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RE: The real victory level of this game

 
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RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/26/2007 8:37:54 PM   
castor troy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696

Within the game, victory would be having the 1st Marine Division sitting unopposed in Tokyo for 15 turns.



I think this means then that only 1% of the Allied players would ever achieve victory... nearly no chance to win a land war in Japan IMO...

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Post #: 31
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/26/2007 8:52:14 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline
quote:

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696

Within the game, victory would be having the 1st Marine Division sitting unopposed in Tokyo for 15 turns.




I think this means then that only 1% of the Allied players would ever achieve victory... nearly no chance to win a land war in Japan IMO...


The irony being, I'm pretty sure DD696 is talking about victory vs. the AI (and his distaste for PBEM).

-F-

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Post #: 32
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/26/2007 9:32:17 PM   
Dino


Posts: 1032
Joined: 11/14/2005
From: Serbia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696

Within the game, victory would be having the 1st Marine Division sitting unopposed in Tokyo for 15 turns.

Victory within the forum would be to be allowed to play the game and comment upon it without having the constant harrassment of being told to play PBEM. You know, something like "liberty, justice and the pursuit of happiness for all, including AI players".


Are you developing a complex, Larry?






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Post #: 33
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/26/2007 9:51:20 PM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
Joined: 6/7/2001
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Status: offline 		Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dino





Kalimero!

To je prava pravcata nepravda!


Leo "Apollo11"

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Prior Preparation & Planning Prevents Pathetically Poor Performance!

A & B: WitW, WitE, WbtS, GGWaW, GGWaW2-AWD, HttR, CotA, BftB, CF
P: UV, WitP, WitP-AE

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Post #: 34
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/26/2007 10:22:09 PM   
okami


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Joined: 5/23/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696

Within the game, victory would be having the 1st Marine Division sitting unopposed in Tokyo for 15 turns.

Victory within the forum would be to be allowed to play the game and comment upon it without having the constant harrassment of being told to play PBEM. You know, something like "liberty, justice and the pursuit of happiness for all, including AI players".


Come over to the darkside, you know youwant to.

(in reply to DD696)
Post #: 35
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/26/2007 11:49:55 PM   
BrucePowers


Posts: 12094
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline 		I play both ways. They are both fun. Enjoy the way you play.

I won't harass you

(in reply to DD696)
Post #: 36
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/27/2007 12:03:05 AM   
Skyros


Posts: 1570
Joined: 9/29/2000
From: Columbia SC
Status: offline 		Why all this talk of “Winning” and “Losing” when we should be concentrating on the fact that we have purpose in our lives. We enjoy sitting before our computers, late in the evening cranking out “one more turn” before bed. We have lively interaction on the forums as we type away, alone, at our computers. Often we listen to our spouses complain as we take one more phone call from our opponent to rehash the last month of turns. Yes it is Joyful what we do. So let us not talk of “Winning” or “Losing” when we can talk of JOY.

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Post #: 37
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/28/2007 6:48:39 PM   
Ron Saueracker


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From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
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quote:

Merry Christmas Ron!

Well, the modeling of carrier battles in UV/WITP/WPO/AE would be a large and much different topic from "the real victory level of this game" topic of the current thread. So I'll start of a "Modeling of Carrier Battles" thread over in the design forum and we can discuss over there, ok!?

Joe Wilkerson


S'allright!

< Message edited by Ron Saueracker -- 12/28/2007 6:50:19 PM >

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Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

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Post #: 38
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/29/2007 2:09:13 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		As land team lead for AE I always get nervous when I see the Banner at the bottom of Rons posts.......

(in reply to Ron Saueracker)
Post #: 39
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/29/2007 2:46:24 AM   
jwilkerson


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Joined: 9/15/2002
From: Kansas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

As land team lead for AE I always get nervous when I see the Banner at the bottom of Rons posts.......


So are you worried about the girls, or the bartender or the bartender's drink!?




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New Game Project Lead

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Post #: 40
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/31/2007 1:06:18 PM   
Ron Saueracker


Posts: 12121
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From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

As land team lead for AE I always get nervous when I see the Banner at the bottom of Rons posts.......


Be afraid...be very afraid.


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Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

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Post #: 41
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/31/2007 1:53:11 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
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From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		The bartender....

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Post #: 42
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/31/2007 3:33:49 PM   
DD696

 

Posts: 964
Joined: 7/9/2004
From: near Savannah, Ga
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dino


quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696

Within the game, victory would be having the 1st Marine Division sitting unopposed in Tokyo for 15 turns.

Victory within the forum would be to be allowed to play the game and comment upon it without having the constant harrassment of being told to play PBEM. You know, something like "liberty, justice and the pursuit of happiness for all, including AI players".


Are you developing a complex, Larry?







No more so than any PBEM only player. So it is your opinion that the AI players should just pack up and leave - or just me since the "elitist PBEM" attitude really rubs me the wrong way and I think it to be fair that I be able to respond? Who would buy these games and provide the support they need in order to be commercially feasible if the AI players are no longer welcome?

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Post #: 43
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/31/2007 3:54:38 PM   
Mike Scholl

 

Posts: 9349
Joined: 1/1/2003
From: Kansas City, MO
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696
No more so than any PBEM only player. So it is your opinion that the AI players should just pack up and leave - or just me since the "elitist PBEM" attitude really rubs me the wrong way and I think it to be fair that I be able to respond? Who would buy these games and provide the support they need in order to be commercially feasible if the AI players are no longer welcome?



I don't understand your worry about what anybody else thinks or says. You only play the game with yourself and your computer..., so why should anyone elses viewpoint bother you? Just have fun playing it the way you want to play it. PBEMer's have to be social and active on the forum to find opponants---but you don't. If you don't like their "elitist" attitude, don't read their posts. You can "block" anyone you find annoying, but everyone should be welcome on the forum. Live and let live....

(in reply to DD696)
Post #: 44
RE: The real victory level of this game - 12/31/2007 4:33:48 PM   
treespider


Posts: 9796
Joined: 1/30/2005
From: Edgewater, MD
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005


quote:

ORIGINAL: trollelite

should be>

Japanese Victory: While allies get beated, get kicked out of the war, get a draw, get a moderate victor, or get anything if Japanese side remained alive after August, 1945

Draw: An allies decisive victory after June, 1944, before August, 1945

Allies Victory: An allies decisive victory before June,1944


This should reflects the true skill level of two sides. And this is only after applying strict HR restriction to allies side.

Allies so-called victory, except for a quick and decisive one, is meaningless, considering those vast resource they have.

If in those RTS games one's farmer could collect resource in a speed 4 or 5 times faster than others, he could always hope to win some sets, even others are with vastly superior skill, but such "victory" is of course hollowed, could prove nothing.

With the exception that VC are dependent on points, which I'm never a huge fan of in games, I think they are very well thought out.

This is a grognards game which means it isn't supposed to be complete fantasy. In real life a favorably negotiated peace was a reasonable VC for Japan. There is no way that would have ever been acceptable to the US...never. Why? They were pissed off and they knew they had the resources to crush Japan. Those resources in the game aren't made up. They actually existed. Japan was doomed the minute they attacked PH. The game accurately reflects this. However, how could being crushed a few months later than was historical be considered "a victory". IMO the only real victory for Japan in the game should be making the allied player want to give up, i.e. surrender.


This all presupposes a game in which the Japanese attack Pearl Harbor. The sneak attack generated a clear and definable cassus belli for the American Public. What happens if the Japanese don't attack Pearl Harbor? Or declare war then a week later attack Pearl Harbor? Do the Americans still enter the war with the zeal and fervor that Pearl Harbor caused? Would a negotiated peace have been plausible in that scenario?


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(in reply to niceguy2005)
Post #: 45
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