RE: Tora, Tora, Tora!

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> RE: Tora, Tora, Tora!

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RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/20/2009 5:37:15 AM

Kull

Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline

Welcome to the boards, Mojo! I think the motto in this place is "Abandon life, all ye who enter here".

(in reply to mojoman68)

Post #: 211

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 12:15:52 AM

erstad

Posts: 1944
Joined: 8/3/2004
From: Midwest USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kull

Welcome to the boards, Mojo! I think the motto in this place is "Abandon life, all ye who enter here".

There's absolutely no truth to this. Witp/AE is life.

(in reply to Kull)

Post #: 212

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 12:16:49 AM

Terminus

Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline

Oh, you have NO idea...

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to erstad)

Post #: 213

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 1:17:16 AM

Yamato hugger

Posts: 5475
Joined: 10/5/2004
Status: offline

BTW, just to update you, the dev forum has been looking into the PH attack (sigh, again), and Tree did 20 test runs. This was his result:

Total 1-20

2- 6 BB sunk
3- 5 BB sunk
2- 4 BB Sunk
5- 3 BB sunk
5- 2 BB sunk
1- 1 BB sunk
2- 0 BB sunk

So in 40% of his test runs, he scored the "historical" 2 BBs sunk or less. 50% of his test were either 2 or 3 BBs. So dont take the 7 I sank in this game as "typical"

Also note, in NONE of his 20 runs did he get 7 or 8, so I was very lucky.

< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 5/21/2009 1:19:09 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 214

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 2:54:32 AM

kfmiller41

Posts: 1063
Joined: 3/25/2003
From: Saint Marys, Ga
Status: offline

That means with my luck I will be looking at the lower edge of that range (sigh) and here I was hoping to sink everything the the harbor

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You have the ability to arouse various emotions in me: please select carefully.

(in reply to Yamato hugger)

Post #: 215

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 4:15:15 AM

Chad Harrison

Posts: 1395
Joined: 4/2/2003
From: Boise, ID - USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

Also note, in NONE of his 20 runs did he get 7 or 8, so I was very lucky.

That reminds me of something a couple of dev's said in this thread and others . . . what was it? Oh yes, dont base the entire AE engine on a single result of a single battle?

Amazing what happens when you listen to the people who built the game and have been playing it for the past couple of years . . .

(in reply to Yamato hugger)

Post #: 216

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 6:08:56 AM

Tophat1815

Posts: 1824
Joined: 1/16/2006
Status: offline

Fellas,fellas what do you expect? People are all keyed-up and ready to go for AE. This latest unpleasantness is simply the pressure release valve in operation. Don't read too much into people acting off kilter.

(in reply to Chad Harrison)

Post #: 217

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 1:40:14 PM

traskott

Posts: 1546
Joined: 6/23/2008
From: Valladolid, Spain
Status: offline

Excellent thread. Waiting for the next update...

(in reply to Tophat1815)

Post #: 218

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 4:34:57 PM

Yamato hugger

Posts: 5475
Joined: 10/5/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: traskott

Excellent thread. Waiting for the next update...

Will be later tonight. Just got home from a 13 hour "day" and downloading the latest patch as I speak. Bed time.

_____________________________

(in reply to traskott)

Post #: 219

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 4:36:46 PM

Flying Tiger

Posts: 496
Joined: 3/11/2008
From: ummmm... i HATE that question!
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

BTW, just to update you, the dev forum has been looking into the PH attack (sigh, again), and Tree did 20 test runs. This was his result:

Total 1-20

2- 6 BB sunk
3- 5 BB sunk
2- 4 BB Sunk
5- 3 BB sunk
5- 2 BB sunk
1- 1 BB sunk
2- 0 BB sunk

So in 40% of his test runs, he scored the "historical" 2 BBs sunk or less. 50% of his test were either 2 or 3 BBs. So dont take the 7 I sank in this game as "typical"

Also note, in NONE of his 20 runs did he get 7 or 8, so I was very lucky.

so now we can say a big 'thanks for nothing' to all the whingers, who not only prevented this AAR from progressing (because tree got sidetracked re-running turn one 20 times) but also for delaying the release while all the dev team ran around responding to the panic merchants who were screaming "its broken, its broken". Now.... enough whinging. play the AAR. Release the game. Enough said!!

(in reply to Yamato hugger)

Post #: 220

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 4:59:47 PM

Chad Harrison

Posts: 1395
Joined: 4/2/2003
From: Boise, ID - USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger

so now we can say a big 'thanks for nothing' to all the whingers, who not only prevented this AAR from progressing (because tree got sidetracked re-running turn one 20 times) but also for delaying the release while all the dev team ran around responding to the panic merchants who were screaming "its broken, its broken".

(in reply to Flying Tiger)

Post #: 221

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 5:01:09 PM

Terminus

Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline

Pitchforks and torches at the exits. Help yourselves...

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to Chad Harrison)

Post #: 222

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 7:49:55 PM

Tophat1815

Posts: 1824
Joined: 1/16/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

BTW, just to update you, the dev forum has been looking into the PH attack (sigh, again), and Tree did 20 test runs. This was his result:

Total 1-20

2- 6 BB sunk
3- 5 BB sunk
2- 4 BB Sunk
5- 3 BB sunk
5- 2 BB sunk
1- 1 BB sunk
2- 0 BB sunk

So in 40% of his test runs, he scored the "historical" 2 BBs sunk or less. 50% of his test were either 2 or 3 BBs. So dont take the 7 I sank in this game as "typical"

Also note, in NONE of his 20 runs did he get 7 or 8, so I was very lucky.

so now we can say a big 'thanks for nothing' to all the whingers, who not only prevented this AAR from progressing (because tree got sidetracked re-running turn one 20 times) but also for delaying the release while all the dev team ran around responding to the panic merchants who were screaming "its broken, its broken". Now.... enough whinging. play the AAR. Release the game. Enough said!!

(in reply to Flying Tiger)

Post #: 223

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 8:39:29 PM

Don Bowen

Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Pitchforks and torches at the exits. Help yourselves...

Sorry, due to unexpectedly high demand and limited supply, we can only provide torches for every fourth villager or farmer. There are enough pitchforks for approximately half of the expected mob, the rest must use rakes and the odd hoe.

(in reply to Terminus)

Post #: 224

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 8:47:20 PM

fabertong

Posts: 4546
Joined: 2/25/2004
From: Bristol, England, U.K.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Pitchforks and torches at the exits. Help yourselves...

Sorry, due to unexpectedly high demand and limited supply, we can only provide torches for every fourth villager or farmer. There are enough pitchforks for approximately half of the expected mob, the rest must use rakes and the odd hoe.

Fantastic.............I'm great with a hoe.............

(in reply to Don Bowen)

Post #: 225

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 8:50:27 PM

NormS3

Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline

can i wait for another torch to be available?

I don't want to burn anything, just wave it around and stuff

(in reply to Don Bowen)

Post #: 226

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 8:51:45 PM

Don Bowen

Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fabertong

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Pitchforks and torches at the exits. Help yourselves...

Sorry, due to unexpectedly high demand and limited supply, we can only provide torches for every fourth villager or farmer. There are enough pitchforks for approximately half of the expected mob, the rest must use rakes and the odd hoe.

Fantastic.............I'm great with a hoe.............

with an odd hoe??

(in reply to fabertong)

Post #: 227

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 9:03:56 PM

fabertong

Posts: 4546
Joined: 2/25/2004
From: Bristol, England, U.K.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

quote:

ORIGINAL: fabertong

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Pitchforks and torches at the exits. Help yourselves...

Sorry, due to unexpectedly high demand and limited supply, we can only provide torches for every fourth villager or farmer. There are enough pitchforks for approximately half of the expected mob, the rest must use rakes and the odd hoe.

Fantastic.............I'm great with a hoe.............

with an odd hoe??

Just how odd?!?!!?!?

(in reply to Don Bowen)

Post #: 228

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 9:16:03 PM

Don Bowen

Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fabertong

Just how odd?!?!!?!?

One of the ergonomically shaped ones with the wierd handle that looks like it would be comfortable but ends up straining your back and raising calluses at unexpected spots.

(in reply to fabertong)

Post #: 229

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 9:20:04 PM

fabertong

Posts: 4546
Joined: 2/25/2004
From: Bristol, England, U.K.
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

quote:

ORIGINAL: fabertong

Just how odd?!?!!?!?

One of the ergonomically shaped ones with the wierd handle that looks like it would be comfortable but ends up straining your back and raising calluses at unexpected spots.

By some chance.................I have flippers........so I can wield this hoe to great effect...........bring on the nay-sayers..........

(in reply to Don Bowen)

Post #: 230

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 9:37:43 PM

kriegmarine

Posts: 37
Joined: 11/28/2007
From: Spain(Seville)
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: traskott

Excellent thread. Waiting for the next update...

I see familiar faces around here,.......As I would have liked sunk you 8 bb

(in reply to traskott)

Post #: 231

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 10:33:24 PM

Splinterhead

Posts: 335
Joined: 8/31/2002
From: Lenoir City, TN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger

so now we can say a big 'thanks for nothing' to all the whingers, who not only prevented this AAR from progressing (because tree got sidetracked re-running turn one 20 times) but also for delaying the release while all the dev team ran around responding to the panic merchants who were screaming "its broken, its broken". Now.... enough whinging. play the AAR. Release the game. Enough said!!

If the game gives a 60% chance that the Japanese will do better than they did historically,
it is, arguably, broken. ( Of course the fact that the game assumes that all the Kates carried either 800kg bombs or torpedoes when, in fact about a third carried smaller bombs, one should expect the Japanese to do better.) The only rational solution is to scrap the current, horribly botched mess and start over.

(in reply to Flying Tiger)

Post #: 232

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 10:35:05 PM

Don Bowen

Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Splinterhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flying Tiger

so now we can say a big 'thanks for nothing' to all the whingers, who not only prevented this AAR from progressing (because tree got sidetracked re-running turn one 20 times) but also for delaying the release while all the dev team ran around responding to the panic merchants who were screaming "its broken, its broken". Now.... enough whinging. play the AAR. Release the game. Enough said!!

If the game gives a 60% chance that the Japanese will do better than they did historically,
it is, arguably, broken. ( Of course the fact that the game assumes that all the Kates carried either 800kg bombs or torpedoes when, in fact about a third carried smaller bombs, one should expect the Japanese to do better.) The only rational solution is to scrap the current, horribly botched mess and start over.

Works for me. Check back in a couple of years.

(in reply to Splinterhead)

Post #: 233

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 11:29:47 PM

n01487477

Posts: 4779
Joined: 2/21/2006
Status: offline

On any given day anything can happen, this is one turn on one day ... why gamble? why watch sport? why wake up in the morning? hell its because there is unpredictability in the system. Want predictability ? Be with the wrong girl and watch your life, money and 'luggage' vaporise.

Please get on with the AAR ...

(in reply to Splinterhead)

Post #: 234

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/21/2009 11:31:40 PM

wworld7

Posts: 1727
Joined: 2/25/2003
From: The Nutmeg State
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

Works for me. Check back in a couple of years.

Which would be when WITP-2 would be entering the Alpha phase...RIGHT?

_____________________________

Flipper

(in reply to Don Bowen)

Post #: 235

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/22/2009 12:08:26 AM

erstad

Posts: 1944
Joined: 8/3/2004
From: Midwest USA
Status: offline

quote:

If the game gives a 60% chance that the Japanese will do better than they did historically,
it is, arguably, broken.

I hope this is tongue-in-cheek, but if not there is a gap in the logic. This statement would only be true if the historical result was exactly the expected median result. If in a particular engagement the Japanese got "lucky", then the game engine is only accurate if a typical game result is less favorable than historical (to Japan). If the Japanese were "unlucky" then an accurate game engine would have a typical game result which is more favorable than historical.

(in reply to Splinterhead)

Post #: 236

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/22/2009 2:22:56 AM

Yamato hugger

Posts: 5475
Joined: 10/5/2004
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Well, in truth 4 BBs "sank" at Pearl. 2 were re-floated and repaired. So in my personal opinion, anything between 2 and 4 is "historical". Doesnt mean a player shouldnt be able to achieve less than 2 or more than 4. Just that to me 2, 3, or 4 should be expected. In that regard, Trees result achieved a 60% right on the money mark, which is probably all a player should hope for. Of course this debate could rage until the end of time. I believe someone is working on a Dec 8th scenario which when I played "stock" the Dec 8th scenario is about all I played.

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(in reply to erstad)

Post #: 237

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/22/2009 2:23:12 AM

Panther Bait

Posts: 654
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline

Thank you Erstad for the being the voice of reason.

Mike

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When you shoot at a destroyer and miss, it's like hit'in a wildcat in the ass with a banjo.

Nathan Dogan, USS Gurnard

(in reply to erstad)

Post #: 238

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/22/2009 2:52:12 AM

Yamato hugger

Posts: 5475
Joined: 10/5/2004
Status: offline

Several surface engagements with ships fleeing Hong Kong resulted in the loss of several AKs. He lost a PT and a DD was on fire from a sinle hit. A Jap PT (pictured) killed a large AK!
A transport group of 3 AKs fleeing Manila was attacked and destroyed south of Luzon by Formosa based Bettys as was a pair of PGs by aircraft from the Ryujo.
2 coastal minesweepers and an AVP were sunk by planes from the KB in the PH area.
Landings continued at Kota Bharu (no attack) and an attack at Pengpu by the 13th bde in China drove the 89th Chinese corps back.

Attachment (1)

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(in reply to Yamato hugger)

Post #: 239

RE: Tora, Tora, Tora! - 5/22/2009 2:55:57 AM

Mad66

Posts: 42
Joined: 10/21/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yamato hugger

Well, in truth 4 BBs "sank" at Pearl. 2 were re-floated and repaired. So in my personal opinion, anything between 2 and 4 is "historical". Doesnt mean a player shouldnt be able to achieve less than 2 or more than 4. Just that to me 2, 3, or 4 should be expected. In that regard, Trees result achieved a 60% right on the money mark, which is probably all a player should hope for. Of course this debate could rage until the end of time. I believe someone is working on a Dec 8th scenario which when I played "stock" the Dec 8th scenario is about all I played.

I too would love a Dec 8th scenario, though it can certainly wait till after release. This project looks more awesome, even with what couldn't be done within the necessary constraints, each day.

(in reply to Yamato hugger)

Post #: 240