RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A)

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A)

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RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/26/2012 9:16:31 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

Ship Losses
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There have been quite a few more hits on subs from ship based air ASW lately. Most of this is due to the KB being at sea and the Kates and Vals set to go after them. This is usually just a job for Kates, and usually at about 10% search and 20% ASW at the most while on Naval attack and not near Allied CVs or LBA. I've been setting them at 2k at 60% ASW and 10% rest on naval attack moving through the Coral Sea. The Vals have been on 30% search at 2k ft moving through this area. It seems to be working. There are multiple sub hit messages per turn.

One thing that's interesting is that it appears Jocke may be using 2 subs in some TFs. About half of the subs I spot show two ships in the TF. If this is indeed the case I think it's not the best use of these forces.

About 60-70% of the ships confirmed sunk have not appeared on the sunk list in the past few months. It seems odd that ships that our forces witness sinking do not make it to the sunk ship list. How can this be FOW if we watch it go under? There should be several more xAP, at least two DDs and several other small support ships on the list below from just the past two weeks.

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Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 4/26/2012 1:04:22 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 631

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/26/2012 12:52:34 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

11 August 1942
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subs: It's been looking like the subs heading to the DEI have been using the Sunda strait. Last turn PBs and CMs dropped 130 mines there. Today O24 hit a Type 93 mine and appears to be sunk. Looks like timing was spot on! An ACM is here now and the mines will be kept up to thwart the use of this passage. If they begin to use straits to the SE of Java then I might do some spot mining at times when subs appear to be leaving the area.
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Salmon hits Africa Maru with one of two torps, but it's a dud. It's going to be tough when these all explode.
I-17 is spotted by the escorts of a large TK convoy to OZ near Lord Howe Island. It comes up twice but can only get a shot at an AM.
Dolpin is sighted and attacked by DDs in the Coral Sea.

Several more hits reported on subs in the Coral Sea from KB aircraft and Jakes.

So Pac: The KB is united. No sight of the force that was to the SW near OZ yesterday. The Natori is off toward Milne Bay and healing damage. The Aoba has reached Tulagi and will go off toward Yokohama.

The fast transport with base forces has landed at Koumac and they are nearly unloaded. The division is 89% landed. Another about 2-3 days out. There is a support group just passing Rossel island with more fuel and an AKE and an AG for Koumac.

As I load all of these units, ships and planes into New Caledonia it seems strange I hadn't prepared the place better before. But I have to remind myself that it was part of the plan to entice the Allies to make a move thinking it was undefended, but myself knowing forces to make a counter were nearby. I though it would be much later into the autumn when they would take a stab at it. If it had been later I might not have come back with this much force, but just tried to slow their progress. Now it seems there is time to kick them out as well as hit any forces re-supplying or reinforcing troops there.

Just having the KB nearby is bleeding subs and Catalinas every day. Today 3 were listed as A to A losses as transports were intercepted at Noumea by LR CAP. Another couple were lost to ops. These are PBY-5 and 5A. With the replacements as they are, the Allies can't afford to lose 2-3 Cats a day.

The 2 DMS began clearing mines at Belep. They are nearly out of fuel though and will have to move to Koumac to get some tomorrow from the convoy ships.

China: In China the forces near Tuyun bugged out to Kweiyang. The combined army now with about 4,500 AV will move into Kweiyang to pursue. Since this is rough territory only, I will attack here, especially knowing the supply situation and having air raids daily to bring down moral of the troops there even farther. We'll see if he stays in the base or abandons that as well.

Burma: The British tried a daring bombardment today at Port Blair. I'm upset I didn't have Bettys ready and set on 14 hex naval attack 20% search in Rangoon as usual. They were taking a week to strengthen their search skills, ironically, (even though they are elite pilots at 70 in 4 skills their search skill is at an average of 35). So the TF got a free shot. CA Cornwall and Exeter came in and put 4 hits on the field with 2 service damage and 1 squad disabled. Nothing hurt from our side and hopefully he'll come back. A SCTF is now set patrolling at Port Blair with 6 hex react. It has 3 CA, a CL and 5 DDs.

This is actually great as it wakes me up over here. The Vals training at Moulmein will move to one of the Andamans as will the 45 Zero 3rd Ku S-1 that has spent the last 5-6 months in China and has 101 kills. If anything so much as comes near the Andamans, Burma or Malaya now, we'll be ready.

No other news except another 12 plane fighter group converting to the Tojo in Rangoon. This is the unit that was in Urumchi and has 30 pilots since it is changing to allow 30 planes in October I believe. A few aces here from shooting down I-16s as well.

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< Message edited by obvert -- 4/26/2012 1:00:36 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 632

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/26/2012 1:06:17 PM

ny59giants

Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

subs: It's been looking like the subs heading to the DEI have been using the Sunda strait. Last turn PBs and CMs dropped 130 mines there. Today O24 hit a Type 93 mine and appears to be sunk. Looks like timing was spot on! An ACM is here now and the mines will be kept up to thwart the use of this passage. If they begin to use straits to the SE of Java then I might do some spot mining at times when subs appear to be leaving the area.

You will need to base some ships here as their home port or the mine fields will slowly deteriorate. I had sent a turn to MichaelM a while back asking why my minefield here were losing about one or two mines per day. You have to have something there for the base to draw fuel because if you don't have any fuel at the base, the ACMs cannot do there jobs of maintaining minefields.

< Message edited by ny59giants -- 4/26/2012 1:09:27 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 633

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/26/2012 1:30:33 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

quote:

subs: It's been looking like the subs heading to the DEI have been using the Sunda strait. Last turn PBs and CMs dropped 130 mines there. Today O24 hit a Type 93 mine and appears to be sunk. Looks like timing was spot on! An ACM is here now and the mines will be kept up to thwart the use of this passage. If they begin to use straits to the SE of Java then I might do some spot mining at times when subs appear to be leaving the area.

You will need to base some ships here as their home port or the mine fields will slowly deteriorate. I had sent a turn to MichaelM a while back asking why my minefield here were losing about one or two mines per day. You have to have something there for the base to draw fuel because if you don't have any fuel at the base, the ACMs cannot do there jobs of maintaining minefields.

Thanks. I was wondering as I've had it set to pool there forever, but it hasn't been doing that. I'll throw some things in the port.

I find that these ACMs use a lot of fuel! In the islands S of Tokyo I basically have an xAKL going from island to island continuously to get them fed.

(in reply to ny59giants)

Post #: 634

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/26/2012 1:36:11 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

12 August 1942
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subs: S-41 goes for the other division amphib TF heading past Rossel Island, but it is sighted by the escorts before firing a shot.
Pollack is sighted again near Ominato.

West Australia: Bombing continues to take it's toll of the Darwin survivors as troops move in for what is hopefully a last stand in the desert near Katherine.

So Pac: The united KB is a fearsome machine. One of the big pluses of having all of these ships and planes together is that anything else that comes within range suffers. Today five more Cats impale themselves, several subs are reported hit and the armada moves closer to New Caledonia to cover Koumac as troops unload and engineers scramble to build an airfield. No sight of B-24s after the first raid. Jocke is judicious about his bombing.

Mines are being cleared at Belep and in the meantime ships are being sent to the east side of the reefs on their transit to Koumac.

China: Lots of bombing going on. Still a few more days before attacks can roll at Kienko and Kweiyang.

A shock attack in the foothills near Wasu takes another 45 squads from the Chinese and concludes offensive operations in the area. They are pushed into the mountains. If they make it out I'll be surprised.

Burma: All quiet. The 3rd Ku S-1 is now stationed at Rangoon and will be a good companion for the 45 Bettys there. In the Andamans, a 6 plane Kate unit I'd been using in China forever moved to Trinkat to provide search and ASW.

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< Message edited by obvert -- 4/29/2012 11:37:01 AM >

(in reply to ny59giants)

Post #: 635

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/29/2012 11:49:06 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

13 August 1942
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subs: No major attacks, other than air sightings and attacks in the Coral Sea.

So Pac: All quiet as troops continue to unload at Koumac. Support ships have arrived as well, so SCTFs can reload and refuel. A replenishment TF is on the way for the KB. In the meantime they are at a stationary patrol off Noumea shooting down more Cats. There seems to be a large evac operation going on. Troops have diminished to just above 5,000 here and 7 Cats were shot down today. Fine by me, as a few days of this would be months of replacements. I guess the troops on those planes wouldn't make it either, which is another small plus.

China: Had a though I might send the 3,000 AV in Chengtu after the 230,000 Chinese troops getting bombed to dust and struggling to move from Kienko to Chungking, but thought better of it. That' still a LOT of Chinese, and B-17s might come in to play if needed here. All I have for CAP now is some 30 Oscars moved in to Neikiang. I'll just wait for the attacks at Kienko and Kweiyang and then see what to do next.

Burma: Two sets of Hurricanes go for Myityina today, but find no CAP. Usually this means a bombing mission will commence tomorrow. I won't send any planes for the slaughter right now. I am putting the two new 12 plane Tojo groups at Katha. It's a bit of a risk to stick them out here, but I need to figure out best altitude settings, so I might need to sacrifice a few planes to get it right. Oscars should support from Lashio and Schwebo.

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< Message edited by obvert -- 5/3/2012 2:23:15 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 636

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/29/2012 2:26:36 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

14 August 1942
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subs: More subs are appearing off the HI now.

Herring duds on an xAKL resource carrying ship near Torishima.

The first sub signed in the Formaosa/Hong Kong area for months is immediately hit hard by a PB ASW team. The Flying Fish got 4 hits total, 2 penetrating with internal explosions. I'm hoping that the distance home and amount of damage (listed as heavy damage after the attack) means this one is done.
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I-30 takes out xAKL Alout near Esperance.

Skipjack duds on an xAKL near Truk.

Stingray hits DD Minekaze near Bali and the small DD goes under. Unfortunate. I should have set them as an ASW TF, not surface combat.

So Pac: Belep looks clear of mines now. Still odd to me that over 150 mines were deposited there. I forgt how many the DMs for the US hold?

Kates and Vals attack Noumea fields but only achieve 9 runway hits and 4 on the service. Just keeping it from building anything now. Troops there are lower again, to around 4,500. It can't all be PBYs. I wonder if SSTs are involved as well.

China: At Kweiyang as well as at Kienko DA attacks will go forward tomorrow. I'm hoping to take both bases outright.

Burma: All quiet.

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Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 4/29/2012 2:30:47 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 637

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/29/2012 3:44:42 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

15 August 1942
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subs: I was careless with a TF path today and it cost me a ship. It was also loaded with a third of a base force destined to go to Siboret Island. The rest will try to scurry away and get into ASW shallow water range quickly.

Spearfish duds on a resource convoy near Cam Rahn Bay.

I-166 is attacked near Karachi by MLs again. No hits. It comes back and tries to torpedo one with not luck.

I-22 hits the xAP Poelau Laut with 2 fish near Raoul Island North of NZ. It appears three APs were sent out with no escort. No troops listed as going down though.

So Pac: The KB camps off of of Noumea and continues to take down PBYs. It looks like 5 more today. A division is now moving down New Caledonia hoping to arrive before all of the Allied troops have been evacuated. We'll most likely only get mechanized elements of the various forces brought in plus maybe some heavy guns.

The KB planes hit subs and the fields again for minor damage.

China: Neither attack in China today produced a victory. At Kweiyang engineers reduced forts to 2 but only got a 1:1 attack and Japanese forces took major disablements again. Even though the Chinese had only a rough hex they took less than 1/3 the casualties of the IJA in this fight. The major plus were all of the 'leaders' apparently. Many many HQs here. So it'll be another wait.

Up North, the troops at Kienko didn't do badly and should be able to go again in another week if supply cooperates.

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Ground combat at Kweiyang (74,49)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 131629 troops, 1469 guns, 732 vehicles, Assault Value = 4531

Defending force 93402 troops, 667 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 3167

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 2

Japanese adjusted assault: 2105

Allied adjusted defense: 1251

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 2)

Japanese Assault reduces fortifications to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), leaders(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
17829 casualties reported
Squads: 21 destroyed, 1492 disabled
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 119 disabled
Engineers: 42 destroyed, 229 disabled
Guns lost 98 (4 destroyed, 94 disabled)
Vehicles lost 68 (1 destroyed, 67 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
5252 casualties reported
Squads: 29 destroyed, 343 disabled
Non Combat: 8 destroyed, 202 disabled
Engineers: 3 destroyed, 60 disabled
Guns lost 100 (5 destroyed, 95 disabled)

Assaulting units:
Imperial Guards Division
28th Engineer Regiment
2nd Division
21st Ind.Mixed Brigade
18th Division
2nd Recon Battalion
39th Division
4th Division
32nd Division
1st Recon Battalion
55th Infantry Brigade
2nd Ind.Mixed Brigade
34th Division
8th Engineer Regiment
21st Division
41st Infantry Regiment
2nd Mobile Engineer Regiment
2nd Army
20th Ind. Mtn Gun Battalion
Mongol Garrison Army
10th Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
5th Mortar Battalion
13th Army
2nd Mortar Battalion
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
18th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
5th RF Gun Battalion
21st Mortar Battalion
3rd Mortar Battalion
2nd RF Gun Battalion
3rd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
15th Army
23rd Army
3rd Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
2nd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
Southern Army
4th Mortar Battalion
14th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion

Defending units:
63rd Chinese Corps
67th Chinese Corps
84th Chinese Corps
5th Chinese Cavalry Corps
44th Chinese Corps
45th Chinese Corps
31st Chinese Corps
49th Chinese Corps
64th Chinese Corps
72nd Chinese Corps
65th Chinese Corps
78th Chinese Corps
48th Chinese Corps
6th Chinese Corps
7th Construction Regiment
17th Chinese Base Force
31st Group Army
11th Group Army
9th Chinese Base Force
9th War Area
7th Chinese Base Force
13th Chinese Base Force
29th Group Army
16th Group Army
18th Chinese Base Force
2nd Chinese Base Force
20th Chinese Base Force
1st Group Army
3rd Group Army
23rd Group Army
35th Group Army
7th War Area
12th Group Army
11th Chinese Base Force
9th Group Army
89th Chinese Corps
56th AT Gun Regiment

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Ground combat at Kienko (78,41)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 37201 troops, 288 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1313

Defending force 44118 troops, 471 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1061

Japanese adjusted assault: 518

Allied adjusted defense: 327

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), preparation(-), experience(-)
supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1924 casualties reported
Squads: 7 destroyed, 325 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 19 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 8 disabled

Allied ground losses:
1162 casualties reported
Squads: 29 destroyed, 173 disabled
Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 60 disabled
Engineers: 5 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 37 (6 destroyed, 31 disabled)

Assaulting units:
3rd Division
61st Infantry Brigade
7th Ind.Mixed Brigade
11th Indpt Infantry Regiment
13th Ind.Mixed Brigade
12th Indpt Infantry Regiment

Defending units:
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
3rd Prov Chinese Corps
8th Route Army
95th Chinese Corps
41st Chinese Corps
35th Chinese Corps
42nd Chinese Corps
98th Chinese Corps
66th Chinese Corps
43rd Chinese Corps
61st Chinese Corps
34th Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Base Force

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Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 4/29/2012 3:45:03 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 638

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 4/30/2012 8:15:48 PM

SqzMyLemon

Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline

Hi obvert,

I'll have some resource movement info for you shortly. I'd like to collect another 4-5 days worth before I do. Something interesting I learned was if you do not set Fusan to stockpile oil it won't migrate there. I set it to stockpile oil and 180 tonnes then appeared, I didn't touch it and it remained the same for a week with no change in the amount. Here's the interesting part. I set a small tanker to begin loading oil and discovered that drew more oil to the port. For example, day one the transport loaded the 180 oil, the next day the tanker had loaded another 400 or so, but Fusan now had a stockpile of almost 500 oil, more than the 180 as previously. It seems loading the oil on a transport is somehow causing more oil to be drawn to the base. Now, where the oil is coming from is another matter. That I don't know yet.

I don't know if you've been playing around and knew this already, but I thought I'd pass it on.

_____________________________

Luck is the residue of design - John Milton

Don't mistake lack of talent for genius - Peter Steele (Type O Negative)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 639

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 9:40:26 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

Thanks again for your testing. It's great to get other info about the mysteries of the game.

Pax mentioned early on to always have a tanker loading to get the oil or fuel to flow regularly. So I have always kept a tanker there and when it leaves another starts loading. I have the same experience of getting this trickle of oil, no more than about 500-600 at a time. What has also happened is that Port Arthur is being depleted of oil. That is not good. It's gone form around 170,000 oil steady and holding during the first 5-6 months to about 120,000 now. So I know where it's coming from. The fuel situation is similar, although much more of it diverts to Fusan. I have about 40,000 fuel there now. But Port Arthur has gone down as well.

So it leaves me wondering what to do. I can't just not move the stuff out of Singapore.

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)

Post #: 640

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 10:13:04 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

16 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: Grayling attacks an xAK near the HI. No hits either side.

So Pac: Mines are nearly out of Noumea now and there is an ASW group there hoping to catch SSTs going in for the troops. So far only the KB air has hit one.

Netties hit Cairns getting some damage to the fields, but only damaging 3 B-25C.

China: Massive bombing and troops beginning to recover, again.

Burma: Massive raids arrived today. Lightnings came first and last. In the early sweep 25 tore through 21 Oscars and 23 Tojos. 5 Oscars and 4 Tojos lost for 3 Lightnings. Then the bombing raid arrived with P-40s providing the escort. They suffered but kept the bombers completely secure, which made me mad. The Lightnings finished things off with another sweep getting 6 Oscars and 4 more Tojos for 2 Lightnings.

Oddly, the bombers went after the troops. Not sure if that was mistaken settings or what. I think my setting of Tojos at 26k didn't take advantage of their ability to meet Lightning sweeps up high, so I've reset them to 31k. Oscars will be set at different altitudes from 12k-20k. At Magwe the Nicks are at 12k to hit bombers, the Oscars at 20k and the A6M3s at 31k.
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Morning Air attack on Katha , at 61,43

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 32 NM, estimated altitude 36,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 21
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 24

Allied aircraft
P-38E Lightning x 25

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 3 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-38E Lightning: 1 destroyed

CAP engaged:
64th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(11 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 4 being recalled, 5 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 43 minutes
11th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(10 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 10 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
10th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (0 airborne, 4 on standby, 6 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 2 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters to 20000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 10 minutes
47th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (0 airborne, 4 on standby, 7 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 26000 , scrambling fighters to 26000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 14 minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Morning Air attack on 50th Field AA Battalion, at 61,43 (Katha)

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 40 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 22
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 17

Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 32
B-26 Marauder x 64
P-40E Warhawk x 49

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Blenheim IV: 1 damaged
B-26 Marauder: 1 damaged
P-40E Warhawk: 7 destroyed

Japanese ground losses:
34 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
16 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
16 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb
16 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb
16 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
16 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb
16 x B-26 Marauder bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 6 x 500 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
11th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (5 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(5 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
5 plane(s) intercepting now.
6 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 21000 and 27000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 64 minutes
64th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (5 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(4 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
5 plane(s) intercepting now.
6 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 15000 and 25170.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 100 minutes
10th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
6 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 13000 and 28000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 80 minutes
47th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 3 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 26000 , scrambling fighters between 21000 and 26000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 33 minutes

Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 8th Field AF Construction Battalion ...
Also attacking 49th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 50th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 8th Field AF Construction Battalion ...
Also attacking 49th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 50th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 8th Field AF Construction Battalion ...
Also attacking 49th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 50th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 8th Field AF Construction Battalion ...
Also attacking 49th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 50th Field AA Battalion ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 8th Field AF Construction Battalion ...
Also attacking 49th Field AA Battalion ...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on 93rd JAAF AF Bn , at 61,43 (Katha)

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 34 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 18
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 15

Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 29
P-40E Warhawk x 12

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
Blenheim IV: 1 destroyed, 4 damaged
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
14 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
14 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
11th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (0 airborne, 3 on standby, 3 scrambling)
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 27000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 51 minutes
10 planes vectored on to bombers
10th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 4 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
2 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 28000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 39 minutes
7 planes vectored on to bombers
47th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 6 scrambling)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 26000 , scrambling fighters between 17000 and 26000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 34 minutes
7 planes vectored on to bombers
64th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (1 airborne, 1 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 20000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 28 minutes
5 planes vectored on to bombers

Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...
Also attacking 93rd JAAF AF Bn ...
Also attacking 33rd Road Const Co ...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Katha , at 61,43

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 36 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 17
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 14

Allied aircraft
P-38E Lightning x 25

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 5 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 3 destroyed

No Allied losses

CAP engaged:
11th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 3 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 3 being recalled, 4 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 27000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 32 minutes
10th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
2 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 3 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 28000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 38 minutes
64th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 4 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 14000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 16 minutes
47th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 7 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 26000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 641

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 2:57:26 PM

ny59giants

Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline

Are your using CAP or LRCAP at Katha?? If CAP, then set their range to 0. It seems to place more fighters on CAP as some don't need to be recalled from nearby hexes.

_____________________________

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 642

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 4:47:31 PM

SqzMyLemon

Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Thanks again for your testing. It's great to get other info about the mysteries of the game.

Pax mentioned early on to always have a tanker loading to get the oil or fuel to flow regularly.

Seems I'm late to the party once again.

_____________________________

Luck is the residue of design - John Milton

Don't mistake lack of talent for genius - Peter Steele (Type O Negative)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 643

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 6:31:10 PM

SqzMyLemon

Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

So it leaves me wondering what to do. I can't just not move the stuff out of Singapore.

I wonder if it's the fact we're using Singapore almost exclusively. If for example, Fusan is drawing more fuel/oil/resources because we are actively withdrawing from it, does it not stand to reason that Singapore is drawing fuel/oil/resources because we are withdrawing so much from it? Is this preventing it migrating east? What if Saigon, Camh Ranh Bay or Hong Kong were used more? Would they draw out stockpiles from Singapore? Just throwing this out there.

_____________________________

Luck is the residue of design - John Milton

Don't mistake lack of talent for genius - Peter Steele (Type O Negative)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 644

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 8:18:55 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SqzMyLemon

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

So it leaves me wondering what to do. I can't just not move the stuff out of Singapore.

I wonder if it's the fact we're using Singapore almost exclusively. If for example, Fusan is drawing more fuel/oil/resources because we are actively withdrawing from it, does it not stand to reason that Singapore is drawing fuel/oil/resources because we are withdrawing so much from it? Is this preventing it migrating east? What if Saigon, Camh Ranh Bay or Hong Kong were used more? Would they draw out stockpiles from Singapore? Just throwing this out there.

I suspect that might be it for why Singapore is holding it. I'll try to start pulling it out of others and see if that matters. Also, I have about 100 ships in there and that pools fuel too. I have tried pulling fuel out of Hong Kong, and that works. It keeps about 12k all of the time now. But I just don't know where it's coming from, Port Arthur, Sian and Lanchow or from the South. Or all of the above.

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)

Post #: 645

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 8:21:41 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Are your using CAP or LRCAP at Katha?? If CAP, then set their range to 0. It seems to place more fighters on CAP as some don't need to be recalled from nearby hexes.

I'll try that. It's just tough because I want the bases to support each other. If I start using 0 hex CAP then each one has to fight alone. For Katha it might be the right choice though. It's so close he can concentrate everything on it. I might then keep Lashio's Oscars on 3 hex CAP and the same for those at Schwebo.

(in reply to ny59giants)

Post #: 646

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/1/2012 9:05:20 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

17 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: I-18 is spotted by a YMS near Victoria. Lots of little worthless ASW ships appearing now near major ports.

RO-33 hit once by 3 AMs near Sydney.

So Pac: Oscars fly to Cairns to sweep and this time the Kittyhawks do well. 5 Oscars are lost to 3 Kittyhawks for the day.

The KB continues to hover around Noumea picking off air transports and guarding against any threats to shipping at Koumac.

China: Troops appear to be coming out of Chungking. They are moving in the direction of Neikiang. I have two divisions in this clear space between. There are 500,000 troops in Chungking so I can't risk being caught here even if they have no supply. I'll move them across the river in case he's thinking about trying to break out. I could get about 2,000 AV in the rough wooded hex which should either discourage or wreck these troops, depending on what choice he makes.

Only about 200 AV is currently in Neikiang. I'll also move down 2k AV from Chengtu to defend this base. I'm nervous in case this is a massive breakout army of 10k AV Chinese. I know they've got poor experience and moral and are low on supply but that is a lot of troops!
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Burma: Over Katha today the Allies meet stiffer resistance. The Tojos moving to 31k did the trick against the Lightnings. Today for the first time our forces got positive results against this scourge of a plane.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Katha , at 61,43

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 41 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 48
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 8

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIc Trop x 16
P-38E Lightning x 19

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-38E Lightning: 4 destroyed

CAP engaged:
64th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(9 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 4 being recalled, 1 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 44 minutes
11th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(8 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 4 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
10th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (1 airborne, 3 on standby, 4 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 30000 , scrambling fighters to 30000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 11 minutes
77th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (0 airborne, 8 on standby, 20 scrambling)
8 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 3 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 14000 , scrambling fighters to 14000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 13 minutes

Morning Air attack on Katha , at 61,43

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 39 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 42
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 7

Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 55
Hurricane IIc Trop x 15
P-40E Warhawk x 19

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Blenheim IV: 3 destroyed, 7 damaged

Airbase hits 2
Airbase supply hits 5
Runway hits 19

Aircraft Attacking:
13 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
13 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
15 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
13 x Blenheim IV bombing from 8000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
11th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (5 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(5 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
5 plane(s) intercepting now.
4 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 14000 and 20000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 86 minutes
2 planes vectored on to bombers
10th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
6 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 30000 , scrambling fighters between 17000 and 31000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 47 minutes
77th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
23 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 14000 , scrambling fighters between 13000 and 33170.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 188 minutes
21 planes vectored on to bombers
64th Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 21000 and 33000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 31 minutes
5 planes vectored on to bombers

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/1/2012 9:09:13 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 647

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/2/2012 9:05:38 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

18 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: After a few days of new deployments of Allied subs I can say it looks like about 5 operating South of the HI, 1-2 near Ominato, 3-4 in the DEI and South China Sea. Seems the commitment to the Coral Sea area is using up most of the subs for the Allies right now. Today;

Grayling goes for a support convoy near Fukue-jima but misses AKE Yamahagi Maru.

Ro-67 gets hit twice by AMs near Newcastle.

So Pac: There is very little happening now except the inexorable shrinking of the garrison in Noumea and the slow walk down for the division from Koumac. The KB changes position every day, but just a hex or two to keep the subs guessing. Strangely not many have been sighted down here near the KB. In spite of the great concentration in the area there have been zero hits in the Coral Sea. I do have night search, day search and ASW air plus several surface ASW TFs throughout the area.

Burma: Quiet. Oscar and Tojo groups taking new planes at Magwe and Rangoon.

China: Just a lot of shuffling troops around. Here is an example of one of the typical bombing results.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 21st Chinese Corps, at 78,42 , near Kienko

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 37 NM, estimated altitude 8,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-21-Ic Sally x 13
Ki-21-IIa Sally x 75
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 17

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-21-Ic Sally: 1 damaged

Allied ground losses:
701 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 31 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 94 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
21 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 6000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
8 x Ki-21-Ic Sally bombing from 6000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
19 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 6000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
8 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 6000 feet *
Ground Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb
21 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 6000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
6 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 6000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
5 x Ki-21-Ic Sally bombing from 6000 feet *
Ground Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb

Also attacking 1st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 11th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 13th Group Army ...
Also attacking Red Chinese Army ...
Also attacking 59th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 17th Group Army ...
Also attacking 6th Group Army ...
Also attacking 76th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 96th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 5th War Area ...
Also attacking Central Reserve ...
Also attacking 21st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 11th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking Red Chinese Army ...
Also attacking 21st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 1st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 11th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 13th Group Army ...
Also attacking Red Chinese Army ...
Also attacking 59th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 17th Group Army ...
Also attacking 76th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 96th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking Central Reserve ...
Also attacking 21st Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking 11th Chinese Corps ...
Also attacking Red Chinese Army ...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/2/2012 9:06:07 AM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 648

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/2/2012 9:45:25 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

19 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: At Milne Bay S-41 is discovered and attacked in the port. It bottoms out but the PB still can't get a hit on it.

I-166 attacked by MLs near Karachi.

So Pac: A surprise today. I stupidly split a tanker TF so it could unload more quickly and left the other parts in the port at Milne Bay. Jocke spotted this right away and hit the port with 4Es. Devastation ensued. The 27 Oscars on CAP had virtually no effect on the accuracy of the unescorted strike apparently, as all ships in the port were destroyed. Seems a bit far-fetched to me, but that's the game and I have to learn from it and move on. A good lesson. I might have to reconsider using Rabaul as a main port as well, since it too is within range.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Milne Bay , at 101,133

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid detected at 35 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 27

Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 12
B-24D Liberator x 33

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 2 damaged
B-24D Liberator: 5 damaged

Japanese Ships
TK Ogura Maru #1, Bomb hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Kazegumo, Bomb hits 5, and is sunk
DD Inazuma, Bomb hits 6, heavy fires, heavy damage
PB Toshi Maru #1, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
PB Shonan Maru #6, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk
TK Tatibana Maru, Bomb hits 4, heavy fires, heavy damage

Japanese ground losses:
5 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Port hits 21
Port fuel hits 2

Aircraft Attacking:
11 x B-24D Liberator bombing from 6000 feet
Port Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
11 x B-24D Liberator bombing from 6000 feet
Port Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
11 x B-24D Liberator bombing from 6000 feet
Port Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
12 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 6000 feet
Port Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
203rd Sentai with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (3 airborne, 7 on standby, 17 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 20000 , scrambling fighters between 6000 and 20000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 33 minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

China: The troops did move out of Chungking yesterday, and were reconned thoroughly and bombed today. It is what I feared, a big breakout attempt. There are 350,000 troops here in 75 units. Bombing went well, getting over 700 casualties. For a few days all bombers will be focused on these troops. Forts are building fast in Neikiang.

Arty bombardments will commence at Kweiyang.

At Kienko troops shock attacked, but only achieved a 1:1. More rest and we'll try again.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Kienko (78,41)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 35711 troops, 288 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1159

Defending force 42229 troops, 464 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 905

Japanese adjusted assault: 536

Allied adjusted defense: 269

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), preparation(-), supply(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Japanese ground losses:
4117 casualties reported
Squads: 10 destroyed, 326 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 19 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 21 disabled
Guns lost 25 (1 destroyed, 24 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
1066 casualties reported
Squads: 24 destroyed, 227 disabled
Non Combat: 19 destroyed, 40 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 7 disabled
Guns lost 36 (2 destroyed, 34 disabled)
Units destroyed 3

Assaulting units:
3rd Division
61st Infantry Brigade
7th Ind.Mixed Brigade
13th Ind.Mixed Brigade
11th Indpt Infantry Regiment
12th Indpt Infantry Regiment

Defending units:
35th Chinese Corps
98th Chinese Corps
8th Route Army
41st Chinese Corps
95th Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
42nd Chinese Corps
66th Chinese Corps
3rd Prov Chinese Corps
43rd Chinese Corps
34th Chinese Corps
61st Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Base Force

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Burma: All quiet.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 649

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/2/2012 12:18:06 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

20 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: S-46 hangs around Milne Bay and the escorts for one of the big amphib TFs coming back form Koumac sights it and makes it dive.

RO-46 is attacked by 3 YMS near Suva. No hits.

The amphib TF leaving Koumac hits Dolphin with 6 DCs! Two penetrating. At least puts this one out of business for a while. Nice that this attack was in the open ocean, not the shallows around the islands.

So Pac: Both divisions now on New Caledonia. I might leave them here for a bit until some brigades become free from China. These are troops with experience in the high 80s. Landing anything here in the next 4-5 months would be tough now for the Allies, so mission accomplished at (so far) only the price of some tankers and a few DDs. Also, I've taken out several months worth of PBYs and quite a few subs, most likely, as well as some decent xAPs and other shipping.

More importantly, this has served notice that nothing will go unchallenged for a good time still. It has also pointed out to me the importance of grouping the KB together and has taught me how to support it and work with a large fleet of ships within an area.

China: Artillery bombardment shows the Chinese at Kweiyang to be at about 2,600AV currently. We've pushed back to 4,300AV. The decision has been made to go all out for this base now. It's one of only two the Chinese still hold and if they are trying to push out of China then I need to get troops up toward the mountain fortresses to help form a blockade.

Another 3,500AV worth of partially recovered units that have been in Chihkiang are on their way. These should be able to force a break- through here.

Burma: I noticed there was no fighter cover over Ledo yesterday but 67 auxiliary aircraft are located there. I set up an elaborate succession of sweeps, LR CAP and then an afternoon bombing raid with 45 Bettys, but to no avail. The sweeps met no opposition but weather forced the bombers to stay grounded. This of course let him realize my interest and I'm sure the base will be CAPed tomorrow. The LR CA zeros did bag 4 DC-3 variations flying around. I wonder if they're just carrying supply or if it's troops coming out of China to rebuild in India?

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/3/2012 5:32:46 AM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 650

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/2/2012 1:35:06 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

21 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: Nothing today.

So Pac: The 38th division moved into Noumea today. It will DA tomorrow. I anticipate only some support and mechanized elements of the 2nd Marines to still be here. The KB will stay very close and LR CAP so that no 4E bombings disrupt the attack.

China: The units near Chungking are just getting crushed. Over 1,000 casualties today alone. Tanks from the blockade up the road have been moving to join the force at the river crossing. They will move over if there is a chance once this big stack has pushed on.

Burma: Sure enough, fighters moved into Ledo. Until more bombing units and base forces are released from China, I won't be able to do much more offensively here. The Bettys went back to their normal role of searching the IO for the British.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/3/2012 5:32:24 AM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 651

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 5:51:28 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

22 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: One sub reported hit near Gasmata. That's all.

So Pac: At Noumea the 38th division retook the base. As predicted only elements of several support units were here and a few remnants of the 2nd Marines. The 38th will hold here for a few months and build solid forts, then will be relieved by a Brigade or other similarly sized garrison force.

The KB will move back toward Koumac to continue the refueling process with an AO that has just arrived. Then it will go back into hiding. He's seen enough of it lately.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Noumea (115,160)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 13884 troops, 124 guns, 69 vehicles, Assault Value = 481

Defending force 1992 troops, 28 guns, 66 vehicles, Assault Value = 11

Japanese adjusted assault: 768

Allied adjusted defense: 31

Japanese assault odds: 24 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Noumea !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(+)

Japanese ground losses:
39 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied ground losses:
1157 casualties reported
Squads: 8 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 154 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 25 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 37 (37 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 73 (73 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units destroyed 4

Assaulting units:
38th Division

Defending units:
1st RNZAF Base Force /1
115th USAAF Base Force
111th USN Base Force /1
2nd Marine Div /9

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

China: Most of the action in China today was in the air with every bomber in the IJAAF arsenal hitting troops between Chungking and Neikiang. The results were the most impressive the IJAAF has produced so far. The tally below is combined from several separate raids. That should get some disruption going.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 14th Chinese Corps, at 77,43 , near Chungking

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid spotted at 37 NM, estimated altitude 8,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft

Ki-21-Ic Sally x 51
Ki-21-IIa Sally x 167
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 30

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-21-IIa Sally: 3 damaged

Allied ground losses:
1772 casualties reported
Squads: 12 destroyed, 143 disabled
Non Combat: 8 destroyed, 118 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also today troops broke through at Kienko at last in the their third attempt. The numbers are good and these Chinese should be crippled for good. The IJA will pursue.

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Ground combat at Kienko (78,41)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 33402 troops, 288 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 925

Defending force 40337 troops, 454 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 722

Japanese adjusted assault: 662

Allied adjusted defense: 215

Japanese assault odds: 3 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), preparation(-), experience(-)
supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1856 casualties reported
Squads: 5 destroyed, 201 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 22 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 22 disabled

Allied ground losses:
11700 casualties reported
Squads: 623 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 568 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 12 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 54 (49 destroyed, 5 disabled)
Units retreated 10

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
3rd Division
7th Ind.Mixed Brigade
11th Indpt Infantry Regiment
61st Infantry Brigade
13th Ind.Mixed Brigade
12th Indpt Infantry Regiment

Defending units:
41st Chinese Corps
95th Chinese Corps
8th Route Army
98th Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
35th Chinese Corps
42nd Chinese Corps
66th Chinese Corps
3rd Prov Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Base Force

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Burma: Nothing. Just getting planes into groups and into working order.

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Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/3/2012 5:52:09 AM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 652

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 8:52:03 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

23 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: I-166 continues to lurk near Karachi and then sail away for a few days on a loop patrol. This seems to be throwing ASW off the track, and the sub found success again today. It put one of a two torpedo spread into xAK Maridal, and sinking sounds were heard afterward.

I-166 was later tracked by a 4 DD ASW team and one hit was on target. The sub will head back for repairs and replenishment.

So Pac: The KB goes into sub-killer mode and begins to crush the multiple sub TFs in the area. At least 5 hits reported today, which probably means at least 2 are real. With 250kg bombs on the Kates and Vals these should be critical hits.

Burma: Nothing again.

China: Here is a sample of the very successful bombardment of Kweiyang. A shock attack will go forward tomorrow as all of the Central Army troops are in place now. An impressive array. I have to break through here now if I want to shore up the mountain blockade in time and prepare to deal with the massive stack moving toward Neikiang.

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Ground combat at Kweiyang (74,49)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 4465 troops, 406 guns, 193 vehicles, Assault Value = 7325

Defending force 84711 troops, 639 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2620

Allied ground losses:
292 casualties reported
Squads: 6 destroyed, 12 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Assaulting units:
40th Division
34th Division
116th Division
41st Infantry Regiment
32nd Division
51st Infantry Brigade
2nd Division
17th Division
2nd Ind.Mixed Brigade
22nd Division
18th Division
104th Division
4th Division
1st Mobile Infantry Regiment
55th Infantry Brigade
2nd Recon Battalion
2nd Mobile Infantry Regiment
21st Division
Imperial Guards Division
21st Ind.Mixed Brigade
57th Infantry Brigade
28th Engineer Regiment
51st Division
6th Division
8th Engineer Regiment
1st Recon Battalion
13th Division
39th Division
2nd Mobile Engineer Regiment
15th Army
Southern Army
10th Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
2nd Area Army
2nd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
3rd Mortar Battalion
21st Mortar Battalion
18th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
2nd RF Gun Battalion
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
Mongol Garrison Army
3rd Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
4th Mortar Battalion
5th RF Gun Battalion
13th Army
3rd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
2nd Army
2nd Mortar Battalion
23rd Army
5th Mortar Battalion
20th Ind. Mtn Gun Battalion
14th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion

Defending units:
44th Chinese Corps
72nd Chinese Corps
78th Chinese Corps
64th Chinese Corps
48th Chinese Corps
84th Chinese Corps
49th Chinese Corps
5th Chinese Cavalry Corps
63rd Chinese Corps
65th Chinese Corps
31st Chinese Corps
45th Chinese Corps
67th Chinese Corps
6th Chinese Corps
17th Chinese Base Force
9th Chinese Base Force
9th Group Army
31st Group Army
7th War Area
18th Chinese Base Force
7th Construction Regiment
3rd Group Army
11th Chinese Base Force
20th Chinese Base Force
89th Chinese Corps
11th Group Army
1st Group Army
13th Chinese Base Force
7th Chinese Base Force
29th Group Army
35th Group Army
2nd Chinese Base Force
56th AT Gun Regiment

----------------------------------------------------------------

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 653

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 9:05:07 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

24 August 1942
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

subs: RO-33 was attacked near the NW coast by AMs. No hits.

So Pac: Many more sub hits reported today as the KB heads back through the Coral Sea. I'm sending the ships on a course more to the West to skirt the obvious sub pileup directly North of Belep Islands.

Several small SCTFs are left to defend New Caledonia and nearby areas. Koumac just made level 1 airfield. Once I can get another zero group in the area it will take station here.

Burma: No news.

China: Kweiyang was captured today. The cost was high to both sides. Massive disablements on the IJA side. The Chinese suffered over 1k infantry squads destroyed. This opens a door to the mountains for reinforcements, but with disruption in the 60-80 range for most units, a few days of rest will begin before any movement up the road.

Neikiang is about to make level 3 forts. This should protect it from the horde still moving slowly in from Chungking. With 2,400 AV in the city, some supply to keep them in the white, and more troops ready to tour in from the rear, I think the bases are covered now.

Chengtu will make level 2 forts soon and should be able to get to level 3 before any serious threat arrives from another big stack in the crossroads North of Chungking currently and showing movement in that direction.

Jocke has written to begin some negotiations on the state of things in China. More on that in a separate post later.

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Ground combat at Kweiyang (74,49)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 236934 troops, 2455 guns, 1215 vehicles, Assault Value = 7390

Defending force 84487 troops, 638 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2603

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 0

Japanese adjusted assault: 5013

Allied adjusted defense: 765

Japanese assault odds: 6 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Kweiyang !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker: shock(+), disruption(-)

Japanese ground losses:
15928 casualties reported
Squads: 81 destroyed, 2208 disabled
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 102 disabled
Engineers: 53 destroyed, 146 disabled
Guns lost 229 (5 destroyed, 224 disabled)
Vehicles lost 152 (4 destroyed, 148 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
34498 casualties reported
Squads: 1081 destroyed, 347 disabled
Non Combat: 919 destroyed, 471 disabled
Engineers: 276 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 237 (220 destroyed, 17 disabled)
Units retreated 33

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
22nd Division
6th Division
2nd Division
2nd Recon Battalion
1st Mobile Infantry Regiment
51st Division
2nd Mobile Infantry Regiment
104th Division
32nd Division
57th Infantry Brigade
17th Division
40th Division
1st Recon Battalion
18th Division
39th Division
28th Engineer Regiment
13th Division
Imperial Guards Division
4th Division
21st Ind.Mixed Brigade
8th Engineer Regiment
55th Infantry Brigade
116th Division
41st Infantry Regiment
34th Division
2nd Ind.Mixed Brigade
51st Infantry Brigade
21st Division
2nd Mobile Engineer Regiment
2nd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
2nd RF Gun Battalion
20th Ind. Mtn Gun Battalion
13th Army
23rd Army
3rd Mortar Battalion
2nd Area Army
3rd Medium Field Artillery Regiment
2nd Army
Southern Army
5th RF Gun Battalion
2nd Mortar Battalion
10th Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
4th Mortar Battalion
3rd Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment
3rd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
21st Mortar Battalion
Mongol Garrison Army
5th Mortar Battalion
18th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
15th Army
14th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion

Defending units:
64th Chinese Corps
45th Chinese Corps
78th Chinese Corps
72nd Chinese Corps
65th Chinese Corps
67th Chinese Corps
84th Chinese Corps
31st Chinese Corps
5th Chinese Cavalry Corps
44th Chinese Corps
49th Chinese Corps
48th Chinese Corps
63rd Chinese Corps
6th Chinese Corps
9th Chinese Base Force
3rd Group Army
18th Chinese Base Force
7th Chinese Base Force
1st Group Army
11th Chinese Base Force
29th Group Army
89th Chinese Corps
7th War Area
31st Group Army
17th Chinese Base Force
20th Chinese Base Force
2nd Chinese Base Force
11th Group Army
35th Group Army
7th Construction Regiment
13th Chinese Base Force
9th Group Army
56th AT Gun Regiment

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 654

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 9:21:13 AM

jrcar

Posts: 3613
Joined: 4/19/2002
From: Seymour, Australia
Status: offline

I like your use of pictures!

It does help to be drawing stuff for the demand to drive the movement of fuel/oil... although it doesn't always work.

cheers

Rob

_____________________________

AE BETA Breaker

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 655

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 10:07:19 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrcar

I like your use of pictures!

It does help to be drawing stuff for the demand to drive the movement of fuel/oil... although it doesn't always work.

cheers

Rob

Thanks. I work in images, so it's fun for me to visualize some of the things going on.

I am going to try sucking things from a few ports up the line from Singapore to at least see if I can get the stuff to move to someplace like Hong Kong. If that works I'll go from there.

(in reply to jrcar)

Post #: 656

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 2:07:44 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

CHINA: Questions
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Today Jocke sent a long note about China. He's very frustrated with the ability of the troops to keep supply and fighting ability during constant bombing. He of course can't oppose the raids because there is no supply.

Here is an excerpt from his email:

So I was thinking about the Chinese fall and how that will effect our game. I�m not sure exacty what it will mean in terms of the Jap economy but I guess it will give you a solid boost all over the board in terms of resources and industry? I also assume it will realse a huge amount of troops for you?

My questions is simply put; what now? I don�t really know what this means in terms of the game. I think we both still want a plausible war. Some things I have been thinking of:

Strategic bombing in China. Should this be allowed now?
Garrisions. The build in requirements are really low and the game doesn�t simulate this very well. Thoughts?

My response was almost to allow concessions immediately. We have a good relationship and I don't want him to sour on the game now. I then thought some more and realized that so much of my strategic plan is based on China that to allow strategic bombing would weaken everything I've fought for there.

Here are some of my thoughts:

China, as you've discovered, is the main focus of my strategy for the entire game. The only reason I put so much into it was I see it as the best way the Japanese can make use of their one lasting advantage; a strong army.

The boost to the Japanese economy will not be huge. There are some centers of HI in China, but most are damaged and require a lot of supply to get going. They are also far inland and fuel might or might not flow there on a regular basis. It's not like India or OZ.

As for the releasing of troops, all of the troops that begin in China are restricted. If I were to buy them out, that would cost the equivalent of about 35 day's worth of PPs for a division. So at roughly one per month you can see that even by the end of the war I wouldn't get all of the troops out of China. Firstly, I still need PPs for other things, and secondly it's a LOT of troops!

Strategic bombing: If we change this it makes the entire reason for taking China obsolete. All you would have to do is build Ledo into a size 9 airbase and you can hit 80% of Chinese industry with 4Es and even some with 2Es. You put 50 Lightnings on CAP and 100 P-40s and I can't do anything to stop it. That would mean my entire IJAAF would have to leave Burma to defend the industry in China, and it still wouldn't be able to do it.

Garrisons: As stated above, most of the armies in China now will be in China for a long time. By the time I can even buy out half of them I would have to start thinking of how to defend against the Russians anyway. If we have 28 months until 45 arrives, that would be about 42,500 PPs from now until then. If I used ALL of those for buying divisions, that would be about 24 divisions at 1750 per. I would probably not be able to use more than 60-70% to buy out troops if I were being frugal with other things like changing commanders, group leaders and changing air group types, etc.

So that would be about 15-16 divisions I could realistically buy out. That is a lot, but only about 7,000 AV of the 14,000-15,000 that the Japanese have now in China, and only VERY slowly. I will be getting more divisions and other troops to China and Manchuria as well, but as you can see many of them will be staying right where they are, and can't move anywhere. Maybe that will make things tougher on the Russians, but I think it won't matter much by then.

Does anyone have thoughts about how to deal with a 'plausible' conquered China in late 42? Something with a somewhat realistic feel even though the situation probably could never have happened this way?

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

As this map shows, if strategic bombing is allowed, most everywhere that has HI or oil/refineries in China becomes vulnerable to 4E bombing.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/3/2012 2:14:52 PM >

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 657

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 2:29:35 PM

Historiker

Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline

retreat from the inner 4 bases until 1/1/44.
He is allowed to come out, you mustn't go in until 44.

This way, you can benefit from a small front, the conquered industry and buy out a reasonable amount of troops. But as he is still there, you have to take care of the area and can't send troops out at will.

In 44, the overall situation should be deteriorating enough that either he has already opened a road to the "reservation", or that he can still advance despite china being taken out.

I think that's a fair deal for both sides.

_____________________________

Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 658

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 7:13:01 PM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Historiker

retreat from the inner 4 bases until 1/1/44.
He is allowed to come out, you mustn't go in until 44.

This way, you can benefit from a small front, the conquered industry and buy out a reasonable amount of troops. But as he is still there, you have to take care of the area and can't send troops out at will.

In 44, the overall situation should be deteriorating enough that either he has already opened a road to the "reservation", or that he can still advance despite china being taken out.

I think that's a fair deal for both sides.

Interesting idea, but there are some problems. I already own 3 of the 4 inner bases! His only surviving base is Chungking. Plus, in the sense of how the Japanese would react to this situation in reality, wouldn't they have just bombed the inner region to dust?

This also would mean that I would gain much less from conquering of China. The whole idea is to take out one of the fronts Japan has to face and get a bit more industrial capacity to reserve HI for the future. If I leave the 500,000 troops China still has for 1 1/2 years, then I lose. They become a dominant force again, and any troops I bring out to garrison Burma and the islands would be leaving the situation tentative at best in China by 44. Plus the majority of the HI is in Chengtu and Chungking.

I know you're trying to posit a 'plausible' solution, as I requested, but consider that I based ALL of my strategic decisions on China from the beginning of the game. If I had chosen another route, I might have OZ now instead. Probably not, but maybe close. So would I then also have to make concessions because it isn't likely that Japan could have taken out OZ in reality? Or India?

I have a hard time seeing a way through this without just cutting down the rest of the Chinese troops and placing Chungking under siege. At that point I could voluntarily keep a big garrison force in China. That would make sense. Something like the 8k AV rule in Manchuria.

I could also set a date at which I think political pressure would have been strong enough to force the Allies to strategically bomb China in spite of the cost this would have to the Chinese and to future political interests (not wanting to give the Communists any extra fodder for their anti-western propaganda machine). Something like when the B-29 becomes available. And maybe if he can recon the base before that date and there are no fighters present he can strat bomb as well. That'll make me keep support units and fighters in China permanently. Of course I'll get my industry ground into pulp in late 44, but that would allow me two year's production out of it anyway.

Both Jocke and I know he could have defended it better, and made me take longer to get the territory I've now gained. Because this is the first PBEM for us both to go this far I'd like to cut him some slack but don't want to give up everything either.

< Message edited by obvert -- 5/3/2012 7:15:52 PM >

(in reply to Historiker)

Post #: 659

RE: Wild Sheep's Chase - obvert (J) vs JocMeister (A) - 5/3/2012 7:19:15 PM

Historiker

Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline

Well, if China were really so easy and fast to conquer, the whole war wouldn't have happend. So while you played a good game, no doubt, you benefited from an unrealistic game, bad enemy tactics and the engine.

Even if you agree to what I propose, it doesn't mean you loose China in 44. You've pushed so far, why should it be significantly different later? Also, you benefit from all that ressources, oil and HI meanwhile.

Anyways, your descision.

Other proposion:
1. garrison every base with 4 times the requirement.
2. every unit leaving china must first be changed to restricted Kwangtun and after that to the free base to double the PP costs.

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(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 660

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