 80 is needed. Even so, results are less than spectacular
2. More important than a TF leader being a captain well be the TF leaders agrressiveness rating.
3. Use planes set to Nav Search to spot the subs and then vector in ASW TFs.
4. APDs are some of Japan's best sub killers. Use them in areas of high sub threat. Let your DDs be convoy escorts.
5. AV or CS are good at spotting subs, but not at attacking them
6. For important convoys include a sepearte ASW TF set to follow the convoy with an aggressive leader. It will seek out and attack allied subs BEFORE they get a chance to attack the convoy, at least sometimes.
7. Yes it is common to not get a lot of kills as a percentage of engagements but if you apply good tactics you will get a lot of engagements.

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Post #: 2
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 6:07:56 PM   
Rob Brennan UK


Posts: 3685
Joined: 8/24/2002
From: London UK
Status: offline 		High exp sally and helens make horrible ASW weapons for the allies as the bombload hurts when it hits.

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sorry for the spelling . English is my main language , I just can't type . and i'm too lazy to edit :)

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Post #: 3
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 6:57:15 PM   
VSWG


Posts: 3432
Joined: 5/31/2006
From: Germany
Status: offline 		Have a look at section II.C here:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=1274014




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Post #: 4
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 8:06:40 PM   
wild_Willie2


Posts: 2934
Joined: 10/8/2004
From: Arnhem (holland) yes a bridge to far...
Status: offline 		My best ASW teams consist of 2-3 jap APD's with good captains (high naval rating) lead by a VERY high exp DD with an high XP and agressive leader (can be without depht charges, as it is just there for it's detection level)


Put 1 or 2 ASW equipt PG's with good EXP and good captains in the mix, and you have a KILLER ASW force...

Use recon planes to spot subs, and then send in the ASW forces to kill it...  

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In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is strength, in water there are bacteria.

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Post #: 5
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 8:34:45 PM   
Xargun

 

Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004
From: Near Columbus, Ohio
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: wild_Willie2
Use recon planes to spot subs, and then send in the ASW forces to kill it...  


Exactly.. Don't rely on your ASW planes to kill subs... Just use them to detect the sub. A detected sub is less effective. And if you spot the sub and have some free ASW ships nearby, send em in. Even if you don't damage / kill the sub, if you engage it the chances of it engaging anything else (besides your ASW TF) is very slim for that turn. So use it and sneak the merchies by.

Xargun


(in reply to wild_Willie2)
Post #: 6
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/11/2006 8:34:59 PM   
Nemo121


Posts: 5821
Joined: 2/6/2004
Status: offline 		Personally I think the most efficient way to run your ASW as Japan is as follows:

1. Single ship accompanying each convoy ( I tend to go for smaller more frequent convoys than some).

2. ALL floatplanes set to ASW missions at choke points and near bases which are frequented by subs ( there shouldn't be many of these if your opponent knows what he is doing).

3. The instant a bomber daitai or sentai isn't require somewhere it should transfer and begin conducting ASW missions.

4. Hunter-killer fleets comprising 1-2 APD groups and 3 to 4 PC/SC groups with a CS loaded for ASW work.

With the land-based ASW to spot anything close to shore and the HK Fleet with CS spotting and prosecuting anything a bit farther from shore enemy subs are very quickly found and prosecuted effectively. It does mean taking risks elsewhere but it allows one to conduct sweeps and act aggressively in what is, otherwise, a very passive and unwinnable matter.

(in reply to wild_Willie2)
Post #: 7
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 11/29/2006 12:33:38 PM   
huggarn

 

Posts: 37
Joined: 12/29/2005
Status: offline 		I found out that dive bombers (I like ANN best) with 75XP or more is the best way at choke points. They do a lot of damage.

And in the begin of the war only the APD makes a difference later on your newer PC will rock, but always put one or two ASW in the task force because the AI tends to go for the ASW instead of the PC. Same goes for the APD TF.

(in reply to Nemo121)
Post #: 8
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 12/5/2006 4:55:02 PM   
BlackVoid


Posts: 639
Joined: 10/17/2003
Status: offline 		Those APDs are great! Most have an ASW value of 10. What I do is I organize my ASW groups around a DD + an APD. Then add more PC/MSW/PG types to the TF. Good leaders also help a lot. Of course having a lot of AC on ASW at 1000 helps a lot in spotting those subs.
I also like to add an AV ship to important convoys and set all planes to ASW.

< Message edited by BlackVoid -- 12/5/2006 5:04:01 PM >

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Post #: 9
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 12/5/2006 5:58:59 PM   
Mynok


Posts: 12108
Joined: 11/30/2002
Status: offline
I don't use DDs for ASW as they are too valuable. The APDs are absolutely great for such tasks however, as they are far too slow for actual Fast Transport duties.

Set lots of float planes and level bombers on Naval Search with an altitude 6000' or less. Don't use ASW Patrol.

ASW killer groups should be six ships: 1 APD with an aggressive captain and 5 PC/PG/MSW.

You won't sink a huge number, but you'll damage them and drive them off.....which is the whole idea.

Also, Sonia's are excellent ASW planes around Formosa. They have definitely sunk subs for me.


(in reply to BlackVoid)
Post #: 10
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 12/7/2006 12:06:31 AM   
2ndACR


Posts: 5665
Joined: 8/31/2003
From: Irving,Tx
Status: offline 		I use 80+ experience Helens and Lilly's for ASW work. I set them at 2,000 feet and DO use the ASW setting. RobBrennanUK knows how deadly they can be. I clobbered 4-6 of his subs in about 3 days time. I rarely use ASW groups, because in that game, subs are actually a rare thing right now. I get very few sighting reports, and they are not causing me any real trouble yet.

I know that the ASW setting does halve the range they can fly, but around any choke point, they are killers. Place 1 27 plane Helen group on each side a 3-4 hex choke point, and they will slaughter any who pass.

(in reply to Mynok)
Post #: 11
RE: Japanese Anti-Sub Strategies - 12/7/2006 7:26:48 AM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline 		One thing I noticed back in UV days is that aircraft set to ASW seem to keep the subs from performing their appointed tasks. I had very, very few losses to IJN subs in Torpedo Junction once I learned that.

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fair winds,
Brad

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Post #: 12
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