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RE: Your Style Maps - 5/18/2011 3:23:22 AM   
junk2drive


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quote:

ORIGINAL: HintJ

MR,

Is it possible to assign the trenches and foxholes already drawn on the CC map as trenches and foxholes in the MM? It would work like CMBB where they would still be flat but moving an infantry unit on top of them would give protection to units in the game engine, right?

If this is the case, I also assign the shell craters as "foxholes" (even though they technically aren't).

Just a thought, as it would be a shame to simply erase them.

edit-I could just paint over them in Paint.net w/the appropriate trenches or foxhole color for the MM like I did for the roads.


Are you asking if you can paint the map with the type foxhole and trench without placing the 3d model and still get the bonus?

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Post #: 121
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/18/2011 8:24:22 PM   
HintJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

Are you asking if you can paint the map with the type foxhole and trench without placing the 3d model and still get the bonus?


Yes. It would be sort of like CMBB, where something like a shell crater would provide protection if a player moves an infantry unit on it.


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Post #: 122
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/18/2011 9:20:36 PM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
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From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		That would be nice for your map. Someone may know or you may have to test it.

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Conflict of Heroes "Most games are like checkers or chess and some have dice and cards involved too. This game plays like checkers but you think like chess and the dice and cards can change everything in real time."

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Post #: 123
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:00:17 AM   
HintJ


Posts: 311
Joined: 10/10/2010
Status: offline 		W/terrain toggled on, it appears to work




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Post #: 124
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:04:26 AM   
HintJ


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Joined: 10/10/2010
Status: offline 		A squad inside a crater appears to get benefits, if that's what the little tree sign means.




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"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
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Post #: 125
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:06:11 AM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
Joined: 3/16/2008
From: Texas
Status: offline 		The little tree sign means it's in a woods location.

Good Hunting.

MR


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Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

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Post #: 126
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:14:02 AM   
HintJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

The little tree sign means it's in a woods location.

Good Hunting.

MR



You know, this may be an old bug carried over from PCK. In PCK, when I sometimes had a unit in a foxhole, I still sometimes got the tree symbol.

BTW, I haven't mapped a wooded area anywhere on the map yet, and the LOS tool shows that spot as a "foxhole." Any idea why this is showing a tree symbol?

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Post #: 127
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:26:03 AM   
Mobius


Posts: 10339
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: California
Status: offline 		It can also mean soft cover. Not always woods but ruts of plowed fields, marsh, brush or grain fields. Things that give -1 accuracy reduction to stationary infantry.

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Post #: 128
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:29:32 AM   
HintJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mobius

It can also mean soft cover. Not always woods but ruts of plowed fields, marsh, brush or grain fields. Things that give -1 accuracy reduction to stationary infantry.


Ok thanks.

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Post #: 129
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:29:51 AM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		I would have thought it would give you the house symbol. What does the trench do?

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Conflict of Heroes "Most games are like checkers or chess and some have dice and cards involved too. This game plays like checkers but you think like chess and the dice and cards can change everything in real time."

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Post #: 130
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:31:39 AM   
HintJ


Posts: 311
Joined: 10/10/2010
Status: offline 		Another interesting idea, for those people wanting some nostalgic style maps. Yes, this isn't how it should finally look, but an interesting idea nonetheless.




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"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
- Savielly Tartakower

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Post #: 131
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:46:16 AM   
HintJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

I would have thought it would give you the house symbol. What does the trench do?

Same thing, the tree symbol.

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"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
- Savielly Tartakower

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Post #: 132
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 1:58:37 AM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
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From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		I wonder if it is because you haven't put the 3d model in the mesh. I'm worried that it is a bug but probably not.

_____________________________

Conflict of Heroes "Most games are like checkers or chess and some have dice and cards involved too. This game plays like checkers but you think like chess and the dice and cards can change everything in real time."

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Post #: 133
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 2:18:34 AM   
HintJ


Posts: 311
Joined: 10/10/2010
Status: offline 		That's what I'm thinking. I put some trenches and foxholes 3d models in, but it looks very wrong and doesn't in any satisfactory way line up w/the map.

Perhaps in the next patch (hoping there will be one) modify the game so that any foxholes or trenches are considered hard cover, regardless if a 3d mesh is present. This would allow for designers to draw shell craters and assign good protection.

_____________________________

"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
- Savielly Tartakower

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Post #: 134
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 2:21:51 AM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		Would you rather have gopher mounds that sit on top of the terrain?

I like your idea and maybe Erik will chime in.

It would be nice not to have to mess with all that detail on the CC maps.

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Conflict of Heroes "Most games are like checkers or chess and some have dice and cards involved too. This game plays like checkers but you think like chess and the dice and cards can change everything in real time."

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Post #: 135
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 2:25:59 AM   
HintJ


Posts: 311
Joined: 10/10/2010
Status: offline 		One more crazy pic from the demo. I would be easy to line up the structures to match the Hexes and redraw the roads to match. Just an idea.




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"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
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Post #: 136
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 3:34:42 AM   
HintJ


Posts: 311
Joined: 10/10/2010
Status: offline 		Ok, one more shot. Just an idea of what you can do w/megatextures.




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Post #: 137
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 3:41:03 AM   
Mobius


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From: California
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HintJ
Perhaps in the next patch (hoping there will be one) modify the game so that any foxholes or trenches are considered hard cover, regardless if a 3d mesh is present. This would allow for designers to draw shell craters and assign good protection.
Ruin terrain already does that.


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panzer

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Post #: 138
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 3:47:40 AM   
HintJ


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Joined: 10/10/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mobius

quote:

ORIGINAL: HintJ
Perhaps in the next patch (hoping there will be one) modify the game so that any foxholes or trenches are considered hard cover, regardless if a 3d mesh is present. This would allow for designers to draw shell craters and assign good protection.
Ruin terrain already does that.



Are you saying that if I assign the foxholes/trenches as "ruins," I can have the effect w/out a 3d foxhole or trench model present?


_____________________________

"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
- Savielly Tartakower

(in reply to Mobius)
Post #: 139
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 4:42:29 AM   
Mobius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: HintJ
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mobius
quote:

ORIGINAL: HintJ
Perhaps in the next patch (hoping there will be one) modify the game so that any foxholes or trenches are considered hard cover, regardless if a 3d mesh is present. This would allow for designers to draw shell craters and assign good protection.
Ruin terrain already does that.

Are you saying that if I assign the foxholes/trenches as "ruins," I can have the effect w/out a 3d foxhole or trench model present?
It will be as close. Also you can assign the terrain as heavy woods and it will also provide protection. (page 62) I think other terrain needs the infantry to be mounted to offer protection.


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Post #: 140
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 5:35:56 AM   
eniced73

 

Posts: 245
Joined: 5/20/2009
Status: offline 		Nice work Hint. It looks like you are going to come up with some pretty good maps.

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Post #: 141
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 6:20:40 AM   
general_solomon

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

Can't wait to see you turn out a series of CC maps. And battles to go with them. And then a campaign. And then...



hell yes, do make us more. playing cc maps in pco would be super fantastic. I often wished i could see the terrain in 3d. even the look of the map has a cc3 feel.

great job.

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Post #: 142
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/19/2011 5:33:12 PM   
Jacko


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quote:

ORIGINAL: general_solomon


quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

Can't wait to see you turn out a series of CC maps. And battles to go with them. And then a campaign. And then...



hell yes, do make us more. playing cc maps in pco would be super fantastic. I often wished i could see the terrain in 3d. even the look of the map has a cc3 feel.

great job.


Me too. I often tried to duplicate CC maps into CMX1, but it didn't look half as nice.


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Post #: 143
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 2:14:06 AM   
HintJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: general_solomon


quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

Can't wait to see you turn out a series of CC maps. And battles to go with them. And then a campaign. And then...



hell yes, do make us more. playing cc maps in pco would be super fantastic. I often wished i could see the terrain in 3d. even the look of the map has a cc3 feel.

great job.

My intention at first is to make the first three maps in CC3--the "Barbarossa" Operation, I think the name is, a three mission (rather short) campaign. I've done some testing, and I think that small forces work best on the map I'm breaking in.

The monumental task is just making the first map and learning the process. There are some issues, of course, but hopefully I'll have something that is enjoyable and a reasonable translation of CC3.

At this point, I need to learn water, grass, and bridges. I'd say within a couple of weeks I can hopefully turn out CC3 maps pretty quickly. It's just getting the first map as best as I can.

*edit--I've actually done more work on the Megatexture, but it doesn't show up in this pic. And I need to smooth some more and adjust some shadows, ect. Oh, and I learned some tricks in Paint.net for filters and such to make the map more vivid w/the oil painting filter to kill some of the pixelations, and the ground level view looks a bit better.






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< Message edited by HintJ -- 5/20/2011 2:21:15 AM >

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Post #: 144
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 2:34:42 AM   
thewood1

 

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Status: offline 		If you want someone to test that, let me know.  I would love to build a scenario for it.

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Post #: 145
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 2:42:34 AM   
Mobius


Posts: 10339
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: California
Status: offline 		That looks great, especially the rocks around the stream. The thing that I can't tell what it is is the snakey wall or trench on the hill on the left. If that is a trench it would be more functional if you just painted that out and used the trench structures in the mapmaker.

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Post #: 146
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 3:03:37 AM   
HintJ


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thewood1

If you want someone to test that, let me know.  I would love to build a scenario for it.

As is?! Let me do some more work on it first. I'll be happy to give it to you before I post it up. Maybe you can make a better scenario for it than I can.

The map is a small 750x750m. Actually, to be more in line w/cc3, a 500x500m is a better fit, but I think that's too small: Within a few turns the whole game is over. I've noticed that playing w/units in the medium size scale works well.

Thank goodness PCO has no turn limit, so units on this map can be moved just a few per turn--it has a slower pace, just like in CC3, I think. Also, I like playing this map w/a few single unit platoons.


_____________________________

"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
- Savielly Tartakower

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Post #: 147
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 3:09:22 AM   
Mad Russian


Posts: 13256
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From: Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mobius

That looks great, especially the rocks around the stream. The thing that I can't tell what it is is the snakey wall or trench on the hill on the left. If that is a trench it would be more functional if you just painted that out and used the trench structures in the mapmaker.


IIRC that's a trench. Understanding that I can't remember the last time I played CC.

Good Hunting.

MR

_____________________________

The most expensive thing in the world is free time.

Founder of HSG scenario design group for Combat Mission.
Panzer Command Ostfront Development Team.
Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm Development Team.

(in reply to Mobius)
Post #: 148
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 3:09:48 AM   
HintJ


Posts: 311
Joined: 10/10/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mobius

That looks great, especially the rocks around the stream. The thing that I can't tell what it is is the snakey wall or trench on the hill on the left. If that is a trench it would be more functional if you just painted that out and used the trench structures in the mapmaker.


That trench is one of the things that bothers me. I actually have a version w/it painted out. I have yet to see the AI try to use this version as a trench, but the AI does, however, get slowed down trying to cross over it.

Maybe you are right; something to consider.

_____________________________

"Tactics is knowing what to do when there is something to do. Strategy is knowing what to do when there is nothing to do."
- Savielly Tartakower

(in reply to Mobius)
Post #: 149
RE: Your Style Maps - 5/20/2011 3:17:39 AM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		Just remember in medium and large size you will see tanks stuck into tanks and other odd things that go away when you make things normal size again.

_____________________________

Conflict of Heroes "Most games are like checkers or chess and some have dice and cards involved too. This game plays like checkers but you think like chess and the dice and cards can change everything in real time."

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Post #: 150
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