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RE: Who Won the Actual War?

 
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RE: Who Won the Actual War? - 12/1/2010 2:58:50 PM   
Puhis


Posts: 1737
Joined: 11/30/2008
From: Finland
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IMO one of the biggest reasons why japanese player is able to expand more rapidly and farther than in real war is simplified logistics. In this game all you need is enough "supplies". IRL you should have food, clothes, bombs, airplane fuel, ammunition, artillery shells, medicine, spare parts etc. Of course after 1942 this is allied advantage.

Also base expansion is a way too easy and fast. All you need is few days and there's level one airfield...

(in reply to FatR)
Post #: 31
RE: Who Won the Actual War? - 12/1/2010 3:38:25 PM   
Feltan


Posts: 1160
Joined: 12/5/2006
From: Kansas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DivePac88


quote:

ORIGINAL: Feltan

I would add one huge item on the Allied side. The U.S. (and hence the Allies) had a split command in the Pacific; the Army's Southwest Pacific command run by MacArthur, and Nimitz running the Pacific Command. In the game, the Allied player doesn't have to deal with the politics of a split command, and hence is not required to divert resources to one or the other to placate egos.

The ability to correct this problem, by itself, gives the Allies a decisive advantage -- namely, unity of command. That alone should shorten the war by several months!

Regards,
Feltan


But I think the same could be said for the Japanese side. The Japanese also had a split command structure between their respective Army and Naval General Staff commands. The Army General staff where more concerned with their operational stalemate in China, and a possible upcoming war with a weaken USSR. While the Naval General Staff and the Combined Fleet Command's gaze was firmly fixed in the Pacific and Southern Resource areas.

That both these command Structures were loathe to share resources with each other is well known. So that the unified command structure in AE favors the Allied player just as much as it does the Japanese one.



I generally don't disagree; however, I would suggest that this was a bigger problem for the Allies especially early in the war.

For the Japanese, the inter-service rivaly broke down not only along service lines, but generally geographic as well. It is true there was monumental rivaly with the Japanese command structure, but their navy had their own aircraft and infantry for the Pacific and their Army only really used the navy for transport/logistics. While there was the aforementioned rivaly, operationally it broke down into generally recognizable geographic areas of responsibility until very late in the war -- when it was really too late to matter. During the early phases of the war, I don't think the rivalry materially affected the pace or scope of Japanese gains.

For the Allies, much of the early offensive momentum was diverted and delayed. Switching resource focus between MacArthur and Nimitz and then back again prevented or delayed a more rapid progress (either in the island hopping campaign or in the Cartwheel and subsequent operations). Again, late in the war this didn't make a lot of difference due to the embarassement of resources that were so plentiful; however, in late '42 and '43 the Allies didn't gain much traction -- they kept changing their focus and strategic direction.

In the game, to a very large extent, the Japanese and Allied players can both correct this -- and achieve a unity of command that wasn't present in real life. My point, and in my opinion, this really helps the Allied player more because I believe the disunity of command affected the Allies to a greater extent.

Regards,
Feltan

_____________________________


(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 32
RE: Who Won the Actual War? - 12/1/2010 4:08:27 PM   
Nemo121


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Canoe,

I don't disagree that Japan usually does better than it did. I just think that a lot of that is due to people viewing it as "inevitable" and thus allowing it to happen.

It is easy for Japan to do better than historically if the Allied player expects it and allows it. When Allied players set up to prevent this they often do succeed in preventing it. There's a lesson there for those willing to learn it.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to FatR)
Post #: 33
RE: Who Won the Actual War? - 12/1/2010 4:10:48 PM   
Nemo121


Posts: 5821
Joined: 2/6/2004
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As re: torching Chinese LI in my game... To be fair torching CHinese LI wouldn't have made a bit of difference. Me keeping Burma open and funelling at least 500,000 tons of supplies into Burma over the past 4 months ( with a reserve of some 300,000 tons in Burma itself ) did far more than a few thousand tons of supply generated by LI would ever have done.

I also think it is easy for anyone to look bad when they fall behind in the OODA loop. I think Mike would give a lot of people here a run for their money. He just fell behind in the OODA cycle and hasn't, as of yet, recovered, IMO.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to Nemo121)
Post #: 34
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