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RE: Should I buy? - 12/3/2009 2:15:09 AM   
Warspite3

 

Posts: 210
Joined: 3/31/2005
Status: offline 		Hi Archy, you must have missed my post just above here because I bought it last friday and been playing the heck out of it. Everything you say at the bottom is right too.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Archy

It has RTS elements, mostly structure/defense and also the whole 3d combat mode.
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2308357

Read my thread for a short review.

If you like 4x games enough to play them sp, buy it
If you want multiplayer buy it , it will come faster (lol). Hotseat is in already.

to OP : A2526 is a pot pourri of all the games you named (played em too).
It the one that really makes me better immersed in my games due to pace quality. Its by far theone with most potential as well.

Its obvious your a 4x fan so yes you should buy , you will not regret, Tutorial perfect for learning.
Then you can either do the 12 race map or make a custom campaign that suits your style/wishes.
I think that the current custom game allows enough to play a satisfying game but it will also reveal the potential.

read my thread for review and pm if you have questions. 







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Post #: 31
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 12:29:09 AM   
Krec


Posts: 548
Joined: 3/9/2001
From: SF Bay Area
Status: offline 		i would highly recomend SEV  using the 1.79 patch and the Balance Mod 1.19f soon to be 1.20.   Capt. Kwok has spent like 2 yes fixing the game into a very excellent game.  Right now i would say it is the best 4x space game out there.   Be warned thou ,  you will have to invest some time into it.  but believe me its a great game.  really fun  multi player game via email.   the combat simulator alone is worth it.  i think you can pick it up for like 10 bucks.  you cant go wrong.

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Post #: 32
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 7:25:29 AM   
JamesM

 

Posts: 1017
Joined: 8/28/2000
From: QLD, Australia
Status: offline 		I have played 2526 a couple of times and I think it may be a long time before I play it again.  It does not feel like a worthy successor to Master of Orion or Birth of the Federation.  So I would hold off until a significant patch comes out as stated in another thread the micromanagement of population emigration is a killer.

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Post #: 33
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 7:46:16 AM   
linger

 

Posts: 17
Joined: 5/20/2008
Status: offline 		Would you mind expanding on how much time you spend on the population emigration? That's the one thing holding me back from buying at the moment.

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Post #: 34
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 2:41:47 PM   
Gertjan

 

Posts: 698
Joined: 12/9/2009
Status: offline 		I am also doubting whether to buy the game. Unfortunately there are no reviews yet. It seems to fulfil my necessary criteria for a good 4x space game: good diplomacy, no detailed ship design and tactical battles, focus on empire management, not on micro management (perhaps there are some issues with bureaucracy, happiness and population transport?). Does anyone of you know if Sword of the stars also fulfils these criteria?

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Post #: 35
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 3:33:17 PM   
laika


Posts: 27
Joined: 10/27/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gertjan

I am also doubting whether to buy the game. Unfortunately there are no reviews yet. It seems to fulfil my necessary criteria for a good 4x space game: good diplomacy, no detailed ship design and tactical battles, focus on empire management, not on micro management (perhaps there are some issues with bureaucracy, happiness and population transport?). Does anyone of you know if Sword of the stars also fulfils these criteria?



Read this thread for some information. Its difficult to tell if some1 likes a game or not. There is 1 thing i can say. This game runs great and is not full of bugs like alot other games new on the market.
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2308357

(in reply to Gertjan)
Post #: 36
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 3:36:43 PM   
Klahn

 

Posts: 184
Joined: 5/8/2007
Status: offline 		Not counting time spent in tactical combat, dealing with population issues takes about roughly 70% of my game time. It can be more or less depending on which race you play. The game doesn't have much micromanagement, but population is the exception. The races are not evenly balanced and your choice has a significant effect on the difficulty of the game. (More so than the actual difficulty selection.)

I think the big disconnect is that this isn't really a 4X game. It was advertised as such and a lot of people bought the game expecting the same general type of gameplay as other 4X games. Winning in this game is based on collecting points, not on warfare or expansion. In fact, expansion becomes impossible for most races as the game moves into it's later stages and warfare is generally only useful as a method to control your own population. (At one point I would say that 80% of my shipbuilding was trying to construct enough transports and fill them with enough of my people that I could suicide them at enemy fleets as a population control method.)

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Post #: 37
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 7:33:14 PM   
Grandpoobah


Posts: 29
Joined: 12/1/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ryvan

I think the big disconnect is that this isn't really a 4X game.



I guess I have to disagree with that sentence. A 4x game by definition is a strategy game in which players control an empire that must "explore, expand, exploit, and exterminate". This game certainly requires you do that. What makes this game different is the you must develop a game play style that pays attention to all four aspects through out the whole game. If you try to play it as a space conquest game (meaning you only concentrate on the 2X's - exploit and exterminate) you will lose.

The real issue is that most are really having difficulty that the game system, as delivered, is very different from all the other games mentioned in the various threads. I like that it is different and I commend the designer for trying to do something different.

My only problem with game is in the end game phase, the need to move population takes on a little too much micro-management to suit me. There have been enough good ideas presented that if any of them are implemented that should address that issue.

One last thing is that this game is easily modified by changing the XML files. I have created races that allowed me to win the game based on armed expansion making it space conquest game. I have even designed new ships, created custom planet names, and altered structure characteristics by just editing the various XML files. You can shape this game to match your whim or play preference. I must confess that I tried changing the XMLs just to see how modifiable the game is as I play most of my games unmodified.


< Message edited by Grandpoobah -- 12/9/2009 7:41:54 PM >

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Post #: 38
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 7:37:27 PM   
ShotmanMaslo

 

Posts: 37
Joined: 11/20/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ryvan
I think the big disconnect is that this isn't really a 4X game. It was advertised as such and a lot of people bought the game expecting the same general type of gameplay as other 4X games. Winning in this game is based on collecting points, not on warfare or expansion. In fact, expansion becomes impossible for most races as the game moves into it's later stages and warfare is generally only useful as a method to control your own population. (At one point I would say that 80% of my shipbuilding was trying to construct enough transports and fill them with enough of my people that I could suicide them at enemy fleets as a population control method.)


Yes, the game in its current state has some gameplay flaws, but it also has positives. As soon as the devs listen to the players and release a patch which fixes all the bad points mentioned on this forum (and maybe adds some new tactical and strategic warfare features), it would be a great game. Now its just good or average, compared to other 4Xs. But patches and expansions can turn even a horrible game at release into good stuff, and already good game can be gradually upgraded to almost perfect (example: Sins, GalCiv2 and its wonderful expansions). So, keep it up guys! :)


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Post #: 39
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 8:47:22 PM   
linger

 

Posts: 17
Joined: 5/20/2008
Status: offline 		That's a shame...man 70% on population control is ridiculous. Guess i'll have to hold off on this then.

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Post #: 40
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 9:05:14 PM   
kafka

 

Posts: 159
Joined: 6/11/2004
Status: offline 		sorry, wrong thread


< Message edited by kafka -- 12/9/2009 9:08:18 PM >

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Post #: 41
RE: Should I buy? - 12/9/2009 11:40:21 PM   
Tom_Holsinger

 

Posts: 233
Joined: 10/23/2003
Status: offline 		Ryvan, Grandpoobah may have a solution for your problem. Check out posts here and here for an explanation.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ryvan

Not counting time spent in tactical combat, dealing with population issues takes about roughly 70% of my game time. It can be more or less depending on which race you play. The game doesn't have much micromanagement, but population is the exception. The races are not evenly balanced and your choice has a significant effect on the difficulty of the game. (More so than the actual difficulty selection.)

I think the big disconnect is that this isn't really a 4X game. It was advertised as such and a lot of people bought the game expecting the same general type of gameplay as other 4X games. Winning in this game is based on collecting points, not on warfare or expansion. In fact, expansion becomes impossible for most races as the game moves into it's later stages and warfare is generally only useful as a method to control your own population. (At one point I would say that 80% of my shipbuilding was trying to construct enough transports and fill them with enough of my people that I could suicide them at enemy fleets as a population control method.)


(in reply to Klahn)
Post #: 42
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 1:31:13 AM   
Klahn

 

Posts: 184
Joined: 5/8/2007
Status: offline 		Well, that's a bit more elegant than using my people as enemy targets....

Thanks Grandpoobah and Tom!


(in reply to Tom_Holsinger)
Post #: 43
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 1:36:17 AM   
Rosseau

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline 		FWIW, I went back to play SE IV Deluxe after Armada and had a hard time adjusting back to the crappy graphics and non-intuitive interface. It does take time to re-adjust.

SOTS is awesome, but it took quite a few expansions to get to that level.

But don't blow off Armada. It's clean, generally bug-free, easily moddable, and looks like it will be supported down the road like most Matrix games. When it comes to patches, MG is the best! 

(in reply to Klahn)
Post #: 44
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 4:06:31 AM   
SeanD


Posts: 1574
Joined: 3/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

When it comes to patches, MG is the best!


It's very awesome that you said that. Thanks!

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Post #: 45
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 10:35:40 AM   
Gertjan

 

Posts: 698
Joined: 12/9/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SeanD

quote:

When it comes to patches, MG is the best!


It's very awesome that you said that. Thanks!
quote:

It's very awesome that you said that. Thanks!


That sounds very promising. Any idea when we can expect the next patch (1.2)?

(in reply to SeanD)
Post #: 46
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 4:42:32 PM   
sage

 

Posts: 204
Joined: 8/5/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: linger

That's a shame...man 70% on population control is ridiculous. Guess i'll have to hold off on this then.



It's all relative. Playing on a good size map, on turn 250, I was spending like 2% of my time on population control. I just set up auto transports between worlds that needed to lose / gain population.

(in reply to linger)
Post #: 47
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 5:18:02 PM   
Zakhal


Posts: 2494
Joined: 1/4/2001
From: Jyväskylä, Finland
Status: offline 		Armada more than filled my 4x spot. Im not hungry for 4x games anymore and am playing/doing other stuff now. Perhaps revisit in ww2 pacific is in order..

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Post #: 48
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 5:22:07 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sage
quote:

ORIGINAL: linger
That's a shame...man 70% on population control is ridiculous. Guess i'll have to hold off on this then.


It's all relative. Playing on a good size map, on turn 250, I was spending like 2% of my time on population control. I just set up auto transports between worlds that needed to lose / gain population.


Agreed, population control takes up nowhere near 70% of my time. I occasionally setup a few repeating transport routes and routes to newly colonized systems, that's about it. It mainly serves as pressure for me to keep expanding and I have certainly started a few wars to secure more space for population.

With that said, as others have noted, modding this game is pretty easy with a text editor and adjusting the balance how you want it does not take much effort.

Regards,

- Erik


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Post #: 49
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 8:33:28 PM   
Gertjan

 

Posts: 698
Joined: 12/9/2009
Status: offline
quote:

modding this game is pretty easy with a text editor and adjusting the balance how you want it does not take much effort


If this is so easy, then it should be explained in a clear manner to average (no modding) players, since it seems to be an important issue to some players. I wouldn't know how to do such things.

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Post #: 50
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 8:53:17 PM   
Wade1000


Posts: 771
Joined: 10/27/2009
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		I believe that the vast, forum-silent majority do not mod or use mods and they do not want to. They, like me, would rather wait for official updates while continuing to try a game or while playing other games. I wish there was not such a focus by developers towards us to mod games. It only discourages the mentioned majority players.

I have seen this on other game forums also and it is usually only about 5 to 10 players that often talk about modding.

Though, I do appreciate that modding is available to those that like it.

< Message edited by Wade1000 -- 12/10/2009 8:59:31 PM >

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Wish list:population centers beyond planetary(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Culture):Ships,Ring Orbitals,Sphere Orbitals,Ringworlds,Sphereworlds;ability to create & destroy planets,population centers,stars;AI competently using all advances & features.

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Post #: 51
RE: Should I buy? - 12/10/2009 11:57:07 PM   
Rosseau

 

Posts: 2757
Joined: 9/13/2009
Status: offline 		It's true some of us have more fun modding a game than playing it. In Armada, it is easy; Gertjan, PM me and I would be happy to help.


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Post #: 52
RE: Should I buy? - 12/11/2009 1:06:28 AM   
Warspite3

 

Posts: 210
Joined: 3/31/2005
Status: offline 		As you can see at the start of this thread, I was on the fence several weeks ago like you but I decided to buy it based off what some people here told me. I am very happy I did, I have definitely got my money worth out this game already. From the things you mention, it fits all of that well. I have not really had a problem with the pop transport as others have complained about. If you are looking for a solid 4x game that will be a good break from all the others out there, I have to recommend 2526. To answer your question about Sword of the Stars, that one shines on tactical battles and pretty good ship design. Downside is nothing with colonies other then a couple sliders and not much diplomacy options. Best suggestion to you, I would buy both of them. You can pickup Sword of the Stars complete on Impulse (and some of the other digital sites too) for really cheap now. Man, I have all of these games and I find they all stand on their own as great games, I like them all. Sometimes, I may want to play Space Empires 5, other times GalCiv2, Armada, SotS, EaW and I also always liked Lost Empire too. This all said, in the end I feel Armada is a great addition to any 4x gamer's library so you really can't go wrong. Oh, I had to pick my eyes up off the ground the first time I seen a 1000x1000 mini map, INSANE!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gertjan

I am also doubting whether to buy the game. Unfortunately there are no reviews yet. It seems to fulfil my necessary criteria for a good 4x space game: good diplomacy, no detailed ship design and tactical battles, focus on empire management, not on micro management (perhaps there are some issues with bureaucracy, happiness and population transport?). Does anyone of you know if Sword of the stars also fulfils these criteria?




< Message edited by Warspite3 -- 12/11/2009 1:08:40 AM >

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Post #: 53
RE: Should I buy? - 12/11/2009 9:21:48 AM   
Gertjan

 

Posts: 698
Joined: 12/9/2009
Status: offline 		@Warspite3

Thanks a lot for the advise. After all the info I received during the past few days I am really inclined to try the game this weekend. I don't have the time to try all the different 4X games. Furthermore, Sword of the Stars seems to be too much focused on ship design and combat, which is not my cup of tea at all (although I like to watch (nearly) automated battles such as in SoaSE).

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Post #: 54
RE: Should I buy? - 11/3/2010 5:31:52 PM   
Anguille


Posts: 637
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Hyper-cruiser "Phantom"
Status: offline 		I also think that people who were hesitant should take a look at it now. Also people who bought it a year ago should revisit the game as it has improved a lot...currently in my top 5 4x space strategy games.

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Post #: 55
RE: Should I buy? - 11/3/2010 8:19:22 PM   
martok


Posts: 837
Joined: 8/30/2004
Status: offline 		^ +1 to what he said.

I admittedly wasn't too thrilled with Armada when it was first released last fall, but it's improved a lot this past year. It has definitely become one of my favorite 4x titles, and is worth checking out now.


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Post #: 56
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