RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/20/2016 9:09:06 PM

Canoerebel

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I think so. This strategy depends on the opponent. John is prone to shoving all of his assets forward when responding to emergencies (as at Sumatra and NoPac), leaving other areas open, and then having to repeat the process repeatedly as the next emergency arises. I think that's what I'm seeing now.

Other IJ players wouldn't be given to this kind of play, so it wouldn't work against them.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/20/2016 9:37:04 PM

DRF99

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I see you still have some units in the wilderness of Borneo. Do they have any AV left? If John forgets to garrison a base you may be able to walk into one on the cheap.

Great game, great read, glad you restarted it.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/20/2016 10:45:18 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

Canoerebel: I don't think his temerity, if that's what it is, will last much longer.

Methinks your were intending to say "timidity" . "Temerity" is a brash, daring action. Thus the use of the French version of it in the ship name "Temeraire" (there was a British ship by this name too).

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No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 12:04:19 AM

Canoerebel

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You're right, I did mean to use "timidity." Yet another reminder of why I'm glad I don't rely on word skills to make a living.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 12:07:01 AM

Canoerebel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DRF99

I see you still have some units in the wilderness of Borneo. Do they have any AV left? If John forgets to garrison a base you may be able to walk into one on the cheap.

Great game, great read, glad you restarted it.

None of them have any power left, but they are useful in providing info as to the number of units in adjacent hexes. :)

A number of months back, I did have a cut-off Dutch unit in southeastern Borneo. It had a bit of combat power. So it moved to vacant Bandjermasin and took it. Thereafter, Allied subs used fuel captured at the base to replenish. John finally took it back after a couple of weeks. It wasn't a major operation, but it was fun while it lasted.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 12:11:38 AM

Canoerebel

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The current strategic map shows that Big Tent is like a massive tumor in the vitals. It also shows the long line of subs moving to and from Midway from the DEI.

Allied subs are beginning to use bases closer to the DEI, and several AS are moving into position to "migrate" to the DEI when the LOC is open and "safe" for transit. Fuel may be a limiting factor, though. So Midway will continue to serve as an important sub base for a long time to come.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 3:05:38 AM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

You're right, I did mean to use "timidity." Yet another reminder of why I'm glad I don't rely on word skills to make a living.

You just have too many in your noggin, that's all. I think whiskey might cure that particular problem.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 3:08:04 AM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

The current strategic map shows that Big Tent is like a massive tumor in the vitals. It also shows the long line of subs moving to and from Midway from the DEI.

Allied subs are beginning to use bases closer to the DEI, and several AS are moving into position to "migrate" to the DEI when the LOC is open and "safe" for transit. Fuel may be a limiting factor, though. So Midway will continue to serve as an important sub base for a long time to come.

Interesting that you put the yellow box in the upper right. I've always done the lower left.

Couldn't you move your subs to the Marshalls sometime soon? They're a hair closer than Midway... Or, with Big Tent doing its thing, Hollandia may be an option soon? Given how much he seems to be pulling out of SOPAC/SWPAC... maybe even Rabaul, which you may want to take anyway for the VPs (it would drop his denominator by several hundred)? I know you're "beyond" that point now on the map, but they're still useful places so that your subs don't get bombed at the pier.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 4:02:42 AM

Mike Dubost

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If you are still thinking about future moves, let me ask if you have considered Rangoon and vicinity. If you recall, way back when, I had suggested that as a destination for "peanut", when the destination was still open for speculation.
The reasons still have some validity, I think. Admittedly, I only know what I see here, so maybe I'm missing something. However, the bonuses for success could be significant. You could trap part of the IJA in Burma, and reopen the Burma Road to reinvigorate China. You could threaten a "pincher attack" on the oil fields in the SRA.
On the other hand, we know John III still has the bases he built up for the successful effort to evict you from the DEI before. You would have to be strong enough to withstand the counterattack with the entrapped LCUs and air power brought in.
On the gripping hand, if you want to sink some of his navy, you have to bring it to battle, and invading an area where he is potentially strong, with a big prize for a victory if you win would likely do it.

EDIT: "on the gripping hand" is a reference to a science fiction novel of that name that involves aliens with 2 hands designed for fine manipulation and one real strong one for grasping items. Kind of an in-joke.

< Message edited by Mike Dubost -- 10/21/2016 4:05:39 AM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 4:27:57 AM

Lokasenna

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A move on Cocos Island could be interesting

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 4:37:16 AM

Capt. Harlock

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quote:

I don't think his temerity, if that's what it is, will last much longer.

Actually, "temerity" means something like rashness or gall. I think that's the opposite of what's going on at the moment. Possibly you were thinking of "timorous"?

< Message edited by Capt. Harlock -- 10/21/2016 4:39:23 AM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 1:34:12 PM

Canoerebel

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All the places you guys are mentioning, and many others too, have merit as targets. Any Allied player could take the current situation and develop a whole new focuses of attack that would work (or at least have the promise of success). But because of my current force dispositions, it would take months to prepare to move en masse on major targets (like Burma) far away.

In in early '43, I began shifting everything that floats to the Pacific - everything. That's continuing - LSTs, DDs, CVE - everything immediately gets transferred from IO to the Pacific. For instance, HMS Battler CVE just arrived at Pearl Harbor from Aden via the Canal. That's the kind of force needed for Big Tent (and its eventual successors), both to carry the immense amount of supply and fuel needed and to beef up a fleet depleted by all the losses taken to date (both sides have lost a heckuva lot of shipping).

I am confident that Focus Pacific is a sound strategy, under the circumstances in this game, as long as I retain carrier superiority and as long as I'm able to pull off Big Tent like operations that create new fronts - not "second" fronts but rather Fronts 360.

There may come a time when places like Cocos, Port Blair, Rabaul, etc. are helpful, and I have enough assets to move on them without subtracting from the main forces, but that'll be awhile.

P.S. India and Burma are strongly defended by a very stout air force and decent armies. There will come a day when these will be used offensively.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 10/21/2016 1:35:59 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 1:58:49 PM

BBfanboy

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Then I think you will already be considering the Marcus - Daito Shoto - Okinawa axis.
It would require a considerable dent in IJN assets to pull it off, but once there he is euchred!

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 2:22:46 PM

Canoerebel

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Yes, that's a prime target. At this point, everything from Hokkaido to Java is under consideration. Final target selection will probably take place after Third Ring, when I have a good feel for the number of available transports, combat ships and carriers...and when I have months of SigInt revealing where John has repositioned his troops.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 8:50:25 PM

Canoerebel

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12/4/43

A very good (not sexy, but good) day for the Allies. Lots of logistics progress.

Big Tent: John doesn't know it, but the campaign is going to change markedly in two days if he doesn't do something in the meantime to stop these supply efforts to Manokwari and Morotai. In two more days, those important little ops will be complete, both bases will be as secure and self-sufficient as I can make then, and I can then send Death Star elsewhere without worrying about their vulnerability short- and medium term.

Manokwari: See map for details regarding supply and reinforcement delivery here. One more day and it's set for a long, long time.

Morotai: The effort to re-supply Morotai begins tomorrow. I don't think John will take a chance of encountering Death Star, so I don't expect opposition. But I've taken steps I hope are sufficient "just in case."

Sorong: With 130k supply, 41st Infantry Div. 90% prepped, and a huge number of engineers working on airfield (currently size 4) port and forts, this base is pretty secure.

Boela: With 90k supply, 40th Infantry Div. 63% prepared, and almost as many engineers as Sorong, this base is secure.

Once the carriers finish serving as security for the resupply efforts to Morotai and Manikwari, I'll resume offensive operations. Amphibious activities in the Dobo/Saumlauki area comes first; from there, I'll either move to complete the Ambon operation or go ahead and retire to northern Oz to pick up the next wave of troop (something I can do once all the major Big Tent bases have the supply necessary to ensure security into the medium term).

John is doing a lot of work to shore up his next line of defense. He's doing sensible things from his perspective.

Eventually he will recover his equilibrium enough, and marshal his forces sufficiently, to counter attack. This could be very soon now.

But he's been unusually cautious the past ten days. This, too, makes sense, because he can't afford to suffer attrition to his combat fleet except when absolutely necessary or when a success seems highly likely. I think we're seeing an early dividend to the focus on attritioning his navy. Ordinarily, he'd have had enough combat ships to commit lots of DDs and some CLs to raiding from the Java Sea while his main fleet was concentrated somewhere in the Babeldaob area. But the Java Sea and Banda Sea have been totally quiet. I don't dare leave ships without protection, thus far there has been a freedom to move about to an extent that is unusual, especially against an aggressive player like John.

Early on, he told me this would be "Sumatra '43." That was mainly bluster meant to intimidate (mind games), but it rang utterly hollow. And that's proven to be the case.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 9:32:35 PM

Canoerebel

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Transports with 385k of supply are still waiting to be unloaded at Boela. Of that amount, probably 50k-100k will go to Boela. Smaller amounts (10k or so) will go to key secondary bases like Babo, Dobo, Lobaloto, and Sansaport. Biak should get 25k or so.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 10:03:54 PM

BBfanboy

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I take it that you are still using LCT barges to move supply to smaller bases?

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/21/2016 11:50:30 PM

Canoerebel

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I'm using LCI, LST and barges in the distribution effort, but the big bases have been getting lots of big ships.

Most of the 385K is aboard xAK disbanded in my big ports, waiting for the bases to grow enough to hold bigger quantities of supply. Obviously, protecting those ships and the ports they are in is a high priority. But I've made big progress in getting supply distributed the past few days. Lots to go, though.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 1:36:07 AM

Crackaces

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I think the DEI situation is dramatically changed with the DBB base scenarios. Although I understand Canoerebel Festung Palembang was at the root of the production of supply from refining .. the whole supply situation in the DEI is changed,. In my opinion much more complicated for the IJ.
Personally I would not think of a DEI attack route as the Allies in a stock scenario .. but 3 recent blogs have shown me a subtle consequence of not devoting IJ shipping to bring supplies to the DEI in DBB rooted games.

What Canoerebel is doing in terms of supply is what the IJ needed to be doing rather than running around getting their capital ships a good inside washout ..

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 2:51:05 AM

Canoerebel

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John is chomping at the bit to get to this turn when he gets off from work. And he's been much more engaged the past few days. So I think something's up.

I'm scouring the map looking for signs of danger. Nothing is readily apparent, though KB can spring in from quite a distance.

My best guess is that he thinks Death Star is heading east along New Guinea's northern coast, into waters where he might think he has a crack at doing something.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 2:58:06 AM

bradfordkay

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What do you estimate that he can bring up in the way of number of fleet carriers? How does that compare to what you have in the Death Star?

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 3:11:12 AM

Canoerebel

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Death Star has 1,260 aircraft. I don't think KB can have that many - probably somewhere around 70% to 80% - but John will try to augment with LBA if possible. That's just a guess, as he has had time for some carriers to repair after the great Naval Battle of Wake Island in September, but less Junyo, which ate two torpedoes a week ago.

I think he's a bit tentative after KB lost lots of strike aircraft two weeks back. But I still try to keep him guessing by taking unexpected turns, like tomorrow. I'm not looking for a carrier battle right now - protection for supply distribution is a higher priority - but I'm not afraid of one either.

Allied carriers are fully replenished and flush with aircraft. The Hellcat and Corsair squadrons have high-experience pilots. Things can go wrong - weird weather, the 8-hex issue, bad luck - but I'm pretty willing to go to war with these fellas.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 10/22/2016 3:37:47 AM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 2:35:18 PM

Canoerebel

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12/5/43

Big Tent: Another day devoted to logistics - mainly supply distribution to the key forward bases (see map). Tomorrow (or, at latest, the day after), Death Star will be detached from this duty. At that point, all the highest value ships (APA, AKA, AK) will have completed their parts in this mission. I'll still be delivery supply by xAK (and a few troops by xAP), but those ships will be left mostly unprotected, relying on John's uncertainty. He'll probably strike at them eventually, sinking a handful. But time is more critical than mostly empty xAKs at this point.

Allied ASW sank a IJ sub at Morotai (confirmed sinking sounds). This port is fully mined now.

I'm anxious to wrap up supply delivery so that Death Star and troops can resume offensive missions to secure the LOC to Oz. That's the next op.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 6:44:27 PM

Flicker

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Consistent with your ploy of consuming IJN fuel, targets like New Guineau / Rabaul / New Caledonia / Saipan / Alaska or others are 'far away with no fuel supply generating' areas. Would John sortie KB for those areas?

Soerabaja, Balikpapan, and Tarakan should be major targets in a blood for oil strategy, and until taken, those bases provide refueling for the IJN. However there are other bases that provide refueling in that theater (which kind of shorten his LOC - Soerabaja, North Borneo, Singers). So, it seems you are limited in your running him around options to South Pacific, Central Pacific, and North Pacific. My guess is that your next operation could be named 'Rabbit Hole' - and it will be someplace where KB will be compelled to sortie (and suffer losses); someplace with limited LBA; and perhaps even someplace of questionable value except for getting KB to sortie.

That said, I hope you're preparing for Soerabaja / Balikpapan / Tarakan. Or Formosa.

< Message edited by Flicker -- 10/22/2016 6:46:23 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 7:07:16 PM

Canoerebel

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Everything from NoPac to Java is on the table. I already have preferences, but I haven't begun prepping troops yet. There's too much time before such an op could conceivably begin; too many elements of information yet to be gathered. The soonest that operation could begin is probably April '44. My short-term planning is definite; medium-term planning is underway; long-term planning is in the earliest stages:

I. Short Term
1. finish supply distribution and base building
2. take Dobo, Saumlauki, Damar and other unoccupied bases on my LOC
3. Pick up reinforcing troops (and certain amphibious troops) at Normanton
4. amphibious op to take Merauke (and possibly Horn Island during this phase)
5. complete conquest of Ambon
6. select combat ships and supply ships to remain in the DEI to "protect my turf"
7. the balance of the herd retires to Oz (possibly Horn Island is invaded during this phase; possibly PM also)

II. Medium Term
1. the herd replenishes at a friendly port
2. the herd begins the move to return to Pearl Harbor
3. possible amphibious ops en route to help start a new LOC - Luganville is likely; Milne Bay is possible; a dot hex or two for float planes
4. if KB shows up somewhere far, far away, amphibious ops to take Eniwetok and Taongi (dot hex nearby)
5. final selection of next big op should be taking place about the time the herd heads for Pearl as I don't want to tarry there too long - I'll need to create pressure as soon as possible in the interest of not letting John focus too long on the Big Tent area; also, troop preparation should be advancing
6. selection of ships and transports for next big op; do I need to leave any carriers behind to upgrade or to repair damage; how quickly can the herd turn around and head out again (I'm guessing less than a month); Pearl is serving as a rendezvous point for reinforcements inbound; currently there are six carriers and three BBs there; Intrepid will be on hand in a month; etc.
7. the next op will carry more supply, and much more fuel, than Big Tent; do I have enough in stock at Pearl to handle this? (at the moment, no, so I'm working on that)

III. Long Term
1. The next big op (yet to be named) gets underway
2. Certain targets will be invaded en route (just as Big Tent involved the invasion of Satawal as a PBY base and contemplated the invasion of Wolei); nav search in Indian country is necessary
3. The next big op arrives at targets
a. to what extent are those targets within range of LBA from Big Tent or Midway or China?
b. will B29s be available then? If so, am I within range of Japanese Home Island industry? If not, what are the primary targets?
4. the next big op will probably take into the autumn months; what comes after that; what is the end game?

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 7:13:05 PM

Canoerebel

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Do AEs replenish at sea commencing in 1944, or is it 1945?

That will be an important consideration for the next big op.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 8:05:41 PM

Flicker

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1 JAN 1945

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4095153&mpage=1&key=underway%2Creplenishment�

< Message edited by Flicker -- 10/22/2016 8:11:13 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 9:22:22 PM

bradfordkay

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Another question for you Dan: you have brought a lot of fighters into those forward bases. Did you bring the same amount of air support or are you running more a/c in each base than you have air support available? If the latter, how well has that been working out for you (do you have lots of a/c down waiting to be maintained)?

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fair winds,
Brad

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 9:35:14 PM

Canoerebel

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That's a balancing act, isn't it? I want as many fighters as possible, but drastically overloading bases isn't efficient. (I've been waging that war in the Marshalls for months, rather unsuccessfully.)

At the moment, I think I'm going to have an adequate amount of base force av support once the main airfields (especially Boela and Sorong) reach level five or six.

Sorong has 400 av support and 240 aircraft, so it's overloaded as a level four field (it'll go to level five in less than a week). Boela is a level three field at the moment with 150 av support and 213 aircraft. So it's overloaded too. Morotai and Manikwari have smaller base forces and far less aircraft - neither is currently over stacked.

Waiting at Normanton, Australia, are a lot of base forces; 714 av support, in fact; at least 500 of that is available to reinforce Big Tent, either to beef up existing bases or for new fields that I plan to acquire in the near future.

Right now, most of the aircraft in Big Tent are defensive - fighters, ASW, and patrols to yell, "Watch out! Here comes KB!" But I have enough dive bombers and Beauforts to do some damage if John gets careless.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 10/22/2016 11:28:43 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

All the places you guys are mentioning, and many others too, have merit as targets. Any Allied player could take the current situation and develop a whole new focuses of attack that would work (or at least have the promise of success). But because of my current force dispositions, it would take months to prepare to move en masse on major targets (like Burma) far away.

In in early '43, I began shifting everything that floats to the Pacific - everything. That's continuing - LSTs, DDs, CVE - everything immediately gets transferred from IO to the Pacific. For instance, HMS Battler CVE just arrived at Pearl Harbor from Aden via the Canal. That's the kind of force needed for Big Tent (and its eventual successors), both to carry the immense amount of supply and fuel needed and to beef up a fleet depleted by all the losses taken to date (both sides have lost a heckuva lot of shipping).

I am confident that Focus Pacific is a sound strategy, under the circumstances in this game, as long as I retain carrier superiority and as long as I'm able to pull off Big Tent like operations that create new fronts - not "second" fronts but rather Fronts 360.

There may come a time when places like Cocos, Port Blair, Rabaul, etc. are helpful, and I have enough assets to move on them without subtracting from the main forces, but that'll be awhile.

P.S. India and Burma are strongly defended by a very stout air force and decent armies. There will come a day when these will be used offensively.

Agree. With carrier superiority, why avoid the central Pacific when his only real option there is to use his fleet? Of course the PI is soooo close by. I bypassed the PI in my last campaign. Now, I think it would be fun to try it. Just to see what happens.

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