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Artillery - 3/3/2009 3:40:16 AM

Dreadnaught

Posts: 23
Joined: 12/26/2007
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Having a great time playing my first game as Prussia in standard scenario. However, while playing detailed battles against France, I consistently lose battles to their artillery alone. One volley to inf or cav typically kills 1k-1400 men and sometimes into 3k! Well, that one volley effectively destroys the units morale and they flee the field. It gets aggravating having units wiped out so quickly and decisively, and seems very unbalanced. Also, if I manage to get a unit close enough w/o having arty route them, I usually can't charge due to the smart AI always keeping inf around the arty pieces. That's ok, but if I fire on the arty, their return volley smashes the unit, even if I attack from their rear, though not as bad. Trying to surround them winds up with my surrounding units being surrounded themselves by cav and inf who combined with the arty pick apart my units. Anywho, how can I deal with these units?

Post #: 1

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 3:53:53 AM

Max 86

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Joined: 11/6/2007
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My guess would be that the Prussian troop quality/morale is no where near the French and that is why they are being outperformed.

I would try a more defensive type of strategy even when attacking. Use terrain as much as possible, mass your artillery whenever possible and maneuver, maneuver, maneuver. Use the whole map if necessary.

Honestly though, Prussia is hard to play period. They definitely miss Frederick in the 1800s.

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Post #: 2

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 4:17:33 AM

Gil R.

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Max 86 is probably right. Which scenario are you playing?

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Post #: 3

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 4:32:55 AM

Dreadnaught

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Joined: 12/26/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gil R.

Max 86 is probably right. Which scenario are you playing?

1805 standard. I noticed my arty is not as powerful, so i assumed the superior french morale, training, etc. was part of it. It still seems over powered though

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Post #: 4

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 4:37:09 AM

Hard Sarge

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From: garfield hts ohio usa
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you need to work on counter Arty Tactics, Jagers are good, get woodsmen, and put the Jagers into woods when you can, also, Sharpshooter (double damage vs Arty), Blasted (double damage when chargeing Arty) flanker (better damage from flanks)

but some need better Morale, before they show up

also Rifle Inf are great, but rare, give them Sharpshooter

sustained volly will help lower losses, you also have a couple of Med upgrades for lowering losses

on defence, try to pick your spots, so the enemy don't have long lanes of fire, best is where you can shoot them, with out them shooting back, or being able to mass and shoot at you, make them come though the woods while your in the open, sit up on hills

the AI likes to support there Guns, you can't use those supporters as blockers also, the AI can't fire though them, and of course, the simple stuff, avoid his guns, hit where they are not, the AI will try to move the guns into range, save your Cav for charges against the guns, when you can, from the flanks or rear, from the front only when you have to

early on, one Grand is HARD to beat, two Grands is something to bragg about

plus in the long run, fight fire with fire

also, the Russians are going to be very Heavy with Arty,

also, combined Arms is a must, all Inf is going to get slaughtered, all Cav is not going to have any staying power, all Arty is going to get overran, the right mix of Arty, Inf and Cav is almost unbeatable

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Post #: 5

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 4:37:46 AM

Russian Guard

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Joined: 10/14/2005
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Dreadnaught - one thing that helps alot against Artillery is to place Infantry in Skirmish mode. They take less damage and thus less morale loss, and are a little more effective in their fire against Artillery. Also, note that Infantry in Skirmish mode is much stronger against other Infantry units not in Skirmish mode.

No Nation starts with Skirmish abilities in most scenario's except France. You need 2 Upgrades for Line Infantry to be able to Skirmish:

1) Skirmisher Training
2) Skirmisher Doctrine

and a 3rd helps alot in making the morale checks for Line Infantry to Skirmish:

3) Skirmisher Tactics

Each of these Upgrades is expensive (I think 120 xp each), so it takes awhile to get them, unfortunately. Build Barracks to raise your quarterly xp gain, and if you do lose a war to France early (almost always the case if you don't have a lot of help from other Nations), use the 300 xp you get to help learn these Upgrades as fast as possible.

Jagers and Light Infantry can Skirmish without these skills. Use them to attack Artillery if possible, in Skirmish mode.

Hope that helps - as others have said, you are up against it with Prussia for awhile regardless, until they have time to improve the quality of their troops.

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Post #: 6

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 4:53:29 AM

Dreadnaught

Posts: 23
Joined: 12/26/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Russian Guard

Dreadnaught - one thing that helps alot against Artillery is to place Infantry in Skirmish mode. They take less damage and thus less morale loss, and are a little more effective in their fire against Artillery. Also, note that Infantry in Skirmish mode is much stronger against other Infantry units not in Skirmish mode.

No Nation starts with Skirmish abilities in most scenario's except France. You need 2 Upgrades for Line Infantry to be able to Skirmish:

1) Skirmisher Training
2) Skirmisher Doctrine

and a 3rd helps alot in making the morale checks for Line Infantry to Skirmish:

3) Skirmisher Tactics

Each of these Upgrades is expensive (I think 120 xp each), so it takes awhile to get them, unfortunately. Build Barracks to raise your quarterly xp gain, and if you do lose a war to France early (almost always the case if you don't have a lot of help from other Nations), use the 300 xp you get to help learn these Upgrades as fast as possible.

Jagers and Light Infantry can Skirmish without these skills. Use them to attack Artillery if possible, in Skirmish mode.

Hope that helps - as others have said, you are up against it with Prussia for awhile regardless, until they have time to improve the quality of their troops.

Well, I know what line of research I will be following from now on

Going to build lots of jagers while I'm at it. I'll give skirmishers a try in my next battle. I have FoF, and arty was powerful, but not that much, so I guess i was expecting much of the same mechanics. I'm glad it's different anyway, I wasn't looking for FoF: President's Edition

(in reply to Russian Guard)

Post #: 7

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 4:57:18 AM

Hard Sarge

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From: garfield hts ohio usa
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well, there is a reason what Arty was called Queen of the Battlefield

it is nasty, but it can be beaten, but as I said, the Grands are tuff

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Post #: 8

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 8:39:01 AM

Joram

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Two other points, the first shot any unit has while 'fresh' has a significant bonus. Try long range attacks to get rid of that bonus. Also, artillery have penalties to change in elevation so try attacking from a hill as well. This in combination with the advice above can severely limit the enemy artillery. You will still get pounded from time to time as the situation isn't always favorable to avoid artillery but you can do a lot to help yourself.

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Post #: 9

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 9:02:00 AM

Hard Sarge

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From: garfield hts ohio usa
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like this battle I just fought, the English ended up having two guns to my none

I was able to fight to big battles, while the placement of the Gun kept it from being able to fire, I fought one in front of hill, then as night was falling, found out the reinforcements were coming in behind the hill, slipped around the Gun during the night, then fought the 2nd battle the next morning

I just kept a little out of it's range, and kept something blocking it's fields of fire, when I was in range, had Cav waiting for if it left the ville

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Post #: 10

RE: Artillery - 3/3/2009 5:53:20 PM

Russian Guard

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Joram and HS make good points above, including the fact that Artillery will still "get you"; its dangerous stuff and the advice above is certainly not foolproof, but helps.

As HS says, Cavalry is still the best enemy of Artillery, and if you can get to the flank or especially the direct rear of Artillery and charge it, you usually (but not always) have good results in your favor.

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Post #: 11

RE: Artillery - 3/4/2009 1:02:43 AM

mbatch729

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Joined: 5/23/2001
From: North Carolina
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Russian Guard
As HS says, Cavalry is still the best enemy of Artillery, and if you can get to the flank or especially the direct rear of Artillery and charge it, you usually (but not always) have good results in your favor.

It is especially gratifying when your Cav captures it and you can turn their guns on them!!!