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OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 11:25:31 AM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		Does anyone think I might need better subs?

Here you go:

https://www.vebeg.de/web/de/verkauf/suchen.htm?DO_SUCHE=1&SUCH_KFZEGAL=1&SUCH_FREITEXT=206&statflag=1&zusatzlink&SHOW_AUS=1214300&SHOW_LOS=1

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RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 12:38:55 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline 		they have to be scrapped... either in the EU or in Turkey, why Turkey?

< Message edited by castor troy -- 3/21/2012 12:40:38 PM >

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RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 12:46:23 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		Who knows...

There were 6 and Thailand intended to buy them all. Obviously that didn't work out.

_____________________________

Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

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Post #: 3
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 12:48:39 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		The Thais have no money. Like everybody else...

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Post #: 4
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 12:58:53 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		Taiwan could've used them. They only have two and one is from WW2...

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Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

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Post #: 5
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 1:06:19 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		The PRC won't let them.

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Post #: 6
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 1:22:21 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		They could've sold them for scrap. Like the Varjag...


_____________________________

Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

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Post #: 7
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 2:57:34 PM   
Dili

 

Posts: 4708
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline 		Who wants a submarine with almost 40 years, no AIP. That is a just a money pit. Scrap yard it is the right place for it.

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Post #: 8
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/21/2012 3:51:40 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		These subs were good enough to get US CVs into their periscope sight just a few years ago. They are rather coastal subs - exactly what Taiwan needs.

But never mind. I just thought its funny that they are sold like an old car.

< Message edited by Historiker -- 3/21/2012 4:20:43 PM >

_____________________________

Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

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Post #: 9
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:43:26 AM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
Status: offline 		The USN sold some surplus 16 inch gun barrels by auction a few years ago.

I wish somebody had the money to save the Cabot a few years ago. It had been in the Spanish navy since the 50s and they gave it back to the US around 2002. It sat in Texas for a couple of years until they finally scrapped it. But then the money isn't there to save the Olympia either, and she's already a museum ship.

Bill

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Post #: 10
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 3:51:33 AM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline 		They'd be better than our semi submersibles!

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RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 9:52:09 AM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		Where are you from Jeff?

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Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

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Post #: 12
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:30:26 PM   
Sredni

 

Posts: 705
Joined: 9/30/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline 		They're just tiny little things, they might just be too small to be truly useful for much.

I was curious how they compare the the victoria (formerly upholder class) subs canada has, thinking that perhaps canada would have been better off buying second hand from someone else heh, but the 206 class ones are super small. The victoria class subs are 2,455 tonnes displacement according to wikipedia while the 206 are under 500t and not even half the length.

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Post #: 13
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:38:29 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sredni

They're just tiny little things, they might just be too small to be truly useful for much.

I was curious how they compare the the victoria (formerly upholder class) subs canada has, thinking that perhaps canada would have been better off buying second hand from someone else heh, but the 206 class ones are super small. The victoria class subs are 2,455 tonnes displacement according to wikipedia while the 206 are under 500t and not even half the length.



modern midgets

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Post #: 14
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:38:35 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		The Type 206 was made for use in the Baltic and North Sea, so it needed to be small.

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Post #: 15
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:39:53 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		And now try to find such a tiny sub when its hiding. Being diesel-electric, it makes, unlike a nuclear sub, absolutly no sound when lying on the ground.
Eight torpedo tubes give it some power, and you should guess that the nation that produced most subs in the world should know its business

But of course, this sub was built for a certain purpose: To defend the Baltic Sea against soviet invasion forces. Thus a small size (size of German subs was also limited to 1000ts after the war) and the short range are more than enough for that purpose.

But who threatens to invade canada's coast? I'd guess you'll need something bigger, if the subs shouldn't only be used to guard the Northwest Passage,

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Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

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Post #: 16
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:41:47 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		Gotcha

Allright, I admit. I have some natiional pride about that tiny things.




Attachment (1)

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Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

(in reply to Historiker)
Post #: 17
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 1:59:56 PM   
Sredni

 

Posts: 705
Joined: 9/30/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline 		Yeah, I'm looking at them through the goggles of Canada's needs. Long endurance patrol boats for things like patrolling the northwest passage. Honestly I figured we should have probably gone hole hog and gotten some decent nuclear subs from somewhere (or developed our own as costly and risky as that is). but meh

I suppose someone with less coastline would find a smaller boat with less endurance a more fitting vessel. Though I notice Germany's new sub the type 212 is 1,830 tonnes displacement, so quite a bit bigger. That could reflect changing goals though rather then any real inherent inadequacy of the 206 at what it was used for.

A thoroughly modern boat the 212. Wish Canada had gone that route.

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Post #: 18
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 10:49:03 PM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Historiker

Where are you from Jeff?

'Stralia

My flag dissapeared!!!

We could use them in Sydney Harbour or Port Phillip Bay.

They could also base out of our ports in the north like Port Hedland and Gladstone and defend against any raiders.

< Message edited by JeffK -- 3/22/2012 10:52:06 PM >

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Post #: 19
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/22/2012 10:54:03 PM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline 		?
I thought the Collins are really good subs.

_____________________________

Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 20
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/23/2012 10:24:36 AM   
Empire101


Posts: 1950
Joined: 5/20/2008
From: Coruscant
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Historiker

Gotcha

Allright, I admit. I have some natiional pride about that tiny things.





Careful.... that gloved hand has a mind of its own you know!!


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Post #: 21
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/23/2012 11:07:59 AM   
Historiker


Posts: 4742
Joined: 7/4/2007
From: Deutschland
Status: offline
quote:

Careful.... that gloved hand has a mind of its own you know!!



_____________________________

Without any doubt: I am the spawn of evil - and the Bavarian Beer Monster (BBM)!

There's only one bad word and that's taxes. If any other word is good enough for sailors; it's good enough for you. - Ron Swanson

(in reply to Empire101)
Post #: 22
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/23/2012 5:07:56 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Historiker

?
I thought the Collins are really good subs.


They are.

Practically all of their well publicised defiencies arise only if they are handled incompetently. The teething problems of a new class have subsequently been fixed. The fact is that there was no prototype built. All prototypes of any new weapon system always have teething problems.

Alfred

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Post #: 23
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/23/2012 9:33:56 PM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred


quote:

ORIGINAL: Historiker

?
I thought the Collins are really good subs.


They are.

Practically all of their well publicised defiencies arise only if they are handled incompetently. The teething problems of a new class have subsequently been fixed. The fact is that there was no prototype built. All prototypes of any new weapon system always have teething problems.

Alfred


Hardly a succes story.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collins_class_submarine

It was our first try at building submarines, maybe next time we get a better result.

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Post #: 24
RE: OT: Need better subs? - 3/23/2012 9:34:30 PM   
khyberbill


Posts: 1941
Joined: 9/11/2007
From: new milford, ct
Status: offline
quote:

And now try to find such a tiny sub when its hiding. Being diesel-electric, it makes, unlike a nuclear sub, absolutly no sound when lying on the ground.

The Narwhal, SSN 671, made very little sound when under 60% power and almost none when not moving. I trained on the prototype reactor for this sub and it was very quiet in the engine room as compared to a 637 class engine room.

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