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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited

 
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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:03:50 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Focus on AGN....

Soviets pull off the Luga Line in the NW, allowing 18th Army to advance unapposed, but this also removes the possibility of a pocket and over stretching the Soviet defenses.

4th Pz Grp's both PzKps work to clear the last really poor terrain before Mga and the vital Leningrad rail link. Its slow progress, with the panzers both heavily fatigured, low on tanks and supply. Yet, progress is made with 2xRifle Div being encircled, and another 10-20 miles gained. We'll have to rest the panzers, and hopefully we'll be able to conduct an HQ build shortly as the RR repair closes on Pskov.

16th Army remains over stretched and fails to close the distance on a small pocket on the shore of Lake Ilmen. Its II Korps remains closely tied to the advance of 4th Pz Grp, but isn't probably strong enough to take the fortified city of Novgorod. This is going to be tough...

I've decided to reinforce AGN with additional infantry from across the front - one Korps and probably up towards a half dozen infantry divisions - I'm going to need that combat power to cut Leningrad off allowing 18th Army to assualt the city itself. I've still got some time left, but I'd really like to get 4th Pz Grp heading around the Valdai Hills and Kalinin enroute towards Moscow. AGC will need this thrust from the north to draw forces away from Moscow's western defenses as it closes on the Capital.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:22:34 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Focus on AGC.

For the first time in the campaign, the panzers fail to close a pocket - a sure sign of increasing fatigue and lack of supply rather than significantly increased Soviet resistance.

In fact, east of Smolensk has been rather inconsistant - likely just reaching the outer defenses of Moscow along the Rzhev-Vyazma line.

3rd Pz Grp, with XXXIX PzKps freshly supplied with an HQ buildup attempts to cut off the withdrawing Soviet forces - estimated at about a dozen divisions NE of Velizh. While its fuel and ammo are in good shape now, it is still well fatigued - cuts off Veliki Luki, and surges east, but fails to dislodge the last Soviet defenses between itself and the other thrust of the LVII PzKps - itself fatigued and not benefited of an HQ buildup. Bottom line - 3rd Pz Grp is now over-reaching and has failed to close the trap.

2nd Pz Grp continues to push east on its last fuel, its XXIV PzKps reaches the Soviet defenses being established near Vyazma. The defenses look to be incomplete, but the PzKps doesn't have the strength to batter it down - it must infiltrate through the gaps, hoping to collapse the defenses before they can be fully manned. I divert XXXXVII Pzkps south toward 4th Army to take advantage of some Rifle Divisions which are slow to withdraw, in an attempt to pocket them - again, lack of fuel prohibits the firm closure of a pocket.

4th Army continues to batter its way against a delaying action towards Bryansk. Without Panzers, its not constrained by fuel, but it is also limits its abiltiy to exploit success.

Overall, the "near" pockets may still pay off, as the Soviets will be challenged to fully get clear. Would have been better to have them closed of course. In any case, I need to pull the panzers out of the line and rest them for two weeks - getting at least two PzKps a build up. Lead panzers are about 100 miles west of Moscow! Soviet defenses will improve with each week of course. We'll need supporting attacks from both AGN and AGS to fully envelop and seize the Soviet Capital in the coming months.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:32:43 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Focus on AGS.

While we've managed two bridgeheads across the Dnepr, we're out of gas and fatigued and can't exploit the potential success. Railheads are still well to the west and we're not close to being able to conduct an HQ buildup in 1st Pz Grp - perhaps in 6th Army's XXXXVI PzKps.

Primary objectives at this point are to rest the panzers in order to attack, expand the bridgeheads with infantry, maintain pressure on Dneprotpetrovsk to contain its armament centers trapped there and to gain a bridgehead across the Dnepr in 11th Army's area to open up the lower Dnepr Bend area.

As elsewhere, we're going to require a pause for about 2 weeks to rest and gain supply in sufficient quantity before striking out towards Kharkov.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:34:55 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		While we need an operational pause across the front as we move into August, July was VERY successfull!!! Destroyed units show the gains made, good tallys in Rifle and Tank Divs.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:36:53 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Overall losses going into August. Solid losses for the Soviets, but German losses, especially in panzers were not "light". Still, pressure needs to be maintained on the Soviets, we're far from finishing off the Bear.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:39:24 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Despite the huge Soviet losses, the Bear still gains in size!!! Simply amazing! This will only get worse as the German army needs to pause for a few weeks - if we're resting and refitting, we're not going to be killing or capturing many Soviets!




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 2:40:57 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Last area to focus is the state of the Panzerwaffe. Still a robust force, but showing signs of wear and tear - and the cost of success has been significan panzer losses.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 8:34:36 AM   
sillyflower


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Status: offline 		I think pz losses of 150 per turn are nothing to worry about, especially ar you are using them properly to manoeuvre not as a sledgehammer.

not sure why you have got some in infantry armies - seems a bit of a wasteful loss of focus, and APs. A single Pz corps can't exploit that effectively

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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/23/2012 5:27:55 PM   
Schmart

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sillyflower
not sure why you have got some in infantry armies - seems a bit of a wasteful loss of focus, and APs. A single Pz corps can't exploit that effectively


I do the same thing actually, attaching a PzKorps to 6th Army. There's typically a 'panzer gap' in the central sector with 4th and 6th Armies, so a PzKorps there can give that part of the front some extra manoeuvre and exploitation capability. When 40th PzKorps arrives in Sep 41, it gives the option to 'panzer-ize' 6th Army, sending some of 6th Army's extra infantry to infantry weak armies, typically 1st and/or 4th Panzer.

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Post #: 39
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/24/2012 2:05:57 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Status: offline 		Sillyflower - Schmart beat me to it - what he said!


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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/24/2012 2:11:09 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Turn 9; Aug 14, 1941........Mud in the Central Soviet Zone.

Bound to happen, finally got more mud. Of course, hitting the Central Soviet Zone now means pretty much across the entire Eastern Front. The light green in the screen shot - all of AGN, most of AGC and AGS and or course, all the railheads. Not good. The one area really not affected - the furthest east positions of AGC, are those in need of rest and fuel and can do little.

For the turn, most units sit still. Soviet units encircled, remain encircled. Soviet units not encircled, but close - in 3rd Pz Grp area - remain in supply. Other than pushing infantry forward where the Soviets have pulled back (which looks to be the western Dnepr), little happens.

Soviets get a week to recoup, just going to be tougher next turn....and the turn after that.....




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/25/2012 3:02:43 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Turn 10; Aug 21, 1941.............Clear

Clear weather returns, and so does the offensive!

AGN eliminates the three isolated Soviet Rifle Divisions, and resumes the bludgeoning toward Leningrad.

18th Army is finally up enough to employ its infantry inthe attack - opening up a small gap for XXXXI PzKps to attack within 10 miles of Mga. Leningrad's industry, less its HI, Veh and BA-20 Factory have long since moved.
With the railhead closing up, LVI PzKps rests and receives an HQ Buildup. Other infantry pushes eastward 10 miles, prepping the battlefield for commitment of LVI PzKps.

Lastly the fresh VI Korps with 3 divisions is also coming up to bolster the attack.

Of all the areas of the front, the Soviets are putting up the best defense in the Leningrad area. The Soviets have delayed well, pulling back exposed units to prevent major encirclements. With some luck, I'm through his outer defenses and he's not prepared a robust inner defense line.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/25/2012 3:23:20 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		AGC's 3rd Pz Grp destroys the Soviet Tank Div in Veliki Luki and brings up it infantry. However, its greatest success is finally trapping the 10 or so divisions in the pocket west of Rzhev. It took about 3 weeks, including dealing with mud, but this time, the two PzKps link up and should be able to hold the ring. Now that the pocket is formed, the Pz Grp can focus on resuming the drive east - the only downside, the panzers haven't been resting or refitting, but working to encircle. Last act for the XXXIX PzKps in the turn is to conduct an HQ Buildup.


9th Army infantry is now up in force, but needs to concentrate to assist the panzers eastward. Its currently supporting both the 3rd Pz Grp and the 2nd Pz Grp - it really needs to focus on one or the other.

2nd Pz Grp also remains too dispersed. Its XXIV PzKps continues to probe north of Vyzama while its XXXXVII PzKps rests - but can't conduct an HQ Buildup yet - east of Yelna. The "Vyazma Bulge" is a tempting target, hopefully the Soviets will attempt to hold it!

4th Army destroys the isolated 3xRifle Divs south of Yelna, and continues to advance toward Bryansk against moderate to light opposition - weak infantry and cavalry. Enough to delay, but not stop the German advance, which ends adjacent to Bryansk - which still has its HI and Arm in the city.

South of 4th Army, the realatively weak 2nd Army advances through vacated terrain towards a linkup with 6th Army.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/25/2012 4:14:15 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		AGS prepares to exploit off the Dnepr River and towards Kharkov.

6th Army finds the Soviets have put the mud delay to good use by pulling back off the Dnepr near Kiev. 6th Army infantry advances to contact, both north and east, cutting off 2xRifle Divs which stuck to the Dnepr one turn too long. Its XXXXVI PzKps conducts an HQ Buildup and prepares for future operations.

17th Army is finally up at the Dnepr in strength, part of the infantry going to support the 6th Army bridgehead, the rest supporting the 1st Pz Grp bridgehead.

1st Pz Grp uses its infantry to expand its small bridgehead, and then sends its XXXXVIII PzKps across to reinforce the XIV PzKps. The XXXXVIII PzKps conducts an HQ Buildup, the XIV PzKps rested, should be ready without the buildup to attack.

Now if only the Soviets will stay in position to be vulnerable to a pincer between 6th Army and 1st Pz Grp.....doubtful. They will likely to continue to withdraw.

South of the screen shot, 11th Army gains a small penetration across the lower Dnepr, and relieves 1st Pz Grp near the Dnepr Bend.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/27/2012 12:42:19 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Turn 11; Aug 28, 1941.......Clear

All three Army Groups conduct major offensive operations; all limited more by fatigue than anything else. While a number of PzKps received an HQ Buildup, giving them enough fuel, they are still pushing fatigue levels in the neighborhood of 40+. Enough to move well enough, but not enough to dislogde key defenders in hasty attacks, limiting effectiveness.

Still, a good, solid turn nonetheless....

AGN strikes to isolate Leningrad from the mainland. The freshly fueled and fairly rested LVI PzKps provides the exploit after infantry opens up a corridor north of Novgorod. Attacking along the Volkov River, the LVI PzKps clears the retreating Soviet formations out of the way - one stubborn Cav/Rifle Div combination gets a hold result, forcing a deliberate attack to clear the way. This single hold trips up the timetable enough to where while being able to reach the supporting attack of XXXXI PzKps, the ring is very porus and the Soviets will re-establish supply lines.

Still, Leningrad is cut off, and will stay that way. The 5 units isolated, will be re-isolated and the panzers are in no danger of being cut off and being beyond the reach of infantry, which is finally up in strength and is fairly fresh.

I'm confident Leningrad can and will fall before the first snows - I'm less confident of getting 4th Pz Grp rested/refitted and striking toward Moscow while the weather remains dry.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/27/2012 12:54:13 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		In AGC's area, I was faced with a bit of a dilemma. I really wanted AGC to rest for a week - they badly need it - before striking eastward in a deliberate attack. This would give the panzers a chance to rest and rearm, bring infantry up and eliminate isolated Soviets before continuing the attack.

However, the Soviets decided to pull back out of the Vyazma Salient, and seemed to be strengthing defenses a bit - so the trade off - wait and hit a better prepared force with a heavier hammer, or maintain the initiative by striking the still organizing defenses before they are ready with a fatigued force.

I went with door #2......and for the most part, it went well.

9th Army infantry cleaned up the Nelidovo Pocket, yeilding 8x Divisions. This prevented 3x Ger IN Divs from supporting the attack however.

3rd Pz Grp opens up the defensive line with infantry, and then the LVII PzKps. This allows XXXIX PzKps - freshly fueled, but still very fatigued, to exploit through, the objective to de-stable the line being established near Rzhev and establish a bridgehead across the Volga for future operations. In this, they were successful.

2nd Pz Grp simply nips off the Vyazma Salient - the shorter solution (vs the long reach solution with XXXXVII PzKps striking toward Kaluga, then turning north). Just don't have the strength for that kind of distant encirclement at this time. Trapping the 7xDivs in the Vyazma Pocket is more than enough success right now.

4th Army to the south of 2nd Pz Grp takes Bryansk (with the industry) meeting moderate to heavy resistance. It will continue to bull its way east...




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/27/2012 1:45:41 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Despite the Soviets best efforts to withdraw before an offensive can be launched, AGS manages to hit the Soviets hard, breaking through the lines south of Poltava.

6th Army, with its fresh XXXXVI PzKps, was supposed to be one side of the pincer, but the Soviets managed to withdraw some 60 miles to the Psel River line, leaving a small screen to their front. This effectively negated the ability of 6th Army infantry to attack the their new line before the panzers exploited through. Instead, infantry barely managed to establish contact with the new Soviet line, giving the Pzkps at least some idea that a line had in fact been re-established on the Psel River. XXXXVI PzKps now attacked the screening forces out of the way, and attempted to force a hasty crossing of the Psel with its two lead divisions. Three holds later, they were still on the west bank of the Psel! Calling up the 16th Pz to brush aside the now weakened 271st Rifle Division, the 16th Pz - fairly fresh and with over 120 panzers - also failed in their hasty attack! Only a deliberate attack by 16th Pz pushed the rifle division aside - but this left the 16th Pz without any abilty to cross. It would be up to 1st Pz Grp to salvage the situation!

Assisted by 17th Army's IV IN Korps, 1st Pz Grp's infantry expanded their bridgehead first - using deliberate attacks to gain the first 10 miles of Soviet dug in defenses. Then III PzKps opened up the gap, widening the penetration for the following Pzkps. XXXXVIII PzKps wheeled SE, a turning movment on a large concentration of Soviet forces along the Dniepr, and pushing recon/mot elements eastward finding no subsequent Soviet positions. One Pocket established! XIV PzKps, the only of the three benefitted by an HQ Buildup, exploits last, and heads first toward Kharkov, scattering cavalry remnants and airfields. Then, its best unit, SS Wiking, swings around Poltava advancing some 120 miles to eventually link up with the stalled 6th Army, still on the Psel River. 2nd Pocket established!

Both of these pocket, definately the Poltava Pocket at least, the Soviets will be able to re-establish contact. However, this attack looks to have broken the Soviet's back here along the Dneipr. The Soviets knew this was coming and read it right - and tried to delay/withdraw, pivotiing on the Dnepr Bend. However, 1st Pz Grp was able to concentrate and cut them off before the withdraw toward Kharkov could be effectively completed. I don't think not much of anything is between the Germans and Kharkov right now (industry looks to have been withdrawn however). Re-establishing the pocket will take a week, so this isn't quite over yet, but with some luck, AGS will have Kharkov in the bag with a few weeks of good campaigning weather remaining - to seize the Stalino area and to begin driving north toward Kursk-Orel-Tula and linking up with 4th Army. Still some good summer campaigning left if the cards play right - and mud stays away!




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/27/2012 1:53:29 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Status: offline 		Last screen shot shows 11th Army and its Rumanian Support exploiting from their Dnepr Bridgehead. Yes, exploiting! With infantry breaking open a gap, the 60th Mot, Rum Armored, and Slovak Mot Bde exploit towards the Crimea to cut off the withdrawing Soviets - which should bag four divisions. With a choice of the Crimea or towards the east or north, I chose the Crimea. With minimal mobile capability, 11th Army is limited in what it can do - so I took the sure thing in the south vs attempting to pocket his line still on the Dnepr.

The Soviets will surely abandon the Dnepr and fall back to the Melitopol Line now. 11th Army and one Rum Army will pursue, but we'll explore the possibilty of breaking open the Crimea as well - Looks like he's got alot of forces in the Crimea, and with the crisis now in front of Kharkov, he just might have to weaken his isthmus defenses a bit. A quick push into the Crimea could possible yeild a quick booty - of trapped forces before being able to withdraw into Sevastopol. And I'm not really inclined to push hard on a line established near Melitopol - let him stand there and we'll await 1st Pz Grp coming down from the north, trapping his forces against the Sea of Azov.

11th Army is merely a holding action outside of the Crimea.....




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 4:03:23 AM   
IdahoNYer


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From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Turn 12; Sep 4, 1941.........Clear

For the most part, this was a consolidation turn across the front - re-closing pockets and preparing for future operations.

In AGN's area, 18th Army re-closes the small Lyuban Pocket and prepares to assault Leningrad by "the back door" with I Korps.

4th Pz Grp pulls its panzers off the line for badly needed rest and refit. Its VI IN Korp attacks across the Volkov River, and isolates 2xRifle Divs in and around Novgorod. This attack also establishes a bridgehead across the Volkov, setting conditions for future operations to attack SE toward Kalinin.

16th Army remains overstretched, maintaining contact with AGC. Its II IN Korps remains concentrated near Novgorod, but the remainder of the army struggles just to maintain a solid front as AGC's 3rd Pz Grp advances eastward.

Overall, I'm confident of Leningrad's fall by the end of the month. With some luck, I won't have to commit panzers in that task, and can begin 4th Pz Grp, supported by 16th Army, to attack behind the Valdai Hills toward Kalinin. This might pocket Soviet defenders in and around the Valdai Hills, but more important, will take pressure off the northern flank of 3rd Pz Grp.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 4:40:31 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Status: offline 		AGC consolidates and attempts to maintain contact with withdrawing Soviet forces.

3rd Pz Grp conducts a recon in force towad Kalinin and Torzhok, and then pulls its panzers in to rest and refit. This does however create a salient jutting towards Kalinin, which its V IN Korps is struggling to maintain the northern flank - and stay in contact with 16th Army. While not dangerous, this does effectively remove this infantry Korps from supporting attacks toward Moscow.

9th Army isolates Rzhev and along with 2nd Pz Grp infantry, takes Vyazma and destroys the 7x Soviet Divs in the Vyazma Pocket.

2nd Pz Grp pulls most of the panzers off the line and prepares for future operations.

4th Army continues to bull its way toward Tula - slowly....

Overall, AGC needs to rest for a week or two. Soviet defenses are stiffening, but do not seem to be anything more than moderate at the moment. Moscow, 80 miles from the positions of 9th Army. The question I'm struggling with is how best to attack the capital - Swinging 2nd Pz Grp south toward Tula and coming up from the south, or a more direct approach passing just north of Kaluga? In any case, 3rd Pz Grp will attack from the NW, along an axis of Kalinin-Klin. I'll probably keep 2nd Pz Grp on a short lease, as a deep envelopment requires alot of mobility and good combat power - both of which are in relatively short supply at the moment.

Still.....Moscow IS in reach. The real question is whether or not it has a substantial inner fortification line established...




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 5:17:41 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Status: offline 		AGS focuses on re-establishing the Poltava and Dnepr Pockets which the Soviets managed to establish corridors to.

Two of 6th Army's infantry Korps continue to advance unapposed towards Kursk - at some point the Soviets have established a line as just to the north, AGC's 2nd Army is engaged along the Desna River. The remainder of 6th Army fights across the Psel River to establish contact again with 1st Pz Grp, again isolating the Poltava Pocket. With fresh infantry coming up, and XXXXVI PzKps still with reasonable combat power, the Soviets relief force is now in danger of encirclement.

1st Pz Grp's three Pzkps, all now low on fuel and fatigued, link up with 6th Army, re-establish the Denpr Pocket, and push back what appears to be a cavalry screen in front of Kharkov, closing to within 30 miles of the city.

17th Army takes the isolated city of Cherkassy and supports both 6th Army and 1st Pz Grp with an infantry korps.

11th Army, primarily below the screen shot, eliminates 4xDivisions cut off outside the Crimea, and prepares to force the isthmus. Soviets duly withdraw to the Melitopol line.

Was surprised the Soviets managed to link up with BOTH pockets - I expected one to get a corridor, but not both. So, 1st Pz Grp was hard pressed to accomplish its tasks - and is pretty played out right now. However, with loss of two good sized pockets worth of troops, I want to continue the momentum towards Kharkov - Cavalry out front probably means he's trying to re-establish a line - and I want to break it before it hardens.






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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 5:25:19 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Status: offline 		Since its the beginning of Sep, time to look at the stats.

Compared to July and the opening moves, August ranks a distant third - but its still a good haul. Getting over 100 Rifle Divisions and basically gutting his mechanized forces is a great start at defeating his blizzard offensive - this is where the Germans can defeat a blizzard offensive - preventing a massive one.

And with some luck, the Soviets won't be able to rescue the current pockets, adding 20+ divisions to list next week. Then there is Leningrad - I estimate 15 or so divisions cut off in the city and surrounding areas. It will take a few weeks, but they can also be written off.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 5:29:08 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Status: offline 		Losses for the Soviets, but not the Germans, are also less in August than in Jul. German losses are certainly not light, with manpower rapidly approaching 300K and panzers 2K. 500K Soviets, with over 300K in the captured catagory mean that these encircled divisions are going into captivity in good strength - not shells.




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RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 5:44:59 AM   
IdahoNYer


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Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Forces available show something very interesting. For the first time, overall German strength dropped - not a good sign. But what is a VERY good sign is that although Soviet losses dropped, the overall Soviet manpower only increased 16K - which tells the German High Command that if we continue to encircle and destroy units at this rate, COMBINED with seizing manpower centers, the Soviets will be hard pressed to expand the force significantly enough to conduct a viable blizzard offensive.

Also of note, the Soviet tank force has been gutted - and although the German panzers are being worn down, the Germans have for the first time, more tanks on the front than the Soviets!




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(in reply to IdahoNYer)
Post #: 54
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 5:48:30 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Last screen shot shows the state of the panzerwaffe. Tanks strength is becoming acute in some divisions (looks much more realistic with the recent patches than prior to 1.05), and fatigue overall is becoming problematic. Combined, both of these will require a significant pause in operations.




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(in reply to IdahoNYer)
Post #: 55
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 10:19:01 AM   
janh

 

Posts: 1216
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline 		Once again you are doing very well here. And, just the same, reading your AAR is fun. I really like this detailed style showing your methodical approach and strategic or tactical thinking.

I hope for Scar that he still has some aces up his sleeves, though when I look at the maps and the losses, you are getting the better of him. His air force is also quite worn, as are his tanks. In the south he seems to struggle to create a line from chaos, and you may have chances for more small pockets and relatively unopposed advances towards Kursk, Rostov and Voroshilovgrad, if you're lucky. Supply lines might become the limiting factor after all.

In the north, if I had to bet, I would place it on the fall of Leningrad in 4 turns, and Moscow in 6 or 7 the latest. Panzergruppe 3 might be crucial, yet a lot may depend on the approach route you decide to use it on. The terrain around the Volga Reservoir is ugly for Panzers, but still PG III might serve as a heavy anvil there.

Are your rail lines in favor of operating on the crimea already?

BTW, that lone infantry regiment of 18th Armee just south of the two Russians stacks at LG is really a prey for them there to rack up morale... Dangerous...

< Message edited by janh -- 10/28/2012 10:28:19 AM >

(in reply to IdahoNYer)
Post #: 56
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/28/2012 8:31:42 PM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Thanks Janh, glad you are enjoying it! AARs help keep me focused, plus I'm all ears for the added tip - like that lone regiment you mentioned (I should know better too). Too many holds as is, no need to give him any free ones. Question - if a Soviet unit is destroyed/surrendered - when reconstituted, does it take its win loss record with it, or start from scratch? I'm betting the former....

No rails to support the Crimea - nearest one is at Krivoi Rog area - focus is toward Stalino. I'm not counting on taking the Crimea - probably more of a raid to destroy some troops - if I can isolate before he falls back into Sevastopol. And provide some ground to fall back, rather than starting the blizzard at the isthmus.

(in reply to janh)
Post #: 57
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/29/2012 9:57:43 AM   
sillyflower


Posts: 3509
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Back in Blighty
Status: offline 		certainly an impressive recovery after a poor start. I think your airforce needs to prioritise dropping fuel if it isn't already

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(in reply to IdahoNYer)
Post #: 58
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/30/2012 5:31:22 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		Turn 13; Sep 11, 1941........Clear

Solid offensive actions across the front despite much depleted forces and heavy fatigue - but we sense the enemy is breaking - just one more push and the house of cards will come crashing down!!!

AGN seals the fate of Leningrad with 18th Army's I Korps successfully attacking across the Neva River, and XXXXI PzKps' 6th Pz Div exploiting to take Osinovets against a freshly arrived rifle division. I was hoping not to have to commit the panzers, but the opportunity was there - this will delay XXXXI PzKps from attacking with LVI PzKps toward Kalinin, but knocking out the supplly to Leningrad in a single blow could not be missed.

AGN infantry also mopped up isolated units in Novgorod and the 4 division Lyuban Pocket.

With Leningrad now firmly isolated, and without any airbases (two were "bounced" in Osinovets), 18th Army will now focus on reducing the remaining defenses and holding the line on the Volkov to the east. This also now allows 4th Pz Grp, with 16th Army in support, to begin its offensive toward Kalinin. This attack will clear the Valdai Hills from the rear, and remove the pressure on 3rd Pz Grp from the north.




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< Message edited by IdahoNYer -- 10/30/2012 5:36:03 AM >

(in reply to sillyflower)
Post #: 59
RE: Drang Nach Osten - Revisited - 10/30/2012 5:51:35 AM   
IdahoNYer


Posts: 2616
Joined: 9/6/2009
From: NYer living in Boise, ID
Status: offline 		AGC centers prepares for the next, and hopefully final, offensive. With railheads finally getting close to the front, preparations to attack go into high gear. Panzers and most infantry rest, but combat strength in panzers is still low. However, the Soviets don't seem strong enough to hold off a major assault by two panzer gruppes.

Plan is fairly straightforward. Assisted by 9th Army infantry, both 2nd and 3rd Pz Grps each strike out in a pincer aimed at Moscow. Dependant on defenses, the pincers may close east of the city - the preferred method, or just on the eastern side, encircling the defenders just to the east of the city. The problem is a lack of infantry to hold the shoulders of these pincers - neither AGN or AGS PzKps are close enough to provide immediate support -- however waiting the two or so estimated weeks for them to arrive in close support position is just too long - the Soviets will have established solid lines by then. We can't wait - we must launch quickly while the Soviet defenses are still weak.

4th Army will also play a role in this attack, driving toward Tula and will gain the fresh XXXX PzKps to accomplish this task. This will serve three purposes - one, protect the right flank of 2nd Pz Grp; second, deny the Soviets of a major industrial base; and third, set the conditions for a large encirclement to the south of Tula - linking up with AGS panzers driving up from Kursk-Orel axis.

Ambitious plan, but we have to try and seize the capital before mud stalls all movement!




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< Message edited by IdahoNYer -- 10/30/2012 5:52:05 AM >

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