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GTA IV - 1/10/2009 11:28:55 AM

JudgeDredd

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From: Scotland
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In the vain attempt that anyone has installed this game, did anyone have any issues?

I bought it on Steam last night and when I installed and ran it this morning, the launcher process kicked in (I saw it in the Task Manager under processes) and then dropped out and I was back at the desktop (didn't actually leave the desktop.

When installing, I noticed it was installing C++ 2005 Redistributable...and that is something that seems to have caused issues with my EU III and Rome games.

Unfortunately, I've tried uninstalling and reinstalling the redistributables many times, to no avail.

Any ideas about getting GTA IV to start or even about C++ 2005 redistributables?

Post #: 1

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 1:45:33 PM

PunkReaper

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Joined: 8/23/2006
From: England
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you are just having a really bad time. You must have offended the Gods of gaming... Hope your gaming/computer experiences improve shortly or you may have to take up knitting. I am afraid I can't help as I bought it for the XBox 360... If you get it working I am sure you'll enjoy it though.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 2

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 3:51:22 PM

hadberz

Posts: 1629
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From: Moncks Corner, SC
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I not sure about the Steam version, but the dvd version needs Games for Windows Live and Rockstar Games Social Club to be installed and log in to both in order to play. My son installed the game so this is about all I know.

(in reply to PunkReaper)

Post #: 3

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 3:52:38 PM

killroyishere

Posts: 639
Joined: 4/23/2008
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I ran into issues after installing EU:Rome I think. It uses some advanced directx feature and I think it's having an effect on other games. It's either that or this .NetFramework or Securom. When you have so many different things on your system nowadays it's hard to pinpoint just what is causing the problems. Now I can't get 18 wheels of Steel Haulin to work anymore and it was working fine before .NetFramework was installed or maybe it was that EU:Rome enhanced directx or heck I don't know what.

Still haven't gotten Advanced Tactics to work either except after reinstalling it then it works one time then I get all kinds of errors and lockups and then I have to uninstall it again an again an again. I haven't heard a thing from Erik either on a refund. It's kind of funny how he jumps in all these other threads to suggest buying this game or that game, but, when you have a problem with one of them he's nowhere to be found. I guess I'll just have to make my own this game don't work thread to get his attention like the others have had to do. I'm really leaning heavily at just getting some console and forgetting pc gaming. It's gotten too costly and just bug ridden as hell lately. I'm used to games being buggy, but, it's just getting worse and worse and now they aren't even working at all when released and after patches even.

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Post #: 4

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 4:01:44 PM

JudgeDredd

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It is getting rather ridiculous now.

Too many different types of downloaders, too many different types of registration, unregistration, too many different types of sets of files required for different games, too many different types of DRM...it's an absolute minefield trying to figure out what the heck caused the problem.

I think I'm going to have to go for a reinstall. Damn and blast it.

(in reply to killroyishere)

Post #: 5

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 5:09:56 PM

Terminus

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Just awful. I'm DONE with Rockstar Games after this cluster****...

And I say this as someone who eventually got the verkackte thing to work. The port from console to PC has been REALLY poorly done, and coupled with all those hoops the game makes you jump through, it just isn't good enough.

< Message edited by Terminus -- 1/10/2009 5:13:39 PM >

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Post #: 6

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 5:14:33 PM

Terminus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: hadberz

I not sure about the Steam version, but the dvd version needs Games for Windows Live and Rockstar Games Social Club to be installed and log in to both in order to play. My son installed the game so this is about all I know.

You only need to log into Games for Windows Live. You can skip the Social Club login.

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Post #: 7

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 5:19:34 PM

leastonh1

Posts: 879
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From: West Yorkshire, England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus
You only need to log into Games for Windows Live. You can skip the Social Club login.

That's still one hoop too many for me. I'll pass.

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 8

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 5:26:04 PM

Terminus

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Believe me, that's not even the half of it. There's two or three other pieces of copy-protection garbage on that game as well.

I loathe it, but I'm going to finish it, out of spite. Then I'm going to spend a couple of days uninstalling all the garbage it put on my hard drive, and use the damn discs for coasters.

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

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Post #: 9

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 8:01:30 PM

JudgeDredd

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Well, for a start off, Steam doesn't even tell you you need Games for Windows Live to run it.

Secondly, now I managed to find a thread that tells you you need it (and provides a link) I've installed it, but it will not run. I click on it and get nothing.

I'm sure my system is porked anyway. In order to try and get Rome VV running, I've installed/uninstalled/reinstalled so many pieces of software, and alsoI've used Windows Restore several times too....I think it's a rebuild now, though I doubt I'll bother with GTA IV or Rome VV now. Ridiculous really. It is getting beyond a joke.

I'll get in touch with Steam. I guess seeing as I haven't been able to run it and therefore not read the EULA and (therefore) not had the ability to accept or refuse, then I should be allowed my money back (I'll wager otherwise though!)

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 10

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 10:37:44 PM

Arctic Blast

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JD : The GTA 4 release was a mess. Steam at one time was offering an exchange of it for any other game on their service because of the sheer number of complaints. It was a badly ported mess from what I've read.

And yeah, it needs Windows Live and Rockstar Social Club...except Rockstar Social Club makes it crash (or at least did), so now they say NOT to use it.

_____________________________

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Post #: 11

RE: GTA IV - 1/10/2009 11:17:59 PM

JudgeDredd

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Got no-one to blame but myself. Lack of investigation....again. I must have money to burn.....I've always steered clear of console ports, but I was quite taken with GTA San Andreas.

From what I gather, Steam are not giving refunds. Of all the companies, I do not understand why? They have the ability to revoke licences, remove access etc, etc and use that to attract publishers...but apparently they don't want to use their special capabilities to benefit the user.

That's a shame. I've bought maybe a dozen games through Steam and never had an issue with them.

I'm debating a fresh install of my OS anyway...I doubt that will fix GTA IV, but it should fix Rome VV. Funny thing is, when I was installing GTA IV, I saw a popup message where it was installing Microsoft C++ 2005 Redistributables and I thought "Bugger it"...'cos I'm pretty sure that's what's giving me the Rome VV errors (well, I know it's the C++ runtime error showing), so I knew pretty much off the bat that it wasn't going to work....unfortunately I had bought the game and went through the 4-5 hour download before knowing this.

(in reply to Arctic Blast)

Post #: 12

RE: GTA IV - 1/11/2009 4:49:50 AM

Hertston

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From: Cornwall, UK
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Well, for a start off, Steam doesn't even tell you you need Games for Windows Live to run it.

That's an insididious little bastard, that is. I bought Flatout Ultimate Carnage on Steam over Christmas for a bit of light-hearted chaos and destruction, which forces you to use it even when in SP. I then found that somehow it got triggered automatically, and seemingly unavoidably, in Fallout 3 as well (which previously gave you the choice to completely ignore it) which wouldn't be a huge issue except that then it stores your saved games elsewhere and doesn't recognise your old ones. I wasn't a happy chappy.

< Message edited by Hertston -- 1/11/2009 4:50:54 AM >

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 13

RE: GTA IV - 1/11/2009 9:58:44 AM

JudgeDredd

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Unfortunately, I think gone are the days when one can simple install and play. I remember doing the Falcon 4 dance many moons ago. Even that was different because that was to get the game to work regarding bugs...I'm talking here about games coming with 3rd party addons all the time!

Seems, it's rife in the market now.

One of the really annoying things...? I registered at Steam website (apparently your login for steam isn't the one to use for Steam support, even though I registered and used the same details!)...and when I completed registration, my request was waiting for mod verification...so I haven't been able to post on the forums about the problem.

you have to laugh at fiascos like this.

And before anyone jumps in and slaps my face with a wet fish because I was sticking up for AGEoD about World War 1, this is a completely different kettle of fish and it's exactly because of the problem I'm having at the moment that I stick up for companies like AGEoD. Rockstar games and Steam are much, much bigger than AGEoD and the developer of World War 1.

Rockstar games have the resources to try as many possible configurations as they can...alot more than the dev of WW1.

Steam have the ability to allow me a credit and not risk me having a game which I can play (as they can prevent your account from utilising that game) and therefore have the ability to offer me a refund or, at least, a credit to use on another game...they have offer niether option. AGEoD offered a refund for a broken game.

So whilst the outcome is the same (buying a game you cannot play), the approach by the relevant parties is completely different...and I would always like to think I give smaller developers and publishers bigger leeway than the big boys.

I'm seriously considering changing my hobby. I'm getting fedup moaning about broken games. (and I'm sure you lot are fedup hearing about them

)

(in reply to Hertston)

Post #: 14

RE: GTA IV - 1/11/2009 10:18:55 AM

Stridor

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Looks like the days of mandatory virtualization for the desktop are getting closer?

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Post #: 15

RE: GTA IV - 1/12/2009 6:37:50 AM

Valkyrie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Stridor

Looks like the days of mandatory virtualization for the desktop are getting closer?

I was going to respond but I have this darn bug crawling around on my screen. It seems to have gotten INSIDE somehow as I can't seem to squash it.. though I've tried....

_____________________________

Signature? Maybe someday over the rainbow.

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Post #: 16

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 10:25:16 AM

JudgeDredd

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Just wanted to update on this....

I have not played a single solitary second of this game...not one. It simply refuses to load on my computer. I've emailed Steam asking for a refund...here is the correspondance...

***************************
Message by ME
I spent over 4 hours downloading GTA IV last night and I have spent the best part of my entire Saturday trying to get the game to run, to no avail. I have searched teh Steam Forums, I have searched the Internet and I have searched Rockstar games.

I think I've wasted more than enough time trying to get it to run. I have not had access to the EULA and therefore not been able to read it, so as is my right, I refuse to accept the EULA and therefore do not accept ownership of the game.

Please can I have a refund for this game and have it removed from my games list.
***************************

***************************
Message by ME
I will ask again.

Please may I have a refund for GTA IV which I purchased on the 9th January 2009 and which I have not played a single second of.

The game simply will not work. I have spent the last week trying to find a resolution to no avail. I've tried a new install of a new OS (Vista) and get a different error...I have still not been able to start a game.

I have contacted Rockstar games but it appears they have taken the same approach as you...switch the lights off and pretend no-one is home.

You'll forgive my tone, but a week trying to get a game to run, a new drive, a new operating system (although I was going to move to Vista anyway) and not one single second of gameplay.

I know you state no refunds...but you can see, from my account, that I'm not asking for a refund because I don't like the game. You can see from my account that I have been unable to play it at all. So please can I have a refund...no game is worth this amount of hassle and stress.
***************************

***************************
Message by STEAM
Hello,

Thank you for contacting Steam Support.

As with most software products, we do not offer refunds or exchanges for purchases made online as outlined in the software license - please review Section 4 of the Steam Subscriber Agreement for more information.

Under some circumstances, we offer a refund for pre-orders, where the refund is requested prior to the release date of the game.

Steam Subscriber Agreement
http://www.steampowered.com/index.php?area=subscriber_agreement

Technical support for this title is handled by a third party support department - please follow the link below for instructions to contact the support provider for this title:

Title: Grand Theft Auto IV
Link: http://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=2485-QWOX-6314
***************************

***************************
Message by ME
Well thank you very much for that standard response.

Clearly it's against the law to sell something which is broken and, as you know well, I have not been able to play a single second of this game.

The issue is between you and I, not Rockstar Games. I know it's their pos, but it's you I paid the money to, therefore it's you my contract is with.

If you refuse a refund, knowing full well I haven't even been able to view the EULA for the game (that is another illegal issue...I refuse to abide by the EULA because I have been unable to read it, therefore I am fully entitled to a refund), I will contact my credit card company and revoke payment. We can then settle this in court at your leisure.

If that fails, it will be the last you see of my custom and I will do everything in my power to make sure people understand how their rights are being flouted by some corporate legal jargon which tramples on the individuals rights as a consumer.

You sold me a broken product. I would like a refund please.
***************************

I've uninstalled/reinstalled/rebooted/installed new OS/new harddrive for new OS.....1 week of trying to get the game to run, and Steam's response? To point me to the Terms and Conditions where they state no refunds....a point I had already conceded in my initial post to them. Arrogant?

Anyway, I'm done with Steam. I will use the games I've bought from them, but will buy nothing using there system anymore. If they want to hide behind the "oh...it's not our fault...and if it is, we have covered our arses", then that's fine.

They know fine and well I have been unable to play that game. It isn't like I want a refund because I don't like it. They can look at my account and see I haven't played a single second of it...and still they throw the T&C in your face.

Just informing you people. You are clearly individuals and can do as you please.

(in reply to Valkyrie)

Post #: 17

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 10:36:37 AM

leastonh1

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Hmmm. They must be breaking the law by stating "no refunds", especially as you haven't even agreed to the EULA!!! It's an absolute disgrace, but sadly typical.

I won't use Steam on principle after having my fingers burnt with a couple of games and crap service from Valve when I politely asked for help. Not to mention the fact that I find it quite disturbing that they have full control over the games I have bought and installed, I can't manually download and install patches and worst of all, they can log when and for how long I use certain software on my PC. If a game is on Steam, it will never see my PC!

So, that's one other person who's boycotting them.

Jim

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 18

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 11:17:28 AM

Phatguy

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You know, since you havent been able to play access the game and therefore access the EULA you just might be able to file a suit in small claims court in your juristiction. It might cost you less than 50 bucks to file but you should do it just to see what will happen.

(in reply to leastonh1)

Post #: 19

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 11:30:58 AM

PunkReaper

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From: England
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Go get them JD I'm sick of broken games and no refunds. It sounds like you have a real chance at this one

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Post #: 20

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 12:22:20 PM

Terminus

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If by "real chance", you mean "no chance at all", we agree...

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Post #: 21

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 12:56:33 PM

JudgeDredd

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Unfortunately, I think T is correct. Guess I'll have to bite the bullet and respond by holding back my money

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Post #: 22

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 1:18:01 PM

leastonh1

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From: West Yorkshire, England
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I read things like this and think of the rip offs I and others I know have been subjected to by online sellers and it makes me even happier to spend my money with the likes of Matrix.

At least I'm safe in the knowledge that in the rare event of encountering a problem, I can speak to someone directly about it and get an individual response. No stock answers, bs or quoting T&C's just to dig in. It's good to know there still are organisations out there with decency, honesty and integrity.

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 23

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 3:48:59 PM

JudgeDredd

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From: Scotland
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Thinking about it, Regardless of the EULA, I did read their T&C, and so knew there was no refund...so I had the option to continue with my purchase or walk away. I guess that's what would stand up in court.

There again, I wasn't aware I was buying something that was broken....so I don't know.

(in reply to leastonh1)

Post #: 24

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 3:58:36 PM

leastonh1

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From: West Yorkshire, England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Thinking about it, Regardless of the EULA, I did read their T&C, and so knew there was no refund...so I had the option to continue with my purchase or walk away. I guess that's what would stand up in court.

There again, I wasn't aware I was buying something that was broken....so I don't know.

Do they have to abide by distance selling regs or UK Sale of Goods Act? I suspect not, but if so, they've got no choice. Goods must be as advertised, work as described and be of merchantable quality. So, if they sell you software which doesn't work on your PC which DOES match their minimum specs and the PC can be shown to run other, similar software, they cannot argue the toss. Then again, I'm no solicitor and might be talking complete rubbish! Maybe I'm wrong and different rules do apply, but under UK law afaik you're entitled to a refund, exchange or credit note for goods which don't match these criteria. Your choice, not theirs.

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

(in reply to JudgeDredd)

Post #: 25

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 4:37:01 PM

JudgeDredd

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Well, I just found this on the Trading Standards Institute - UK European Consumer Centre

***************
Sale of Goods Act 1979
Covers all contracts made by consumers when purchasing goods, consumers are given full rights under this Act in all circumstances, these rights cannot be restricted by the terms and conditions of the contract.
Consumers can expect that goods will be:
�         As described. Goods provided must conform to any description applied to them; this description can be made verbally or in writing.
�         Of a satisfactory quality. Satisfactory quality means that the product should be of a quality that a reasonable person would expect from the goods taking into account any description, the intended purpose and the price that is paid.
�         Fit for the purpose made known. If a consumer intends to purchase goods to use for a specific purpose other than that which it is intended and this is made known to the seller, then the goods should be suitable for that purpose.

Generally a consumer can claim a repair or replacement of the goods if they become faulty or do not conform to the contract, if this is not possible or not economical the consumer can look to claim a full or partial refund. If the consumer notices the fault, misdescription or unsuitability quick enough after the purchase then they may be able to reject the goods for a full refund.

If second-hand goods are being purchased the purchaser must take into account the age, condition and price of the product. Consumers get the same rights when purchasing second-hand goods unless a fault is related to reasonable wear and tear or they are made aware of any faults before purchase.
***************

Again, it may well not be relevant, but I've responded quoting it anyway.

(in reply to leastonh1)

Post #: 26

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 6:07:33 PM

PunkReaper

Posts: 1085
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From: England
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Try ringing Citizen's Advice for a free way to find out your legal position.

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Post #: 27

RE: GTA IV - 1/16/2009 10:14:11 PM

Arctic Blast

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I've always liked the idea of Steam as a distribution hub/DRM scheme. I have never USED Steam because of their rather awful customer support record and somewhat draconian Terms of Use.

Anyway, good luck JD...from, everything I've read, the GTA 4 PC version was broken, buggy, memory leaking 'quick buck' port.

< Message edited by Arctic Blast -- 1/16/2009 10:15:04 PM >

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Post #: 28

RE: GTA IV - 1/17/2009 12:29:42 AM

JudgeDredd

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From: Scotland
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Well, turns out I got it running tonight. Bugger it all to hell...defo no chance of a refund now! Oh well...a refund wasn't what I was after...working game is what I wanted and it's here now.

As for this from Steam...

quote:

... - please review Section 4 of the Steam Subscriber Agreement for more information...

after I wrote this to them...

quote:

I know you state no refunds...

I can do without that kind of support and will never again recommend them as a reseller, nor will I buy another of their products.

A little understanding goes a long way. I've bought 13 games from them and never needed tech support. The one time I need help, they throw their terms and conditions in my face....oh dear...how to waste a happy partnership.

I wonder if companies actually worry about how they treat their customers? I wonder if they really understand the damage they do to themselves?

(in reply to Arctic Blast)

Post #: 29

RE: GTA IV - 1/17/2009 3:01:41 AM

LarryP

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I bought several games through Steam a while back. In the spring of 2007 I wrote about my last experience with them on here. You must not have read it. It was about getting a Trojan through their network. Their answer was about the same as what you received Judge. I hate that company and will never buy anything from them ever again.