some minor things to be fixed

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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns >> some minor things to be fixed

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some minor things to be fixed - 7/28/2002 8:10:52 PM

ruxius

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From: ITALY
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------------------- ISSUE 1

I played a small tank battle (only minor tanks) just for fun...
German against AI soviets in 1942
decisive vicotry... , I destroyed all the enemy tanks and crew
I had no casualties at all...

Looking at the score I found 8 losses have been scored against me...wondering why that could have happened I finally
discovered a reason...

8 men were the only two crews I bailed out for recon purposes and then never bailed in again...

since they survived the battle with no casualties I don't think they should be counted as losses..they were not spread all around out of contact , but together with all other units and their HQ next to their equipment which was perfect...

that will give wrong numbers in larger battles and most of all in tourneys were one may want to deduce losses by what is reported in the final score table.

-------------------ISSUE 2

The only payback I had implementing my cooperative campaigns
was the cumbersome repairing procedure of vehicles & units for the next battle...
unit letter is not displayed , save button is absent , so the only thing to do is that player 1 writes a note counting
rows for equipment to be repaired/changed , hoping that the other player get the proper FIX & CHANGES operation for the former and for himself...

this was standard for us , but now we found a minor bug I would ask if you can experience as well...

It happens that some damaged units especially infantry units
which undertook some damage are then displayed with DAMAGE 0 into the repair menu...

Hence You don't fix them but the following battle right-clicking on them you can find damage was the same it suffered the previous battle ..so you now must remember to also fix units which are 0 damaged...

----------------------------

Please let me know if anyone else can experience the same things
Thx

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Post #: 1

- 7/29/2002 6:33:53 AM

G_X

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As to Issue 1...

This has to do with the fact that if you force a crew to bail out from their vehicle (Either by them getting fired on and bailing, or by you bailing them out) They are no longer a combat effective vehicle, so this is not a bug in any way/shape/form, and they are losses.

Besides, if I was a tank commander and saw my Tank crews hopping out and taking walks around the tank in the middle of a fight, they'd find themselves back home in a prison camp for not doing their job.

Easy solution, don't take all tanks, take a few Artillery FOs or something, and load them onto the decks of your tanks, when you need some Infantry-Quality eyes, these guys are the best, you just have them unload, do what they need to do, hop back on the tank deck, and you move on.

As to Tournaments and such being shifted by this rule...I highly doubt that it would really come into play, if more people used their tank crews for scouting, (Errr...I still think it's dumb...) then maybe.

Issue Two!

I use the Fix All button during campaigns (I always have more than enough points to repair everything, seeing as I don't play a "Throw it at the enemy" game...) It repairs all the units that have damage on them, simple as that. As for changing and such, If I was doing a Co-op campaign, I'd just write down which units I wanted changed (Say, my 2nd Panzer Company changed from PzIIIf's to PzIIIj's) And whoever could do the changes would have to do it, heh.

I always rename my units for organizational purposes in campaigns, I split my Panzer Companies up and renamed them, and then have a quasi-database, just a sheet of paper, and write down what they're all equipped with, I never mix tanks in a company unless the company has a CS detachment or something, and for Infantry I just write down the orginizations of each group, which isn't hard for me, just a few extra minutes of work at the begining of the campaign.

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Post #: 2

- 7/29/2002 9:46:03 AM

john g

Posts: 984
Joined: 10/6/2000
From: college station, tx usa
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by G_X
[B]As to Issue 1...

.

Besides, if I was a tank commander and saw my Tank crews hopping out and taking walks around the tank in the middle of a fight, they'd find themselves back home in a prison camp for not doing their job.

[/B][/QUOTE]

Strange, even Michael Wittmann was known to do that, and very few tankers were better than he was.
thanks, John.

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Post #: 3

- 7/29/2002 11:32:23 AM

G_X

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From: Atlanta, Georgia
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If they were inspecting the tank (The way I think of a bailed out crew that got bailed by incoming fire) Or retreating to keep from getting slaughtered, I understand it, it's the idea of my tank crews, who are usually 90-100 experience in my campaigns, getting out of the tanks, and being vulnerable, in a fight, by scouting ahead.

I have units that do that as their job, my tankers can continue to do theirs.

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Post #: 4

- 7/29/2002 3:25:47 PM

ruxius

Posts: 909
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From: ITALY
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ISSUE 1
Thanks G_X for your point , but I find this may be a sort of personal perspective that can not be a rule for each crew
bails out..I had better to read losses as dispersed or killed men..
especially in campaigns your suggestion has some fault as the very next battle crews are included in your oob ..I would also say
that if some crew are not bailed out but their vehicle is damaged they risk to be counted as missed...but you will find them back
the next battle..
PLease don't think I enjoy to find new bugs and point out that for discredit...not my intentions...
I think that is something that simply had never be realized by programmers and maybe will be some day in the future..
that's why I am talking about..

ISSUE 2
Playing cooperative means be organized like you showed the first battles..but when upgrades take place units can become mixed..
I usually divided units in two main parts...units from A0) to say G0) are by player 1 ....the following belong to player 2
So there is no problem in misunderstanding which units are mine or not...the problem is generally related to the fact the the second player is not friendly with units of the first player...so
when he has to change those units (since ONLY ONE PLAYER can do repairs at a time ) ( I have many times asked one simple save button there to allow two players to repair by their own but ... :(
)
anyway..since no letter for units changing is not so easy....

Experience shows that as I had to ask my coop player many times to do back the work as he failed either to fix or change or failed the proper slot...

As regards damaged infantry units which are shown 0 damage I would please ask you to check about this...I want to be sure
it's not only a problem of mine....

If infantry units get a damage I think that must be displayed..
I remember the old sp was doing that stuff...
Thx for your contributes !

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Post #: 5

No more fixes - 7/30/2002 1:17:58 AM

Supervisor

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No more fixes for SPWAW it's a done deal, the only thing left is the last Lost Victories patch which is still in testing. Your wishes and wants should now be directed to the Combat Leader forum.

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Post #: 6

- 7/30/2002 2:42:28 AM

ruxius

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Ok , Thank you for information...
I will move this post that place .
Here I wouild only know if someone experienced the same problem...(I know many of you are on holiday..but please do a try so that I can see how many share this problem..and so if this i srelevant in CL terms )
Bye

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Re: No more fixes - 7/30/2002 5:17:33 AM

GYBLIN

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[QUOTE]Originally posted by gmenfan
[B]No more fixes for SPWAW it's a done deal, the only thing left is the last Lost Victories patch which is still in testing. Your wishes and wants should now be directed to the Combat Leader forum. [/B][/QUOTE]

Ah tis a sad post indeed.I just wanted the crash bug fixed.:(

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Post #: 8

- 7/30/2002 6:49:27 AM

G_X

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I wonder if we could beg Matrix for the Source Code after the last LV patch, if we could, and we had a group of dedicated people, we might be able to make our own fixes...

Just a thought.

Sorry Ruxius...I don't think you're understanding me, I mean to say that the game engine calculates units that are not capable fighting units (Dispersed/Destroyed infantry squads, Destroyed tanks, Abandoned tanks, so on) Are counted as losses, and since a tank without a crew is abandoned, the tank counts as a loss, the crew doesn't.

I've noticed this because in campaigns where my tank gets abandoned by a crew falling back, I only get one loss for that tank, but if the crew dies after bailing out, they count as dead too.

It's hard for me to explain, but basically if you look closely, it makes sense...sorry, I don't have a good way to explain it.

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- 7/30/2002 7:36:53 AM

Supervisor

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It is possible for the opponenet to gain multiple kills for the same unit over and over again. Heres how, if you bail=1 kill, if that bailed crew gets killed=1 kill, if the vehicle gets destroyed=1 kill, if the crew recrews and bails again=1 kill and so on and so on.

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Post #: 10

- 7/30/2002 7:47:34 AM

G_X

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I think gmenfan, that you've mentioned before that a consistently bailing crew can rack up kills, but I think when they recrew the vehicle/weapon, that it's removed as a kill, that seems to be what the new info (That only the two crews who weren't crewing tanks at the end of the game were counted as kills) show that you can only gain kills if the crew is bailed, then gets killed.

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- 7/30/2002 3:04:44 PM

ruxius

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Ok , I think we are clearing the point....it seems ot so deep checkings have been done when deciding to assigning kills on bailing out..

Now..we all know and if we don't it's better to repeat it again
WE ALL SHOULD KNOW what was SP1 and what costed to MAtrix get that code...change it and get it modified with success...

I know a little about programming...so I know what is behind any happening ..I also know that many of us didn't deserved too much efforts from Matrix (not me ) since the MEGACD didn't sell as expected..so I understand and in someway approve they will not
loose too much time and resources in SPWAW...that's something we have to realize ..only few paid the bill..I couldn't count mmore than 100 Loyalists..purchasers have been surely more....
but people who signed the list were no more than 100 over at least 4000 registered members...

so I don't expect nothing....

back to the point...it seems there is a simple check..: do the unit bailed out ? one kill signed...crew recorded as destroyed..
simple as that..
if only we deserved more we could ask for more checkings ..did the crew bailed out vouluntarily ? ok no losses signed..
is the vehicle damaged ok after crews bailed out ok 1 kills to the enemy and so on....

Think which kind of trick I had to do to remove damages for ISSUE 2 : I had to spend all repairing points (but I wanted some vehicles to stay unrepaired...)
exausted the points I pressed the FIX ALL button...
then I fixed each single unit which was reporting 0 damage....but again a bug..it opened the change menu..(while it was only a fixing operation )
anyway at least I finally had my units with 0 damage...

as regards getting the source code I don't think they can...
they had an agreement with SSI that they can not sell the game
but only modifying it and make it available for free...
(terrible SSI ! WHY ???? COULDN'T YOU AGREE SOME PERCENTAGE AND MAKE IT SELLABLE AGAIN ? YOU GOT xxx% and
MATRIX 100-XXX % ...I REALLY CAN'T UNDERSTAND !!! Matrix Would have worked to give you money again !!! what you would have lost ????? TERRIBLE TERRIBLE !!!!)
so ..due to this agreement Matrix I am sure will not give its code around becuase he could not control any of us who decides to change code and sell the game..this would violate SSI agreements and Matrix should pay...

So I think we have no hope to get the Code...

but I am sure one thing can be easily done...

After Matrix finds she had a good return from selling CL and /or CA
she could decide to open a section here where players of spwaw reports any bug or changements...
Matrix finds the segment of code who can be responsible for the bug and group of volunteers could be offered to work on that portion...
they will not be able to rebuild the whole game...but they will
be able to make Matrix programmers save their time and resources...and they will not violate agreement with SSI..

G_X sign my address I will gladly help you in any of these programming tasks if you ever get the stuff "!

well that AFTER Matrix had his deserved money from CL and CA...
we players CAN NOT ALWAYS THINK EVERYTHING IS FREE as
IT DOESN'T COMES FROM VOID FOR FREE...it COSTS SACRIFICE ALWAYS TO MANY....

so for having it free ACTUAL SPWAW IS MUUUUUUUCCCCCHHH
MOOOOOOOORE THAN WHAT WE CAN EVER HOPE RIGHT ?
So spend your money ...

never forget Matrix was ready to go further in spwaw if only
MEGACD sold more copies...
THAT DIDN'T HAPPENED..so also our expectations have been
frustrated...

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Re: No more fixes - 7/30/2002 5:15:06 PM

Belisarius

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[QUOTE]Originally posted by gmenfan
[B] Your wishes and wants should now be directed to the Combat Leader forum. [/B][/QUOTE]

They are. :D
Do you guys have a date for beta release?

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- 7/30/2002 5:43:24 PM

Supervisor

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Nothing firm, were still trying to work out some graphic issues before releasing a beta for play testing, its a slow process.

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Post #: 14

- 7/31/2002 1:30:37 AM

G_X

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CA's not my kinda game, and CL might be, if I've got their themes right...

I'm probably going to go out and buy CL, and I've noticed most of my wishes are already in CL...as long as it doesn't get overly complicated...

There are of course ways to get the code...you could decompile the mech.exe and such and so on...but doing things like this without a proper code & file structure map may not be advisable. I'm not sure if that's going against Matrix's pact with SSI or not, but it would be alot of work.

Most of all of what I've seen that really needs to be done for SP:WaW is OOB stuff, minor things that if we ~really~ wanted to as a community, we could make work, by creating updates and simply releasing them on the Armor Site and Tankhead's and such. We could keep updating OOBs and Scenarios. I do however feel many people would simply rather buy CL/CA and beg Matrix to fix every tiny thing wrong with it that they can find. Oh well, WaW has a place on my HD for a while to come yet. Especially if what I understand about CL needing a good graphics card is true :\

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- 7/31/2002 2:10:01 AM

GYBLIN

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Excellent summary gx!Hell spwaw is so good i just played a hour long battle and lost it because i forgot to save and the game just crashed,but you know what?I didnt bother me too much.I keep reminding myself this was a FREE game,and a **** good one.How many times can we say we downloaded something this good for free?Btw whats is Ca? CL looks like a pumped up panzer general at least by the graphics.Who knows?:p

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Post #: 16

As far as the game crashing I have found - 7/31/2002 2:23:11 AM

Gary Tatro

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That if you shut off your screen saver that your games will not crash nearly as often. Just my observation.

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- 7/31/2002 2:35:24 AM

GYBLIN

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Not to sound frustrated but i have NO screen savers.Im running as bare bones system as i can.i have no tsr's in the backround and i have the latest version of direct x.If i strip my system any more i wont be able to boot.thanks though.:)

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Post #: 18

- 7/31/2002 2:48:30 AM

ruxius

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I too don't like real-time games..but I recognizes CA will make
lan party games with many players a real thing..and I think we can call ourself lucky we can have such a choice ...(for me no choice..both of them )
But spwaw is love at first thing..it's like I married mother SP an daughter CL,..I know this is not legal in my country...they call incest ?? right ?

well happy to be incestuos that way :)))))

As regards any code fixing that can be only if Matrix gives us support and permission..again I think they would be interested
only if they get enough satisfied with CL..and so I hope...
that way they could simply let spwaw enhance with free supporters help...

it's not true only oobs may need some changes..(but they need )
but also code..
many minor fixes could be done..ecc.ecc. but we obviously need
experienced people on that code...

spwaw should not take people far from CL..you may understand...

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Post #: 19