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RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process)

 
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RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/13/2013 9:06:45 PM   
all5n


Posts: 371
Joined: 12/19/2007
From: Republic of Texas
Status: offline 		so does the unit size designation actually change as you add more troops to each formation? What are the rules for the size to be shown?

I am amazed that the engine would allow for different graphics based on the number/size of units within the formation.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 31
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/13/2013 9:38:40 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		There is no engine logic that assigns the unit size. They are simply static graphic files. I made some basic assumptions: 1) all rifle units are, by the ATG engine, labeled as divisions so I put the division symbol on them. Same for armor. In fact, ATG labels all land units as a division (except HQs). 2) Armored cars I put the battalion symbol on as that is the way they are most used, based on my experience (few in number). I call them armored recon groups. 3) I put the brigade symbol on AT guns as that just seemed appropriate to me. Note that if you have mixed unit types, usually the greater number decides the unit type symbol applied. Usually that works out well. I did not put a size designation on MGs, motars or bazookas as they are normally just a standard part of an infantry division.

If you have a division with few troops, it is simply an understrength division. If you have a unit (division, battalion or brigade) with lots of troops/tanks, etc., it simply is an over-strength unit.

In my games I've started to rename each non-infantry unit that I create (i.e. 27th Armor, 15th Armored Recon, 8th Anti-Tank, 44th Anti-Air, etc.). The infantry divisions I just leave as is. To some this isn't important but I think it adds some additional polish to the game.

quote:

ORIGINAL: all5n

so does the unit size designation actually change as you add more troops to each formation? What are the rules for the size to be shown?

I am amazed that the engine would allow for different graphics based on the number/size of units within the formation.



< Message edited by Webizen -- 2/14/2013 7:32:21 PM >

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 32
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/14/2013 6:44:44 PM   
ghoward

 

Posts: 147
Joined: 11/9/2007
Status: offline 		I am interested in being able to identify a given unit by looking at the map (instead of cycling through all of them one at a time). An example might be "Where are those 3 horse mobile units I know I have around here somewhere, or the 113 inf div that has a lot of special forces in it, where is that guy". The power points change, and the graphic selection changes based on the SF mix (using some formula that I don't understand), so the unit may change appearance from one turn to the next. Do you know of any way to sense, suppress, or override this powerpoint and graphic selection behavior by the ATG engine? If any of these things could be done, now or in a future version, then you could have the engine select a specific graphic for flagged units that identified them on the game map as special in some way. To put it another way, it would be helpful if I could tell the game to represent THIS UNIT with a horse symbol, regardless of it's SF makeup. I am not supposing that your graphic mod is the right vehicle for something like this, but since you have been working in this area, I thought you might have an idea or comment.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 33
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/14/2013 8:36:33 PM   
ernieschwitz

 

Posts: 3893
Joined: 9/15/2009
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		I don´t think that is possible with the current way the game is run. BUT i think it is an excellent suggestion for Vic to come up with something that could lock a symbol to a unit....

(in reply to ghoward)
Post #: 34
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/14/2013 9:56:56 PM   
ghoward

 

Posts: 147
Joined: 11/9/2007
Status: offline 		I expected that that would be the case. Thanks for the response. Maybe I should move the post over to the new feature wishlist thread. I bet there is a slick way to do that, but I don't know it.

(in reply to ernieschwitz)
Post #: 35
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/17/2013 8:36:11 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		I concur with ernieschwitz. Don't think it is currently possible to do.

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Post #: 36
RE: NATO Counters (Multiplayer) - 3/26/2013 3:46:18 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		error in posting... deleted


< Message edited by Webizen -- 3/26/2013 3:48:14 PM >

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 37
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/24/2013 4:54:14 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		I've created a new defaultmod.txt file that works well with this mod (simply replace your existing one in the root folder of ATG with the attached). See screenshot in next post. Note that the 'New Random (enhanced)' button will not work unless you have Lancer's Enhanced Mod Suite installed and rename his at2 file to 'enhanced.at2'.

Note that this new defaultmod.txt file will work equally well with standard ATG. NATO counters are not required. Also note that it is independent of any particular version of ATG, at least since v2.14.

Caveats:

1) Don't use this new defaultmod.txt file with my NATO Counters Mod for Random Games as it uses it's own special file.
2) If you already have a modified default main screen via some other mod, using my file will overwrite those changes.
3) The "Download NATO Counters" button links to this thread re the NATO Counters (Solitare/Multiplayer) Mod.
4. Installing a new patch from Matrix Games will reset the default main screen.

See this post for additional options: Modified Main Screens.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Webizen -- 8/30/2013 5:54:12 PM >

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 38
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/24/2013 4:55:41 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Screenshot for above post...





Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Webizen -- 8/27/2013 11:18:52 PM >

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 39
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 9/13/2013 2:30:03 AM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Here is a little bonus which I'll incorporate later in my NATO Counters Mods. This is a set of small counters that are used in "zoom out" mode. I don't normally much use this mode because the counters are not very readable. After recently doing a short AAR using screenshots from this view, I decided to do something about the readability. I didn't touch them all but I reworked most of them. Note: Users of my 'NATO Counters Mod for Random Games' visit that post to get the install file. For others, note that many of these counters are NATO and some are just symbols I made up. The primary goal was, when in 'zoom out' mode, that you can easily recognize what type of unit you are looking at: not an easy task with these small counters.

Download: at2SMALL.atzip (Edit: more tweaks 9/16/13)




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Webizen -- 9/16/2013 1:21:45 PM >

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 40
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 2/22/2014 1:39:01 AM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Minor refresh to unit size mod, mostly to the small unit counters used in zoomed out mode. See top post for download link.

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 41
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 2/27/2014 12:49:16 AM   
lion_of_judah


Posts: 2113
Joined: 1/8/2007
Status: offline 		what does this overide? how hard is this to make brigade and infantry symbols for units that look good? I'm thinking of doing this and making infantry units that are only for brigade and bltn counters.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 42
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 2/27/2014 3:24:48 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		This particular mod overwrites your standard unit counters. There is mod to put the standard counters back also. I used Paint.NET to make these counters. Feel free to improve on them.

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Post #: 43
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/19/2014 3:57:36 PM   
bill0102

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 7/12/2014
Status: offline
quote:


Note 2: Even with this mod, to have large NATO counters in "Zoomed In" mode as depicted below requires a change to the generic.at2/anewdawn.at2 file. If you are comfortable with the editor it is Setng->RuleVars->Engine Graphics->871 -> change value to 0 and save. This will give you large and standard size NATO counters.




Hi

I am using the latest steam version of the game. When I try to change that setting using the editor, the setting is already at "0". The NATO counters do not show in zoomed in mode. Is there anything else I could try?

thanks for the counters-mod.

Bill

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 44
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/19/2014 5:14:09 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Note that this change would need made to each at2 file. For instance, if you made this change to anewdawn.at2 (officers/no tank models) you would would also need to make the same change to anewdawn2.at2 (officers and tank models) as well (and other at2 random game files you are playing) .

Note also this will only affect new games started after the change was made. It has no affect on saved games already in progress.

< Message edited by Webizen -- 8/19/2014 8:22:30 PM >

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Post #: 45
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/19/2014 7:09:49 PM   
bill0102

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 7/12/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Webizen

Note that this change would need made to each at2 file. For instance, if you made this change to anewdawn.at2 (officers/no tank models) you would would also need to make the same change to anewdawn2.at2 (officers and tank models) as well (and other at2 random game files you are playing) .

Also, in case I made a mistake in the number, try 1 instead of 0. I'll verify this evening.

Note also this will only affect new games started after the change was made. It has no affect on saved games already in progress.


Thanks for your help. I guess the problem is that I don't really know how to use the editor to change those files - the changes I make are not getting saved.

EDIT - I think I got it. I made the edit after "making" the game and then saved the game - the zoomed in icons are now NATO counters. Thanks again.

Bill


< Message edited by bill0102 -- 8/19/2014 8:16:16 PM >

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 46
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/19/2014 11:17:06 PM   
baloo7777


Posts: 1190
Joined: 5/18/2009
From: eastern CT
Status: offline 		Is it possible to try the mod, and if I decide I want to, to go back to the original counters?

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JRR

(in reply to bill0102)
Post #: 47
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/19/2014 11:25:42 PM   
cpdeyoung


Posts: 5368
Joined: 7/17/2007
From: South Carolina, USA
Status: offline 		From one of webizen's above posts :

quote:

This particular mod overwrites your standard unit counters. There is mod to put the standard counters back also.


This works well.

Chuck

(in reply to baloo7777)
Post #: 48
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 4:35:08 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		I have version 2.20 and cannot get NATO counters no matter what I try. Can someone please walk me through how to do it?

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to cpdeyoung)
Post #: 49
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 11:36:43 AM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Download (right click -- Save Target As) one of the two files under "Turn regular counters into NATO counters." Use the Install Zip/File button to install the atzip file you downloaded. You now have NATO counters.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steely Glint

I have version 2.20 and cannot get NATO counters no matter what I try. Can someone please walk me through how to do it?



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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 50
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 6:03:14 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Webizen

Download (right click -- Save Target As) one of the two files under "Turn regular counters into NATO counters." Use the Install Zip/File button to install the atzip file you downloaded. You now have NATO counters.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Steely Glint

I have version 2.20 and cannot get NATO counters no matter what I try. Can someone please walk me through how to do it?




I did that. I still get pictorial counters. There is no main screen option to choose NATO counters, and the only way I can get NATO counters at all (and these are the ones without unit size indicators, which are therefore useless to me) is by selecting a version of the 4 Seasons Mod.

To get your NATO mod with unit size indicators running do I have to select some special .at2 file? Or do I need to uninstall the 4 Seasons Mod?

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 51
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 6:07:50 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		My NATO mod is not dependent on any at2 file. No main screen option is needed as the mod overwrites the standard unit counters. Thus, if properly installed, you will have NATO counters with any game that uses those counters.

Ormand's mod uses it own set of custom NATO counters and is unaffected by my mod. Same with Bombur's mods as well. They use their own set of custom unit counters.

< Message edited by Webizen -- 8/20/2014 7:29:05 PM >

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 52
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 6:50:23 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Webizen

My NATO mod is not dependent on any at2 file. No main screen option is needed as the mod overwrites the standard unit counters. Thus, if properly installed, you will have NATO counters with any game that uses those counters.

Ormand's mod uses it own set of custom NATO counters and is unaffected by my mod. Same with Bombur's mods as well. They use their own set of custom unit counters.


Between my last message and yours I reinstalled your .atzip file using the game's installer. I then exited, reloaded the game, and started another game using standard defaults and got pictorial units.

I'm running 2.20. What gives?

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 53
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 8/20/2014 7:06:04 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		"Note 2: Even with this mod, to have large NATO counters in "Zoomed In" mode as depicted below requires a change to the generic.at2/generic2.at2/anewdawn.at2/anewdawn2.at2 files. If you are comfortable with the editor it is Setng->RuleVars->Engine Graphics->871 -> change value to 0 and save. This will give you large and standard size NATO counters. "

This must be what it is. All the editor ever offers me when I click on it is the ability to change the hex size of the map.

How do I make these changes?

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 54
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 7:08:32 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Check this ATG folder: \graphics\at2\fordcounter. If you don't see NATO counters there then renamed the atzip file to zip. Then manually extract the counters into that folder. Another option to try is put the atzip file in 'Matrix Games' folder and try installing from there.

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 55
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 7:11:17 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		So your issue is only with NATO counters in zoomed in mode?

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 56
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 8/20/2014 7:21:41 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		Okay. Learning editor now. Will see if I can make it work.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 57
RE: NATO Counters (Solitaire/Multiplayer) - 8/20/2014 7:22:27 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Webizen

So your issue is only with NATO counters in zoomed in mode?


Yes. Working on learning the editor now.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 58
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 8/20/2014 7:28:45 PM   
Tac2i


Posts: 2001
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: WV USA
Status: offline 		Editor: load at2 file using Load Scenario button, press Edit.

steps 1 - 6 (step 1 is click on setng button/step 5 is change value of rulvar 871 from 1 to 0)

step 6a

step 7

Note: these changes will only affect new games. Will have no affect on saved games before the change was made.

< Message edited by Webizen -- 12/14/2016 12:47:59 PM >

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Tac2i (formerly webizen)

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Post #: 59
RE: NATO Counters (Manual Process) - 8/21/2014 1:03:23 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Webizen

Editor: load at2 file using Load Scenario button, press Edit.

steps 1 - 6

step 7

Note: these changes will only affect new games. Will have no affect on saved games before the change was made.


Doesn't work. Still get the pictures. And I do not get your choice to save as shown in your screenshot of step 7.

1. The editor is counter-intuitive, poorly designed, and just too hard to use.

2. No matter what I do, even with the value clearly set at 1, I keep getting the stupid pictures instead of the NATO symbols at large scale. This makes zero sense.

3. I have, so far, reinstalled the game, made sure nothing was read-only, and reinstalled the mods (with yours last), and tried four different sessions with zero success. This is ridiculous. I appreciate what you've done but this isn't a mod to me any more, it's an ordeal. And I am not a novice, I have been a computer gamer since the seventies (no, that is not a typo).

I want to play this game, but without NATO symbols that is not happening. They should have been built into the game (seriously, who except children want pictures?) and the lack of them is going to kill the game for me.

This is the second Matrix product in a row that has been unplayable for me. I think maybe I need to stop shopping here.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Tac2i)
Post #: 60
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