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Empire Status - 10/26/2010 7:46:27 PM   
06 Maestro


Posts: 3989
Joined: 10/12/2005
From: Nevada, USA
Status: offline 		An odd situation just came up in the 109 game. Austria, being played by Matto, has just had its empire dissolved. I say its odd in that Austria still has an empire score of 22. I thought that anything 20 and above would maintain the empire status.

Austria had made multiple surrenders recently. Its moral had been very low, but recently had climbed to just shy of the positive line. Last turn there were "riots" which destroyed a factory in one province. There is also unrest in a few provinces that Austria just recaptured after gaining independence in the recent war.

Does this sound like a bug or is it wad?

_____________________________

Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies.

Thomas Jefferson

Post #: 1
RE: Empire Status - 10/27/2010 5:38:03 AM   
06 Maestro


Posts: 3989
Joined: 10/12/2005
From: Nevada, USA
Status: offline 		I will venture a guess as to an aswer to the question.

As there are several provinces which became independent for a few turns before Austria recaptured those, there is "unrest" The unrest is in 3 provinces IIRC. If those provinces do not count as being part of the empire until the unrest ends, then that puts Austria under the 20 count.

There are several areas that are affected by unrest in newly acquired provinces. Building of new units, improvements and normal production is very limited or prohibited. It seems that counting such affected provinces towards an empire province count is included.

_____________________________

Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies.

Thomas Jefferson


(in reply to 06 Maestro)
Post #: 2
RE: Empire Status - 10/27/2010 10:59:05 AM   
Matto


Posts: 1138
Joined: 11/24/2000
From: Czech Republic
Status: offline 		Thanks for question and for answer !!! 

_____________________________

Excuse my English ... I hope is better then Your Czech ... :o)
My MatrixGames: WitP, WitP AE, WPO, JTCS, P&S, CoGEE, ATG, GoA, B.Academy, C-GW, OoB all DLCs, all SC, FoG2/E, most AGEOD games ...


(in reply to 06 Maestro)
Post #: 3
RE: Empire Status - 10/27/2010 4:50:40 PM   
06 Maestro


Posts: 3989
Joined: 10/12/2005
From: Nevada, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Matto

Thanks for question and for answer !!! 


I just hope that my answer was correct. It seems likely, but I don't know for sure.

_____________________________

Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies.

Thomas Jefferson


(in reply to Matto)
Post #: 4
RE: Empire Status - 10/28/2010 2:34:30 AM   
evwalt

 

Posts: 644
Joined: 11/14/2007
Status: offline 		I don't think that answer is correct.  First, there are some "hidden" bonuses to Empire status (like +4 for most merchant income).  I know their are 1 or 2 others (strange additions and subtractions of about +/-2 that I haven't been able to figure out yet).

What most likely happened?  Empire status is determined every quarter (ie. the same month you gain experience points).  I would guess Austria had its status checked at the beginning of the turn, found to be lacking empire points, and lost its status.  It subsequently (later that turn or on a later turn) captured more territories to bring them above 20 but it has already lost its status.  It will not be able to regain Empire status until the next time the game looks next quarter.

_____________________________

Russia in "Going Again II"
France in "Quest for Glory"
Prussia in "Invitational"

(in reply to 06 Maestro)
Post #: 5
RE: Empire Status - 10/28/2010 4:02:23 AM   
aprezto


Posts: 824
Joined: 1/29/2009
Status: offline 		Culture adds in their somehow. I have had empire status dissolved twice in this game by thinking I was more solidly over the empire threshold than I was. Since I am unsure of all the facilitators of empire, I made the mistake twice.

third time lucky, well so far.

_____________________________



Image courtesy of Divepac

(in reply to evwalt)
Post #: 6
RE: Empire Status - 10/28/2010 4:44:28 AM   
06 Maestro


Posts: 3989
Joined: 10/12/2005
From: Nevada, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: evwalt

I don't think that answer is correct.  First, there are some "hidden" bonuses to Empire status (like +4 for most merchant income).  I know their are 1 or 2 others (strange additions and subtractions of about +/-2 that I haven't been able to figure out yet).




It does look like there are some hidden factors. I just looked over the situation a little more carefully-and it just does not add up. Because Austria still has 29 (just recounted)29 provinces-and the Empire score shows 22. Something else is dragging it down. From what I can see there are only 3 or 4 provinces in unrest.

The following is all I can find in the rules.

5.14 Empire
Each nation has an Empire Rating determined by the following factors:
• +1 for every Protectorate
• +1 for every 10 Colonies owned by the nation
• +2 for every Conquered province (including those with which they
began the scenario)
• -3 for every Homeland province conquered by another nation.

Austria has no colonies and just lost 11 provinces in December. It still has 29 provinces and a shown Empire score of 22. If the empire score was less than 20 then perhaps it could be figured out. As it is, it is an unknown.

The change did in fact take place in January-a quarterly check point. It will be interesting to see what happens in April.

_____________________________

Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies.

Thomas Jefferson


(in reply to evwalt)
Post #: 7
RE: Empire Status - 10/28/2010 9:01:41 AM   
terje439


Posts: 6813
Joined: 3/28/2004
Status: offline 		In the appendix
10.4 Effects of Advanced Economy on Politics
Empire modifiers.
+4 if the nation has the highest culture rating
+2 if the nation has the second highest culture rating

Highest trade gives a bonus to glory, not empire status.

Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to 06 Maestro)
Post #: 8
RE: Empire Status - 10/28/2010 7:13:07 PM   
evwalt

 

Posts: 644
Joined: 11/14/2007
Status: offline 		For the 29 provinces and 22 empire score, I know you don't count home country provinces in Empire scores.

I think it checks for Empire status before you conquer areas.  Thus, it would be possible for you to have a empire status above 20 and still lose your empire status if you lost it.

You said this was a January turn it changed.  What was Austria's Empire Points in December?  More or less than 20?

_____________________________

Russia in "Going Again II"
France in "Quest for Glory"
Prussia in "Invitational"

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 9
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