Matrix Games Forums

 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

RE: Newest Version of D21

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> RE: Newest Version of D21 Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Newest Version of D21 - 11/25/2013 12:20:31 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Confirmed, rail is ok.

Btw: I had not time to play much, but meanwhile Stalingrad and Leningrad are "liberated" from the reds It seems that the Russians indeed tried a kind of counterstroke at Stalingrad as it was historical the case. But a) My Wehrmacht is much stronger than the historic one (cause I of course tried to preserve my strenght more than Hitler did) and b) I already captured some area north and south of Stalingrad were the "historic" assembly area of the red counterattack troops were.

However it seem when winter comes it might be Germans get in trouble, cause the lines are very long and the area to defend is huge. In the far south mostly allied armies tried to capture Novorossk (sp?). But there is only one direction this city can be attacked. So it would mean frontal attacks. The Russians have a strong arty unit as support. It maybe that the Allies can capture the city and advance on the coast road, but only with huge losses. It is questionable if it is worth it. Even if the Germans in game might have more units then the Germans in reality I recon this area cannot defended. So Russians might cut supply lines if they only send enough units. Axis could maybe make a strategic retreat back to a shorter line and concentrate on Moscow.

But what if Moscow is taken ? This might be a win then. But it seems the game will become very boring after that. Of course the Russians still have a lot of stuff and more than enough land even if Moscow falls.

So the current plan is to fall back before the winter comes to a defense line and see what the enemy does with that situation. Might be more interesting, also it would be cool to see how the better does the Axis will get. Like Tigers, Panthers and FW190 fighters. Russians will get therefore new T34s and SUs in masse. The (I)Su122 and (I)Su152 have somewhat too high AT values in the game, so could be interesting too see how much that helps the red army. While Tiger, Panther are a bit weaker than in reality.....(or 88mm guns generally in this vanilla database)

(in reply to TPOO)
Post #: 121
RE: Newest Version of D21 - 1/3/2014 2:47:34 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Had some more turns and Fritz decided to step back a bit, plan is to give up Stalingrad, retreat in good order form the city to the Kalach area there form a temporary defensive line. Also we will give up the crimea and most of the Caucasus. So far Russians are too weak to interfere seriously with our movements to the west and north. Now the rain/mud time has arrived and the front comes to a halt. It is early Nov 42...


(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 122
RE: Newest Version of D21 - 1/9/2014 4:51:59 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Russians applied maskirovska it seems, as the 42 winter offensive of theirs broke loose. Reds got much more reeinforcements then expected. Mechcorps, guards and huge arty divisions are some examples. The wrong impression the Germans got, lead them to not withdraw to some better lines instead hold more eastern territory. They struggle however to hold those lines now, as Russians have more units. Some breakthroughs by the Reds were already achieved.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 1/9/2014 5:56:07 PM >

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 123
RE: Newest Version of D21 - 1/9/2014 4:57:49 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Kalinin still holds, but not long anymore I guess:

Also forgot that rivers are frozen now and don´t pose big difficulties for the eastern hordes to cross :(

Railed in reeinforcements, let´s hope for the best.






Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 1/9/2014 6:13:34 PM >

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 124
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/11/2014 2:44:12 PM   
solops

 

Posts: 814
Joined: 1/31/2002
From: Central Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

For those looking for the latest see post #42 on page 2 of this thread.

That would be the latest for TOAW 3.4, that is.


Thanks so much! This is really important and hard to find information that, I suspect, the majority of us are scrambling for. You guys who do so much of the work probably don't realize how many of us play, but don't keep up-to-the-minute on the developments.
Thanks again.

_____________________________

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.-Edmund Burke
Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; if it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it.-Judge Learned Hand

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 125
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/11/2014 3:55:45 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		How or where do I find the latest version of D21?

Thanks.

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
Valor & Victory
DG CWIE 2
SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

(in reply to solops)
Post #: 126
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/11/2014 4:12:50 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		Hi Don ... its at the link on page 2, in post 42, of this thread.

(in reply to Zovs)
Post #: 127
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/11/2014 4:18:23 PM   
governato

 

Posts: 1079
Joined: 5/6/2011
From: Seattle, WA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

Hi Don ... its at the link on page 2, in post 42, of this thread.



May I suggest putting a link to the scenario one the first post of this thread? A lot easier to find and still easy to update.

Also, Alpha77, would you add a screen capture of the whole frontline? :)

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 128
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/11/2014 4:45:48 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		Thank you!

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
Valor & Victory
DG CWIE 2
SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

(in reply to governato)
Post #: 129
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/16/2014 8:58:29 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Whow the Russian stuff just keeps coming, they are like the Medusa. If you cut off one head, 2 new ones will grow

Its now Jan 43 and we had to give up the Kalach line in the South, we are now somewhere in the Millerowo - Woroschilowgrad area Russians have pushed guards and tank stuff in masses forward without waiting for their supply to arrive. In the north we still hold Leningrad, there we at least managed to destroy masses of units, but only because we still had all the arty up there we needed to capture Leningrad. Most of the arty is now moved to the south and middle section as the north seems the least trouble at the moment. Center Russians have pushed us further away from Moscow, but moved stuff from Leningrad area and stabilized front.
However Russians pushed out our Tula garrison last week

Also now at the Crimea the Russian comes, we only have minimum garrison to keep them sealed up their: 1 single Rumanian corpse plus some German engs and 1 higher HQ. Nutti´more, cause moved everything to the Millerovo area breakthrough of Russian guards mechs+tanks.

They also now have new fearsome units: Artillery divisions !

I noted there are much too much LR 122mm and 152mm guns for the red site ??? They have all 3 hexes range. I guess in reality the Russian arty was fearsome, but I do not believe they had masses of guns with this range (which means triple the range of German standard 155mm Howitzer in game terms!!)..... Also if they used a much stronger charge too fire too much higher distance the AP value of the shell will decrease, but this is not the case. Or was this added to this scen, to give the German more troubles?


@ governato: Will post some screens later maybe :)



< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 1/16/2014 10:04:59 PM >

(in reply to Zovs)
Post #: 130
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 1/17/2014 11:54:42 AM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline
quote:

... there are much too much LR 122mm and 152mm guns for the red ...


All of the Arty has been reworked. The predominant tubes on both sides now have a 2 hex range. Here is a Soviet Arty Div from the yet to be released v3 :




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 131
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/1/2014 10:41:47 AM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Well revisited this game. Could give a bunch of suggestions but not sure if a) there will be still updates for this scen b) that these are more game mechanics than scen specific and c) that I play the latest version - can someone point me to the latest Dir21??

I am now in 4/43. Short AAR....

Far south: As I wrote above the Reds practically were able to chase (or better partly it was a planned backwards move) me back to an ara around Rostow from the caucasus and some river in the south. However they exhausted their supply too and with the help of only 2-3 German divs the IT/RUM allies were able to encircle some enemies and establish a stable front - Rostow is save and we could even advance again down south now as their lines seem thin now. Also we gave up the KRIMand took defensive position on the smallest portion of the peninsula (only 3 hexes to cover). Reds advanced after us, but weren´t able to break the lines (or better did not even tried as the defenders were fully rested and at ca. 70-80 of max. level for equipment).

South: Even if the storm of Guards units seemed quite threatening in direction of Woroshilograd and even they seemed to aim at Charkow or Rostow, they didn´t reach any of those cities. SS Pzgren Divs returned from re-fit and helped out. Also here the enemy seemed to be too careless in his advance as he could be flanked or better we can give ground and as our rested units from the hinterlands arrived, they were stopped and sometimes encircled. However we need to stress how important Artillery is for this process. Without strong arty (and preferably longer range ones - for counter battery fire) you will lose, because the Russians have now fearfull strong arty themselfes. As was suggested above their may be an error in the range of soviet medium arty. Even if your line seems stable, the enemy arty will bombard you untill you are "undigged" and then attack with the masses. The undigged unit(s) will almost everytime retreat because of the losses from massive arty as well losing their trenches and dugouts. In winter or frozen steppe even more dangerous. Long time, we feared that this could not be countered as air strikes won´t work (first the air is generally a bit too weak in bombing and second the USSR has air superiority in most parts of the map). So 2 things will work, a) massive own arty and b) own flanking fast units to get the enemy gunners. Even if are desperate to hold a line and give units ignore losses at defense that leads to burn out of the Wehrmacht, so no option. Better apply the more flexible strategy which also Manstein and others used and/or proposed in the real world.

Rest of text soon

Also Question!! regarding AIR: Were there really only ca. 65-70 HS129 planes (2 units) in up tp 4/43 and also only 3 or 4 FW190A units ?? Even if both planes seem slightly underrated in database they are the best I have, but only so few units that take them. There ares stockpiles of both types. Also the JU88 + ME109 late pile is quite huge, but both are not good enough anymore vs. modern Russian air or better also US/UK air (spitfire late, Hurricanes, P39 give headaches in addition to the usual YAK/MIG/LA stuff - as noted above it is now clear the leisure play of first 2 turns might now haunt me at least in the air. 1000+ planes attacks from red air force happen which also have quite a number of older types which I better should have destroyed early on).



< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 6/1/2014 11:56:27 AM >

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 132
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/1/2014 6:48:45 PM   
TPOO

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 11/15/2007
From: Garden Grove, CA
Status: offline 		There is a new version ready for play whenever TOAW 3.6 (or whatever it will be called) is released. It has been ready for 2 years.

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 133
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/1/2014 9:59:11 PM   
BigDuke66


Posts: 2013
Joined: 2/1/2001
From: Terra
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TPOO
It has been ready for 2 years.

Sigh.


_____________________________

JOIN The Blitz Wargaming Club
JOIN Napoleonic Wargame Club
JOIN American Civil War Game Club

(in reply to TPOO)
Post #: 134
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/3/2014 2:46:25 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline
quote:

Were there really only ca. 65-70 HS129 planes ...


We went thru http://www.ww2.dk/ to find out what units were where at what time and what planes they had. So, if anybody finds a mistake let us know. Otherwise, it is what it is.

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 135
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/4/2014 10:08:58 AM   
SMK-at-work

 

Posts: 3396
Joined: 8/28/2000
From: New Zealand
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

quote:

Were there really only ca. 65-70 HS129 planes ...


We went thru http://www.ww2.dk/ to find out what units were where at what time and what planes they had. So, if anybody finds a mistake let us know. Otherwise, it is what it is.


I thought I'd do a quick 3rd party check of Hs129 units, and had a quick look at another site that is referenced on the Hs129 wiki page- http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de - it is in German, but much is intelligible such as aircraft types and dates, and you can always pass it through google translate too.

I checked the 2 pages for Schlachtgeschwader 1 - SG1 (no, not THAT SG1!) and there were some differences.

http://www.ww2.dk/air/attack/sg1.htm and
http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Gliederungen/Schlachtgeschwader/SG1.htm

The lexicon site gives a longer history - from first formation in 1942 with Hs129's & Me109's, the 109's being replaced by 190's in 1943 and disbandment. It then has a separate page for the "new" SG1 formed late in 1943 - http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Gliederungen/Schlachtgeschwader/SG1N.htm - this corresponds to the ww2.dk page.

Gruppe 2 of the original SG1 became part of SG2 according to the lexicon, so I checked the SG2 pages, and there's a difference there - the Lexicon gives SG2 Hs129s, but again the unit was disbanded in late 1943 and the ww2.dk site doesn't cover the first iteration of it.

So still trying to trace the Hs129's, the lexicon says that II Gruppe of SG2 went to Gruppe 1 of SG4 - but both sites give SG4 as having 190's.

And at that point I pretty much gave up.

Dunno if it is of any use, but it was a bit of fun on a cold winter evening :)

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 136
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/4/2014 1:03:00 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline 		Thanks, and I'll add that ww2.dk has the HS-129's going to SG9 in 1943, and that is what happens in the scenario.

(in reply to SMK-at-work)
Post #: 137
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/4/2014 3:51:58 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Probably there were not many HS129 units, also the production number was quite low.

Here is quite a bit of info:
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=8810


Well, in TOAW the air component isn´t that important it seems, as the Russians have air superiority in this scen basically since end of 41 or so lol Sure I ****ed up the air war at the beginning of campaign. HS129 not so important, I would like some FW190s rather, sometimes the Russian air attacks travelling units even int rains which is quite annoying. Does not do much damage, but readiness drops and movement is reduced. I wonder if there is a priority somehow build in to attack lone engineer units and HQ´s ? A poor eng is bombed by 500 planes lol.

I decided to revise the scen a bit (downloaded latest version which is 2.3 iirc) mainly delete some German units and give Russian some more protection for Moscow and Leningrad. Also of course the replacements can now be edited with 200 turn experience. Seems some categories are a bit off (they maybe even historical right but eg. Germans have too much stuff in some categories which builds up and they never need to worry to run out, which seems not helpful). Guess a new TOAW patch won´t come soon, so in the meantime I will maybe start over with the revised version and see how it goes. I wonder if it is possible to edit 2 - 3 suprises somehow, like airdrops, amphib landings and hot Russian soldiers wifes suporting the Mosscow front when Germans reach the city gates

BTW: I wonder if we should let the Russian have a portion (which is still to be determined) of the 122mm ER guns. I guess he needs the longer range, but not in the masses like before. An idea would be to leave him ca. 50% of the 122mm ER and the other half will be "normal" 122mm with 2 hex range. I checked the OOB and found that he has only little amount of other LR/ER guns (180mm?) so it would be ok. Germans have 150mm with 3 hexes too. Yes, not to many... but if one babysits his artillery there shouldn´t be too much losses of those. So maybe even downgrade some 150mm ER to "normal" (?) To make long range fire a bit more scarce for the Wehrmacht. 210mm ER need some editing too.

It is now June 43 and Germans (well more brave allies of them) storm the Caucasus again, seems the capture everything they lost during the "retreat" in winter. Leningrad is in save hands and suddenly some Russian units dissapear in the far north. What was mostly a "sitzkrieg" or trench warfare up there became fluid again, as Fins&Gerris probe the enemy lines.......and they are quite thin.

Also in the center outskirts of Moscow were reached, there is now a never to be seen concentration of military in the area. Moved some stuff south - maybe to misslead the opponent. Later moved everything and more back to the center front


With some more work done on this Directive 21 might be the definitive east front "game" (even if only a scen - it could be standalone game). I don´t need "war in the east" - even if i´m normally Grigbsy&co. fan



< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 6/4/2014 5:33:59 PM >

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 138
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/4/2014 4:57:06 PM   
Freyr Oakenshield


Posts: 541
Joined: 4/25/2014
Status: offline 		Can you play d21 (the old or the new version) H2H without serious issues (just like we play FitE)?

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 139
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/4/2014 8:29:26 PM   
TPOO

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 11/15/2007
From: Garden Grove, CA
Status: offline 		Directive 21 is only for German Human Player vs Russian AI. Most of the events will not fire correctly in hot seat or PBEM.
If you want Head to Head you will have to wait for FITE 2.

(in reply to Freyr Oakenshield)
Post #: 140
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/4/2014 9:44:42 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline
quote:

in TOAW the air component isn´t that important it seems, as the Russians have air superiority in this scen basically since end of 41


But if you like playing the air war, it can provide some fun, although it adds time and planning to the scenario. Example - It's 1943 and you want to conduct an offensive, say a double pincer somewhere that looks good enough to net you a nice bag of Soviet units. I won't go into minutia as it would take paragraphs, but move all German air units to the area. Assign some missions, use some in direct support if you want, leave others unassigned (in reserve for later). As the attack progresses there will be some serious air combat. Eventually some of you air units will be reduced and exhausted. Move those away from the action and then start using your 'reserve' units. This type of local concentration and rotation of units can achieve nice results.

quote:

the 122mm ER guns


The artillery for both sides was revised for the version in limbo. Sadly, I lost my notes and can't provide the specifics ... but its better !


< Message edited by sPzAbt653 -- 6/4/2014 10:45:16 PM >

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 141
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/7/2014 4:00:38 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Freyr Oakenshield

Can you play d21 (the old or the new version) H2H without serious issues (just like we play FitE)?



Then you need 2 very reliable players with even more free time. Already vs. PO this is a monster scenario and a turn can take up to 1 hour for beginners. I restarted now with the new version and seome changes made mostly in the equip and replacement categories. And as I am now I would "intermediate" level in this scen I am now much faster too move stuff and make decissions etc. But I believe 1st time play is very time consuming if done correctly (which means thinking over your moves and taking care of all your units)...

This reminds me of WITPAE - I can´t imagine how to play this one H2H per e-mail. What if you make 50 turns of such monster scens and then 1 of the players drops out ? This is one reason why I only played smaller games like SP H2H :)

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 6/7/2014 5:02:53 PM >

(in reply to Freyr Oakenshield)
Post #: 142
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/7/2014 4:27:54 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

quote:

in TOAW the air component isn´t that important it seems, as the Russians have air superiority in this scen basically since end of 41


But if you like playing the air war, it can provide some fun, although it adds time and planning to the scenario. Example - It's 1943 and you want to conduct an offensive, say a double pincer somewhere that looks good enough to net you a nice bag of Soviet units. I won't go into minutia as it would take paragraphs, but move all German air units to the area. Assign some missions, use some in direct support if you want, leave others unassigned (in reserve for later). As the attack progresses there will be some serious air combat. Eventually some of you air units will be reduced and exhausted. Move those away from the action and then start using your 'reserve' units. This type of local concentration and rotation of units can achieve nice results.

quote:

the 122mm ER guns


The artillery for both sides was revised for the version in limbo. Sadly, I lost my notes and can't provide the specifics ... but its better !



Yup, you are right regarding the air war. However of course I tried concentrations etc. Main prob is not enough fighter units and some of em too small range (BF109). I "lost" over 200 aircraft in one of those offensives - mostly bombers. In one event they attacked almost unescorted with only 1 ME110 Geschwader hat the range. 100 losses for me 80 for the Russian or so. He just laughes about this because as I know now he has in 1943 May-June still over 10000 fighters of all types in stock :) However issue is not the plane numbers but unit numbers. I also have ca. 500x111s 800x88s and about 2000xmodern fighters (109 late, FWs)in stock. But no units who would take them Interestingly even the untis that took devastating losses by these airfield attacks described above were back to 100% in short time. Amazingly also most of their PROF did not drop. It seems somehow most of the experienced pilots made it back to base or most of the "losses" were only damaged and limped back with teir crew to fight another day....

Checked the arty and decided to split 122normal and 122ER for the Russian - he keeps 40-60% of the ER guns (dont now exact number). A change the D21 team already made was to exchange the 1hex range old WW1 howitzer to the more recent 150mm with 2 hexes (in the game named "guns" but were historically called howitzer).

I tried to cope with the editor to make more changes for a new game, but got frustrated. Working and changing formations seem a nightmare. It is easy however to edit replacements and equipment luckily. I tried also to make some experimental units - like late war jet bombers and an SP arty unit. But noted it is too time consuming and it seems to be just to complicated to work in a already complete scen with this massive unit number. But I was able to just change some stuff to "not reconstitute" so German player needs to take more care also he lost ca. 40-50 units. Mostly smaller ones but also some Divs. Also combined some small stuff to one bigger unit so less workload with moving all the tiny stuff around.


Russians had massive losses in this game, in June 43 they finally ran out of stuff - even squads. Only planes they had in masses like written above. I ended the first game in turn 215 or so with MOSCOW&MURMANSK&MAIKOP taken. Fins were moving towards Archangelsk too. Reached the southern most border of the map with Italians&Hungrians. The Rumanians moved then towards the remaing oilfields around Grozny etc. But I quit the game as it made no sense anymore. However I note this was the older version from the game folder....
I believe vic level was 2700 or so. But I am confident that the edited and new version of D21 will provide better challenge - in most categories the Germans loose stuff - only in the air I gave them 2 or 3 better units (means FW190s when they arrive) also combined some of allied air. Therefore they lose all the minor planes like PZL or G50 or Do17 etc. From which are only tiny numbers available anyway. Means OOB is not historical anymore.

QUESTION:
Is it allowed to upload this revised version of D21 2.3 for play testing by someone in this forum ?? Or is there a more busy forum for TOAW ? It seems a bit empty here :(

IDEA:
Maybe you could use some of the changes in the next and probably final version when (if) TOAW patch 3.5 finally arrives.... however we need to designate my changes as experimental and not historical correct. Mainly to provide better play and test some alternative units. Like the SP arty or jet bombers...

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 143
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/7/2014 4:39:55 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Sorry for the all the babling... I forgot to mention also took note of your suggestions in the OP, so I deleted the AG HQs along with some others. As well tried the more horses option in few inf divs. Means they lose trucks and gain horses and so should be a bit slower which rises the German players challenge. It is only done in 10 divs or so to test it out....

Lets see:

- Removal of the OKH unit (it serves no purpose). NOPE - it should be possible to kill these nazi bastards in Berlin finally. Lets imagine that Hitler is in this unit lol

- Remove the Army Group HQ units (they also serve no purpose). YES ! Done.

- Rolling the independant artillery units into the corps and army hq units. This would give both of these type units a purpose.
MAYBE - Made 1 or 2 of these to test it.

- Making the later panzer divisions one unit instead of three. - NOPE a) To much work and b) historically Germans used often these KGs because there was so much need for panzers at the whole front, so they needed to spread them out

- A possible theater option for 'Guderian style' panzer divisions. MAYBE - not tried cause I dont want/know how to edit events.

- Organize the German divisions into corps formations. NOPE - would mean can not cover the huge frontline. Leave as is imho.

- Put some of the German Inf Div's back to 3 regiments. This involves the 300 series ones. MAYBE - but also much work to edit I guess. But it is treu that German Inf divs are very powerful and fully rested very strong. However I hope in my experimental version they get weaker because of less replacements. The player then needs to decide which ones he must rest so they get combat power back. So more challenge to rest inf divs that they stay powerful imo.

- Remove trucks from German Inf Div's. MAYBE - made ca. 10 of these but not all trucks deleted because they actually HAD trucks maybe not that much like now in the scen.

Additionally Germans get some stuff later - they must cope now with some turns of no replacements at ALL



< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 6/7/2014 6:00:00 PM >

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 144
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/7/2014 5:34:45 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Well I got to involved in TOAW lol. I need to do some work which I disregarded, but like the saying goes "fun before work". In reality is is of course "erst die Arbeit dann der Spaß". Don´t know if this saying exists in English too

Well here are finally some examples of changes to equipment from the top of my head (luckily I have quite some experience with this from my "modern" database, so was a fast process).

- Ranges of some planes corrected (eg. JU87 less, P40 more...)
- All (bomber+jabo) planes now have higher AP value, to enable them to do some damage like they should
- 88mm + 85mm AT corrected and all the tanks that use them
- Panther,Tiger,Hetzer,KVs,T34s,M3 Lee, ISU, Geschwagen etc. edited
- Light squads and cav lose AT/AA value (they shouldn´t be able to carry MGs and RPGs, Panzerfausts etc which are the weapons which provide - if even small - AT or AA capability)
- KVs get a higher AP value, it is factored in a "shock" factor which these monsters had in early war vs. infantry with only light AT weapons to defend. Also armor plus 1 point.
- All BTs are now "fast" as they should, therefore Elefant,Tiger2 etc. are now "slow"
- M3 Lee gain + 2 AT, as the creator of the database seems to have forgot that they had an 75mm howitzer installed in the bow, not only the 37mm in the turret

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 6/7/2014 6:41:38 PM >

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 145
RE: D21 v2.3 - 6/7/2014 5:55:48 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653

I wish there was something we could do to speed it up. Sometimes even I get frustrated waiting up to 2 hours for Elmer to figure out what he is doing.


This seems solved as turns went fast for me (the pc is Win7 64bit, 1GB Ram and 2x2.33mhz Intel Core Duo - so not the most modern one), I suspect the severe slowdown comes from the log files that you might have enabled. I enabled them to check combat resolution for a short time and this caused massive slowdown !

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 146
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/7/2014 7:05:41 PM   
sPzAbt653


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline
quote:

Is it allowed to upload this revised version of D21 2.3 for play testing by someone in this forum ?? Or is there a more busy forum for TOAW ? It seems a bit empty here :(


You should start another thread with the title of your mod and list the changes you made. Then those that are interested can contact you for a copy.

I don't know if there are any other forums that are busier.

< Message edited by sPzAbt653 -- 6/7/2014 8:06:11 PM >

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 147
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/9/2014 12:43:39 PM   
TPOO

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 11/15/2007
From: Garden Grove, CA
Status: offline
quote:

quote:

Is it allowed to upload this revised version of D21 2.3 for play testing by someone in this forum ?? Or is there a more busy forum for TOAW ? It seems a bit empty here :(


No. You do not have permission to upload a mod of any version of D21. The designers of this scenario have put years into its development and do not need the confusion of different mods floating around. If you wish to mod the scenario for your own benefit that is fine but do not use this thread or any other thread on the forum to discuss it. If there are changes that you think are valid to be considered for a future version you can PM me or Steve to evaluate.

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 148
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/10/2014 10:24:22 PM   
Lobster


Posts: 5104
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TPOO

quote:

quote:

Is it allowed to upload this revised version of D21 2.3 for play testing by someone in this forum ?? Or is there a more busy forum for TOAW ? It seems a bit empty here :(


No. You do not have permission to upload a mod of any version of D21. The designers of this scenario have put years into its development and do not need the confusion of different mods floating around. If you wish to mod the scenario for your own benefit that is fine but do not use this thread or any other thread on the forum to discuss it. If there are changes that you think are valid to be considered for a future version you can PM me or Steve to evaluate.


Whoa dude, unless you are a forum moderator you have no business telling anyone they can't start a thread. Are you a forum moderator?

However, if you are a scenario designer you do have a right to tell people not to mod your scenario per the last page of the manual:

ALL SCENARIO AUTHORS HOLD THE ULTIMATE RIGHTS
TO THEIR DESIGNED SCENARIOS AND MATRIX PUBLISHING, LLC MAKES NO CLAIMS THEREOF.
YOU MAY NOT COPY OR DISTRIBUTE COPIES IN ANY MEDIA FORM. ANY PERSONS DOING SO
SHALL BE GUILTY OF COPYRIGHT VIOLATION AND SUBjECT TO THE APPROPRIATE CIVIL OR
CRIMINAL ACTION AT THE DISCRETION OF THE COPYRIGHT HOLDER.

Now I've seen people modify a plethora of scenarios lately but I have not seen anyone put the boot to the neck for doing so. Not yet anyway.


< Message edited by Lobster -- 6/10/2014 11:29:36 PM >

(in reply to TPOO)
Post #: 149
RE: Directive 21 v2.0 - 6/11/2014 12:08:29 AM   
TPOO

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 11/15/2007
From: Garden Grove, CA
Status: offline 		Well I think it is pretty clear from my post the me and Steve are the scenario designers. I think I have the right to not want mods of my scenario uploaded and discussed on the forum. No one is restricting anyone from starting their own threads on the forum.
Myself and Steve are more than happy to take any suggestions for changes to D21 into consideration but ultimately we have to be the ones to make the changes.

(in reply to Lobster)
Post #: 150
Page:   <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> RE: Newest Version of D21 Page: <<   < prev  2 3 4 [5] 6   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.938