Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: CV Zuikaku
So, sending a single destroyer to cruise arround major enemy bases in hope of being attacked by carrier TF is not gamey at all? Interesting... What is next? Sending AKs to scout deep inside enemy convoy routes? Sending AKs to test which enemy base is mined? Yes, you can play in whatever way you want, but some things are... well... gamey
Sending subs or big CV/SC TFs in deep recon or S&D missions would not be considered gamey, but this... and for allied side... and single DD cruising arround major enemy bases...

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Several weeks ago the KB retired from the theater. I didn't know where she had gone, but I knew I had better not venture into enemy waters if there was a chance of bumping into here. So I detailed DD Swanson to sail all the way around Borneo to scout for the KB. (What my opponent doesn't know is that Swanson completed at least five circumnavigations of Borneo without incident - making it clear that this wasn't necessarily a "suicide" run).

However, next turn my scout did "find" the KB lurking off Kuching, Borneo (about where I had expected, though I wasn't sure). DD Swanson was destroyed but served its purpose.

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ORIGINAL: Misconduct

Its not gamey to use a tactic called "recon" to scout for your enemies carriers. 

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ORIGINAL: CV Zuikaku

that was a recon deep into enemy controlled waters. sending in some cruisers with scoutplanes have some sense, but this is obviously a one way mission. And it is gamey to me. Imagine map swarming with expendable single ship TFs "scouting" all arround...

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Gents, lets put aside all this "Should have had better search/more escort/air attack" in place arguement. I had all three, perhaps not in big enough quantites,

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but this is obviously a one way mission.

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ORIGINAL: SuluSea

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ORIGINAL: CV Zuikaku

that was a recon deep into enemy controlled waters. sending in some cruisers with scoutplanes have some sense, but this is obviously a one way mission. And it is gamey to me. Imagine map swarming with expendable single ship TFs "scouting" all arround...

He would have needed 5 dds to make five trips around Borneo if it were indeed a 1 way mission not to mention if the waters were truly "enemy controlled" it wouldn't have made more than 1 trip.

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ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Gents,

My opponent and I have a situation where we wonder whether an Allied tactic is gamey or an unfair exploitation of the game.

It's July 1944 and the Allies have just invaded several points on eastern and southern Borneo. The Japanese remain very strong - the KB is powerful and the Japanese have a powerful network of airases on Borneo, Java, and Mindanao. Thus it would be very risky for the Allies to accept battle with the KB under the umbrella of Japanese LBA.

Several weeks ago the KB retired from the theater. I didn't know where she had gone, but I knew I had better not venture into enemy waters if there was a chance of bumping into here. So I detailed DD Swanson to sail all the way around Borneo to scout for the KB. (What my opponent doesn't know is that Swanson completed at least five circumnavigations of Borneo without incident - making it clear that this wasn't necessarily a "suicide" run).

Recently, Swanson bumped into a tanker TF and badly damaged three and an escort. My opponent protested and I told him that I wasn't (and won't) employ that tactic purposefully. IE, I won't flood Japanese controlled waters with single-ship TFs that are nearly impossible to track and destroy. I think he's okay with that.

However, next turn my scout did "find" the KB lurking off Kuching, Borneo (about where I had expected, though I wasn't sure). DD Swanson was destroyed but served its purpose.

My opponent thinks this is gamey. I don't think so, but wanted to open it to input from the forum.

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He considered them one way mission.

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A sub on the other hand would have a decent chance of sighting the KB, either by running over it or by being nav searched by Vals/Kates, and still have a decent chance of surviving the encounter.

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Nelson had said that the want of frigates would be engraved on his heart. He needed scouts equal to those they would have to meet, but if they were run down they could not get the information that was needed. It was useless to send a ship into a position of danger of being overhauled and taken.

The experience gained by American naval officers during the 1898 war with Spain was that there was very great need for scouts ; they had employed ocean liners for the purpose, and had found them extremely efficient. As a result it had been concluded that it would not be desirable to build vessels especially for such purposes. Such craft must be of considerable size — a ship of 3,000 or 4,000 tons was hardly equal to maintaining speed in heavy weather during long voyages at sea. The ocean liners were, therefore, best fitted as long-distance scouts, while destroyers would fill the position of small scouts for closer operations. They ascertained, however, that in order to find the enemy's fleet they had to cruise all over the West Indies. Many vessels were required to form the big fleet of cruisers necessary, and, therefore, they had come to the conclusion that they must depend on the ocean liners, keeping torpedo craft for close scouting.

By around 1910 it seemed probable that the protected cruiser would be modified, and her place taken, as far as speed is concerned, by a new type being developed, the Scout. As its name implies this type will be very fast, 23 to 25 knots, with large coal capacity and no protection. The Scout class is not designed to fight but rather to act as the eyes of the fleet. They were of good size, 3,000 to 4,000 tons displacement, with fine lines for speed. Their duties would be to discover and keep in touch with the enemy and to carry news to their own battle squadron; they would also be capable of destroying torpedo craft. As to unprotected cruisers and gunboats, while necessary in times of peace for general police of the seas and to show the flag in foreign ports, they are of no use in battle except against unarmored vessels.

The scout cruiser was a vessel conceived for a special purpose. It was an offshoot from the parent stem of cruisers. Its principal duties appear to be to get contact with enemy battleships or fleet, to ward off an attack of enemy destroyers upon own battleships and mine laying in battle. It is all eyes and no power.

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US Navy cruiser design in the years leading up to 1920 was focused on two main types of new cruisers. The first was a class of scout cruisers which would eventually become the Omaha Class; the second was a new class of battle cruisers which was started, but never completed. By 1920, Scout Cruisers were classified as First Line Light Cruisers by the US Navy. The most outstanding US scout cruiser was certainly the Omaha class. Once naval aviation began to provide float planes for use on cruisers and battleships, the scout cruiser's role declined in importance so that none were built after about 1925

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ORIGINAL: Miller

Secondly, I laugh at suggestions that this was not a suicide mission. Why? Because the aim of this DD was to spot the KB by being attacked.

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Edited: I do it also, using a single destroyer to bombard an island to check for coastal guns, yes I loose the ship however the recon work is done in process. Besides what good am I going to use a destroyer with 2 ASW rating and weak 3inch guns? nothing.

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Irrespective of the notion of suicide missions, is there a problem with the game failing to properly prosecute attacks on single ship TFs?

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ORIGINAL: Dili

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Edited: I do it also, using a single destroyer to bombard an island to check for coastal guns, yes I loose the ship however the recon work is done in process. Besides what good am I going to use a destroyer with 2 ASW rating and weak 3inch guns? nothing.

You illustrated perfectly the problem. In real world there are people inside those destroyers. Some in this game like to try simulate human behavior in War, others want to just win.

That is why i said it was culturally gamey, an American Commander would never think like you.