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When playing the long campaign games... - 10/18/2002 10:30:54 PM   
Feinder


Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline 		like Scenario #17, at what level do most people set the "days per turn"? My brother an I are running 1 day turns, because it didn't really occur to us to change it. And then I thot that, "At the rate of 1 turn for every real life day (occasionally more), we'll be playing this game for at least a year or more!"

What setting for number of days is everyone else playing on? Does anyone play 1-day turns, and actually finish?

I never really thot about it because I haven't done so yet, but to what affect is it to ajust the number of days per turn up to 3 or 5 or 7? I should go home and fiddle with this...

-F-
Post #: 1
1 day turns - 10/18/2002 10:45:09 PM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Greetings, I use 1 day turns. As Japan you are hoping for the auto victory that will shorten the game. If your offensive fails your turns will be pretty easy since you will have little to command. (The allied turns however will begin to take a while to complete) Very few persons will likely ever finish all 610 turns to scenario 17 (only hard core gamers who are involved in a very close game) Watch out for the disappearing opponent in PBEM games in solo games time does not really matter if you are enjoying your self

_____________________________






I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 2
- 10/19/2002 12:21:01 AM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
Joined: 6/7/2001
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Status: offline 		Hi all,

It's somehow easier when you play with opponent who lives near you.

I am now playing #19 with 1 day moves against Oleg (he also
frequently posts here) and we manage to play average of more
than 2 moves per day (we live in same town and know eachother
personally).

We both expect that victory would come sooner than
Dec 31 1943 but only time will show...


Leo "Apollo11"

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 3
- 10/19/2002 1:29:15 AM   
Toro


Posts: 578
Joined: 4/9/2002
From: 16 miles southeast of Hell (Michigan, i.e.), US
Status: offline 		I'm playing two, one with 2-day turns, the other with 1-day turns. The verdict is still out for me on which is better. The 2-day is moving right along, but leaves you with periods of "I would have sent that TF back to bombard another night!" yet after 2-days it's in port drinking sake. Still, I'm having a ball in the 2-dayer.

You do have more control in a changing events situation with 1-day turns, but then your opponent is under the same restrictions.

One note: in the 2-day puppy, I had a CVTF set up to "react to enemy" and found it on the second day of the turn well below the PM-GG line hunting some AKs. I sank them, but had this happened later in the game, the Allies would have pummelled me. Just a warning.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 4
- 10/19/2002 8:45:25 AM   
Gary Gossett

 

Posts: 18
Joined: 5/19/2002
From: Western Washington State
Status: offline 		I tip my hat to those who have the time and patience to play a long sceanrio with 1 day turns. Those who have the luxury of taking the time to make multiple turns per day perhaps can play a long one to completion. My personal time limitations restrain me to one turn per day. I am just too impatient to watch a TF take several mailings to actually do anything. Besides, at my age, I may go blind in the next 600+ days. I have been quite pleased playing with the turns set at 3 day increments. Yes you lose some control, like being able to banzai counterattack off a fledgling landing. But both sides are limited and I think that the 3 day turn actually enhances the FOW aspects of the game.So....if you are limited on time, impatient, not overly concerned with control and WANT TO FINISH a long PBEM match I highly recommend the longer turn sequences.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 5
- 10/19/2002 8:52:38 AM   
Fred98


Posts: 4430
Joined: 1/5/2001
From: Wollondilly, Sydney
Status: offline 		For a long scenario, H2H, my preference is for a turn length of 2 or 3 days.

To load a convoy, sail to the destination and unload, easily takes the best part of a week.

You lose a tiny bit of control, but you have more fun.

To me a game must be fun. That's the most vital point.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 6
- 10/19/2002 9:03:18 AM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
Status: offline 		This is the one and only comment I have to make about game turn length in UV: there is no alternative to one-day turns. It is not a matter of fun or control to me. It is a matter of what the design was intended to do. As theater commander, I wake up every morning, get my staff briefing, have a cup of joe, and try to cope with the present day's challenges. No, I don't want "micromanagement" control of my forces. I just want to experience the richness of the situation UV presents to me as a player: plan, organize, and fight the campaign while relying on subordinates, the impositions of higher command, the vagaries of luck - and, above all, my own inherent and learned abilities as a pivotal figure in this phase of history.

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 7
- 10/19/2002 10:22:37 AM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Gary Gossett
[B]Besides, at my age, I may go blind in the next 600+ days. [/B][/QUOTE]

You're 17-year old who... ehm... masturbates a lot? Wow, we older guys envy you... :D

Sorry, just could not restrain myself, I know it's a bit tasteless... anyway I could optimally handle 2-4 games a day, ideally with 2-turns per day tempo (thats like up to 7-8 turns daily total). And I play 1-day turns exclusively - that's most enjoyable and I am control freak in games like UV..

From my experience 80% of turns take less than 15 minutes, or less, to finish - these are the routine turns, when nothing much happens, except an occasional sub attack here and there.

Time zones help a lot. Because I am very very late night person in Central European timezone I know I could not be playing Aussies (except at a very slow rate). Late night Euros and normal-metabolism US partners suit me fine.

O.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 8
- 10/19/2002 10:39:33 AM   
RayM

 

Posts: 310
Joined: 10/19/2000
From: Marlton, NJ USA
Status: offline 		I recently finished #16 as Allies using 1-day turns. Luckily, I was able to spend a lot of time in the evening (and often into the early morning) to keep things moving along. Haven't tried any other option.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 9
- 10/19/2002 4:23:05 PM   
Ross Moorhouse


Posts: 2354
Joined: 1/5/2001
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline 		For me it depends. If I can see that there may not be much action in the next turn I change from 1 day to 3 day. How do I know if there is not much action coming ? If i cant see those horrible little red ships all over the seas .. ;)

_____________________________

Ross Moorhouse

Project Manager
www.csosimtek.com
Email: rossm@csogroup.org

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 10
Turn Length - 10/21/2002 1:47:37 AM   
Sven Nyqvist

 

Posts: 17
Joined: 9/10/2000
From: Oberusel, Germany
Status: offline 		In my experience (which is solo only as I sometimes have a week of pause or so) 1 Day turns are normally the right thing. Of course if you are the Allies and know that the Japanese cannot really do very much you certainly could switch to longer turns from time to time, eg when you are waiting for all these transports to load up. As the Japanese I would only try that after having sunk all available emeny CV's in the landing phase.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 11
- 10/21/2002 3:13:24 AM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		Playing the AI, one turn/day is the only way to go. You could play twenty turns in a day if you wanted. As pbem I don't know. the times I tried it my opponents disappeared on me. I'm not sure if its suited to pbem unless you have a committed opponent. Its discouraging to go all the way into 1943 only to have the losing side suddenly disappear.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 12
- 10/21/2002 3:53:00 AM   
pasternakski


Posts: 6565
Joined: 6/29/2002
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Drex
[B]Playing the AI, one turn/day is the only way to go. You could play twenty turns in a day if you wanted. As pbem I don't know. the times I tried it my opponents disappeared on me. I'm not sure if its suited to pbem unless you have a committed opponent. Its discouraging to go all the way into 1943 only to have the losing side suddenly disappear. [/B][/QUOTE]

I have had this problem, as well. What would you think about a system like Avalon Hill's old A.R.E.A. rating service for PBM board games? You sign up, receive a provisional rating, and seek opponents on the system for PBEM games. The players decide the options to be used in their game. If you disappear on somebody in the system without the adverse player's permission, your membership is yanked (or you are put on probation, or suspended, or de-nutted, or ...) and those remaining on the system are warned of your unreliability.

A formula is used to calculate your current rating, with wins against novice or low-ranked players counting less than "upsets" against the superstars.

Spooky, Oleg, whaddaya think? Other prime time players out here like mdiehl, XPav, mogami, and the rest too numerous to mention? You want to design/host/promote such an idea? Matrix/2by3 are likely too busy to get very deeply involved in such a scheme. More games than just UV could be included ... like WITP and GGPW, for example ... others to be selected by the oversight committee ...

Just a thought.

_____________________________

Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 13
- 10/21/2002 5:03:58 AM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		I believe this has been brought up before but nothing was done about it and since the demise of Combat Command I wonder about who is going to oversee such a framework. I am all in favor of this idea as long as it doesn't try to keyhole the players as far as their style,etc.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 14
- 10/21/2002 6:20:33 AM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline 		Drex if you need some volunteers for virtual firing squad to execute your opponent for treason - I know of some members of the Young Komsomol, Kempei-Tai (to remain on topic here), together with Ballilas and Waffen SS volunteers that are ready to forget their ideological differences for a moment and give this sub-human the treatment he deserves :)

I am only half-joking here...

Pasternak idea is OK, but the problem (as I see it) is that such "tables" usually develop into "ladders" and personally I never play on game ladders (ie. for points). The atmosphere on such ladders is just too competitive for my taste, and there are some guys who'd do anything to win. I mean, I'd do anything to win in any game I play, but it's because I want to win the game in question, not to earn some points for some ladder, to be higher on the ladder than the other guy etc. - you know what I mean.

Speaking of "lost opponents" - anyone knows what is going on with Rowlf (Michael Gilchrist)? We had very interesting game going on, he said he'll be absent for a day or two to change hard disk in his PC or something, and does not reply to mails ever since (10-15 days ago)?

He was among the most active members of UV community - with his very useful posts here, and not to mention his EXCELLENT map and ships mods (still available on Spookys site, ie. on my server). If not by name or mods - you'll remember him by his avatar - some funny guy from Muppet Show, IIRC. Anyone knows what's with him?

I certainly do hope his hard drive didn't mutate into alien biomechanic soul sucker that stole his mind and stored it into some unknown 5th dimension matrix? (I drank too much beer obviously.)

O.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 15
- 10/21/2002 6:20:45 AM   
Luskan

 

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline 		warfarehq has got the ladder, just not the fidelity control.

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 16
Rowlf - 10/21/2002 6:30:50 AM   
mogami


Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline 		Hi, I too miss Rowlf. We have a very interesting PBEM game that has been in suspension for 2 weeks.

_____________________________






I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 17
- 10/21/2002 8:59:25 AM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		Oleg- I have no ill feeling aginst the opponents who have dropped out for no apparent reason. there probably was a good reason but they couldn't get back to me. Real life has a way of interfering with our good times. In a long game of UV it takes commitment and kudos to the guys who play a complete game.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 18
- 10/21/2002 9:03:31 AM   
Oleg Mastruko


Posts: 4921
Joined: 10/21/2000
Status: offline 		Well, Drex you're probably right, but a short note to the tune of "I really wish we could continue but I can't, so I surrender to you, I bow to the Japanese/US/Australian flag, you won, let's play for a two weeks more to get the closure on this game and that's it" makes whole lotta difference than just leaving without trace.

O.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 19
- 10/21/2002 9:56:13 AM   
Drex

 

Posts: 2524
Joined: 9/13/2000
From: Chico,california
Status: offline 		We're talking about proper game ettiquette here and as you pointed out, its only right to give the other guy a reason so he doesn't hold a slot open for ever. But unless its a tournament where participation counts, the "bug-outs" can get away with it.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 20
Time Wasted - 10/21/2002 10:44:43 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		There are very few things that are worse than having an PBEM opponent "bug-out" after 100+ turns.

Especially just disappearing without leaving any kind of note.

Yea, real life can interefere, but a one sentence e-mail takes 20 seconds.

All I need is an explanation. After the time invested in the game, I think I would deserve as much.

Not a lot to ask, is it?

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 21
- 10/21/2002 11:09:08 AM   
Drongo

 

Posts: 2205
Joined: 7/12/2002
From: Melb. Oztralia
Status: offline 		Posted by denisonh
[QUOTE]Especially just disappearing without leaving any kind of note.

Yea, real life can interefere, but a one sentence e-mail takes 20 seconds.

All I need is an explanation. After the time invested in the game, I think I would deserve as much.

Not a lot to ask, is it?

[/QUOTE]

I'm sure many jilted partners in relationships have said the same. :)

_____________________________

Have no fear,
drink more beer.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 22
- 10/21/2002 11:18:26 AM   
denisonh


Posts: 2194
Joined: 12/21/2001
From: Upstate SC
Status: offline 		Even when I got dumped by my previous girlfriend, at least I got the lame line "Can't we just be friends?"

Not real satisfactory, but did provide closure of sorts.

_____________________________


"Life is tough, it's even tougher when you're stupid" -SGT John M. Stryker, USMC

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 23
- 10/21/2002 12:07:49 PM   
CapAndGown


Posts: 3206
Joined: 3/6/2001
From: Virginia, USA
Status: offline 		I just want to put a plug in here for the blitzkrieg wargaming club. [URL]http://www.theblitz.org[/URL] Generally, players are very sociable there and longer term players can be counted on as reliable. Though it is a ladder, this is not something that should put anyone off. I too shied away from ladder play at one time. But I now find I enjoy reporting games. At least at the blitz, you score points whether you win or lose. So just playing the game will advance you on the ladder. But I doubt that most people are worried overmuch about the ladder; the players just appreciate the opportunity to meet and interact with fellow wargamers.

Hell, I even saw Paul Vebber post on the blitz UV forum. So if you head over there, you can help liven things up a bit. (Seems this forum has grabbed all the attention. :-) )

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 24
- 10/21/2002 11:14:20 PM   
Admiral_Arctic

 

Posts: 154
Joined: 8/15/2002
From: Nonamia
Status: offline 		I played on the ladders for Close Combat and Rebellion. In CC you can finish 5 games in one night, and Rebellion maybe one. But UV takes one year minimum- so I don't think it will be suited to a ladder/ competition. Maybe points could be awarded per 100 days.

Or a special scenario could be designed that started in July 1942 and ended July 1943. The battles of Coral Sea and Midway could have be passed with no contract, or have their historical results. Maybe there could be a stopwatch that counts down 15-20 minutes- and thenends the turn. This would increase the number of turns done per night (obviously the player has to be avaiable). And everyone would be playing under similar conditions.

Oops my turn is here.

_____________________________

I'm a hazard to myself.

Want. Take. Have.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 25
Repeat Function - 10/21/2002 11:46:23 PM   
NorthStar

 

Posts: 219
Joined: 5/17/2002
From: New York, US
Status: offline 		One thing I'd like to see which would -- IMHO -- make multiple day turns more palitible would be a REPEAT function.

That is, set a TF to Bombard/Repeat, so it continues to bombard each day until it is turned off. Obviously, you'd have to carefully watch the SYS damage and Endurance, but I think it would help.

I'd like to have it for one day turns, just so I don't have to keep remembering to catch bombardment and Surface combat TFs before they go half way across the map.

(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 26
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