Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: goranw

Hi!
A map done by OKH.
Supplies delivered up to 2 july in area Nord.
Goran

quote:

ORIGINAL: wosung

Not only the need of ammo is telling, but also the ammo consumption per ammo category. Apparently in the Wehrmacht mines & sticky charges in 1943 weren’t used as much as before – arguably training deficies & bad surviving chances in close quarter anti-tank warfare.7,5 cm Pak ammo in 1943 seems to have been used not in large quantities – arguably German Pak nests in 1943 had little chances to survive long.
For data and conclusions see: Germany in the Second World War, Vol. 5.2, pp. 639-647 (Chapter: Ammonition and fighting power).

Esp. the production of Flak ammo became a real sinkhole for German ressources during the war.

I also don’t think per-head number supply consumption is easy to do. There are so many factors.

Regards

quote:

ORIGINAL: goranw

Hi! OBS http://allworldwars.com/Comments-on-Russian-Roads-and-Higways-by-Max-Bork.html
From COMMENTS ON RUSSIAN RAILROADS AND HIGHWAYS
By Gen. Lt. a.D, Max Bork
It could be downloaded with more maps and interesting text from the net.
2 maps showing the rate of repairing the Baltic rail lines.
Sorry for the quality.
Goran

quote:

ORIGINAL: goranw

Hi!
To relate to the maps above. Here is Start turn 5 17/7 of the Barbarossa scenario.
AI against AI. THe German offensive keeps in a very historical way up to the "timetable"
Compare with the frontlines 13/7 (yellow) on the date-frontline map.This is very good
and thats of course the main thing but the railway advance ( supply importance) doesnt keep up.
Look at the detailed OKH railway map.
The difference is big. In the game its quite impossible to keep up.
Ex first train to Pernau 12 july. To Rositten 10 july and to Pskow (Pleskau) 24 july.
but the railway advance ( supply importance) doesnt keep up.

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty_01

quote:

ORIGINAL: goranw

Hi!
To relate to the maps above. Here is Start turn 5 17/7 of the Barbarossa scenario.
AI against AI. THe German offensive keeps in a very historical way up to the "timetable"
Compare with the frontlines 13/7 (yellow) on the date-frontline map.This is very good
and thats of course the main thing but the railway advance ( supply importance) doesnt keep up.
Look at the detailed OKH railway map.
The difference is big. In the game its quite impossible to keep up.
Ex first train to Pernau 12 july. To Rositten 10 july and to Pskow (Pleskau) 24 july.
but the railway advance ( supply importance) doesnt keep up.

I agree and noticed the same thing when reviewing those "First Train Arrived" tables from the US-ARMY-Europe study. It implies that in-game FBD units are converting and repairing rail lines at a much slower pace than their historical counterparts.

However, the other aspect of importance is the repair times associated with major bridges destroyed by the Red Army engineers. Railway Bridges over major rivers were taking German Construction Engineers between 2 and 3 weeks to repair.

The Germans were ferrying trains across rivers while bridge repairs were occurring. This implies that the Germans were continuing to push rail conversion and repair via their FBD unit’s eastward beyond demolished bridges.

The Germans were also barging supplies up, down and across major water ways in an attempt to keep logistics flowing. This would imply at least double and even triple handling of all material (load\unload + load\unload + load\unload onto multiple conveyance systems). Of course these interim conduits along with double\triple handling of all material would have been significantly less efficient in moving supplies\fuel\ammunition across rivers relative to a train with unimpeded movement direct from Germany to a supply head.

Other aspects of interest include capture and reuse of Soviet locomotives and rolling stock over Soviet gauge track. Although this again would imply – at the very least – double handling of all supplies\fuel\ammunition.

quote:

ORIGINAL: goranw

Hi!
In this area the repair of bridges went quite quickly ,even across the few big rivers. (Otherwise with Dnjeper,Don ,Donetz etc)
See the map. Goran

quote:

ORIGINAL: marty_01

quote:

ORIGINAL: goranw

Hi!
In this area the repair of bridges went quite quickly ,even across the few big rivers. (Otherwise with Dnjeper,Don ,Donetz etc)
See the map. Goran

More very interesting material Goranw. Are you able to determine if some of the bridges on that last figure you posted were captured intact?

quote:

ORIGINAL: wosung

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richrd



FWIW:
From Germany and the 2nd WW, Vol. 6.
Fuel consumption Ostheer Mid Oct 1941- Mid March 1942 667.292 cubic meters or tons, on average 11 trains a day. For this period, ammo consumption was 390.000 tons, pp. 788-790.
Daily fuel consumption Ostheer in Sept. 1942.: 5.000-6.000 cubic meters or tons, p. 946.

I have a question, i can see the book uses cubic metres, but that is not the same as metric tons or Imperial tons. 11 trains is a standard weight of 450 tons, so thats a constant. But converting cubic metres to imperial tons, is a lot less tons than the train tonnage tons. while 11 trains a day is 750,000 tons. Quite a difference. Is it a translation problem and the book means metric tons?

< Message edited by Hanny -- 8/9/2019 10:51:04 AM >

(in reply to wosung)