Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: hermanhum

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ORIGINAL: navwarcolI've attached a screenshot from the latest test. A sub can clearly be seen penetrating a screen. In fact, the AI has already detailed a Viking to prosecute it. It has perfect location data due to the escort's active sonar, yet it fails to fire a single shot even though it is clearly within ASW range. This happens time, and time, again.

I can't see the little line [course] of the submarine. This means that the submarine has been detected, but, exact position is still unknown.
So, the Viking would not launch a weapon. In such cases I just push F1 and force the aircraft to launch the torpedo. Once the torpedo is in the water, the submarine reacts and the path of the sub becomes visible on the screen and the units in that particular mission will launch their weapon [if they are in firing range]. Sometimes you see that the submarine suddenly is somewhere else, on the exact location.
That's my experience with this situation.

Cheers,
Taitennek

(in reply to hermanhum)

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ORIGINAL: rsharp@advancedgamin

If there are other situations in 3.10 where a sub of unknown posture or class is not being fired on, let me know. Keep in mind that the mission of the surface group is what determines who and what to attack. This includes the Plotted and NoMission missions.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

For your sub, a question however. Are you saying you achieved firing position on a moving CVBG by entirely creeping the sub and never having to move above the stealth speeds? I think, I must have misunderstood that, but I am just clarifying. If it is so, the carrier group was going far too slow, and it is amazing that the sub found them in the first place to launch its own attack, as they would have been barely making steerage, and nearly 'stealthy' in their own right.
Also, an off topic note to you Herman..tried your db for the first time, very well done.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

One other quick note...active sonar does not give an instant detection unless you are inside of its (usually very limited) range. And, I notice the sub contact is yellow, which means it is being IDed as a neutral, so, you do have something there.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

Still, though, I think, if the sub manages to get that close, it deserves its shot It should have been prosecuted on the way in..if that surface group was moving at, say 10kts, unless the sub was already in position essentially, there would have had to be a point along the way where the sub was above creep speeds...even the difference of 5-10 nm off the course, a very small distance, would require the sub to accelerate to the intercept point, before their targets vacated the area. Also, the a/c would not be able to prosecute a torpedo launch from full speed, (or, should not be able to, I will have to see if it can in H3)and most ship based ASW weapons have a shorter range than many opfor torpedos ...so once the sub is past whatever air assets you have, it is quite likely to fire off it's torpedoes whether or not the ships fire off their ASW weaps.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

My point, is that, the designers WANTED the carrier to be sunk, so they designed it with every advantage to the subs. Now, if you design your own ( and, I believe I have played some of yours, and would love to play if you design one of these) and in your own, you make it , say..20 hours earlier..the sub is not in position, they have to come from, well, wherever...but that changes the whole scenario. Now, instead of being able to creep for the attack point, the sub has to plan, has to diagram out an intercept point, on a battlegroup, even going 8 kts...If the sub is outside of the "inner circle", they are probably 100nm away from the HVUs..now, they have to do more than 'creep speed' to attain position..and a proper ASW screen will have more than 1 ASW ship 'sprint-drifting' so that the sprinter can get ahead, then drift, on passive, while the drifter sprints. Now, the sub is in a position where they have to not only time the intercept point of the hvu's, whose position they cannot know for certain, but also, time the sprint-drift pattern of the escorts. They may still pentetrate (after all, they are well trained, also) but it is nothing like a guarantee.

The problem with these scens, is that to save the hours long fight for the sub to gain its position, the designers simply set it up to where the surface units would have to cross right over the subs positions. And a sitting-silent modern SS/SSN will sink a target or three in that position.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

the AI never should have that ASW plane at full throttle, it'll keep bypassing the target and never be able to fire. And there also should have been ASW helos around, they are better at knife fighting than the fast movers.

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ORIGINAL: VCDH

Herman, are you using the default colors or have you set up your own? It would probably clear up any confusion because, as you know, the player can alter the default colors to his own choosing. Myself I use yellow for unknown and white for neutral....

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ORIGINAL: Chelco

I'm from Argentina and I was planning to play some of the Falklands scenarios out there.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

the whole ASW challenge, the entire ASW mission, is designed to keep them farther out, and for the sub, its entire challenge, is getting in close, which, unless the geometry of the situation is incredibly lucky, cannot be done at creep speeds.

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ORIGINAL: navwarcol

edit: Are you certain about the subs only moving creep speed? I have to look, but I could swear that I tracked one at around 15kts before on a transit mission, during a scenario i made specifically to examine the passive sonar model.