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Espion missions - 12/14/2012 5:31:33 PM

Blueberry

Posts: 87
Joined: 12/16/2011
From: Distant Worlds
Status: offline

Firstly, my sincerest apologies if this particular issue has been already 'touched'.

It would be greatly appreciated if the player had this certain option to send a spy on the very same mission that he/she/it just completed. Some sort of 'continue' or 'oy, do that again'.

I don't mind micromanagement at all but sometimes certain elements may easily become quite tiresome. Something to consider for DWS.

Post #: 1

RE: Espion missions - 12/14/2012 5:33:47 PM

Bingeling

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline

"Please continue until dead."

(in reply to Blueberry)

Post #: 2

RE: Espion missions - 12/14/2012 5:42:01 PM

Blueberry

Posts: 87
Joined: 12/16/2011
From: Distant Worlds
Status: offline

No man, no.....

Please do it again. Not continue till you're dead... You send him/her away for a year and once the spy is back you have the option to send once again without selecting all those options again.... You can hardly steal late game tech from guardians just by sending the poor bastard only once...can ya

(in reply to Bingeling)

Post #: 3

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 4:04:16 PM

Arcatus

Posts: 197
Joined: 1/2/2012
Status: offline

Been a few mentions of successful spies lately. Do I just get useless spies?

Step one: Send spy on one year mission. Low risk
Step two: Spy gets captured/killed/fails
Step three: Run out of spies....?
(Step four: Mod the game so your spies are "slightly" better)

So yes, a "Keep doing mission x" option would be highly appreciated. All your tech.. belongs to me.

But anyway, ignoring the modding/cheating step - before I did that I could not keep a sustainable spying force - I always ran out of spies.
Admittedly I jumped to step four after only ~3-4 full games, but I wanted to spy.

Did I just have bad rng? Can you actually keep a spy for more than 3-4 missions in an unmodded game?

(in reply to Blueberry)

Post #: 4

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 4:15:29 PM

adecoy95

Posts: 420
Joined: 3/26/2010
Status: offline

most of the spies i use seem to be pretty apt at finding their way out of a failed mission, but they usually don't become capable of this in the beginning, i wouldent send a new spy on any mission that was not almost completely guaranteed

(in reply to Arcatus)

Post #: 5

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 4:35:44 PM

Webbco

Posts: 682
Joined: 2/6/2010
Status: offline

Has anyone ever played as the Keterov? They specialise in espionage, but I can't imagine winning a game solely based on effective spies.

Come to mention it, I've never played a game where any of the auto-generated empires were Keterov...does the AI tend to avoid using these guys?

< Message edited by Webbco -- 12/17/2012 4:36:48 PM >

(in reply to adecoy95)

Post #: 6

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 5:12:09 PM

Darkspire

Posts: 1986
Joined: 6/12/2003
From: My Own Private Hell
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arcatus

Been a few mentions of successful spies lately. Do I just get useless spies?

Step one: Send spy on one year mission. Low risk
Step two: Spy gets captured/killed/fails
Step three: Run out of spies....?
(Step four: Mod the game so your spies are "slightly" better)

So yes, a "Keep doing mission x" option would be highly appreciated. All your tech.. belongs to me.

But anyway, ignoring the modding/cheating step - before I did that I could not keep a sustainable spying force - I always ran out of spies.
Admittedly I jumped to step four after only ~3-4 full games, but I wanted to spy.

Did I just have bad rng? Can you actually keep a spy for more than 3-4 missions in an unmodded game?

Spies are pretty useful for filling holes in the tech tree, the suggestion of having an option to auto re-assign would be a real time saver. Spies are only really any good when you train them (something like IG2's spy training would be cool), I find that for the first mission after first contact its good to 'obtain' the territory map and then just select sabotage, if you select the three months then select the target base / planet, leaving it selected on target, you can then use the mouse wheel to scroll through all the targets, find the highest % and send them off. Do this a few times and you can drop the 3 months down to a month, the target % chance should stay the same and you get them back quicker. After doing about 6-8 one month missions then there just about ready for a 'research grab' in a three month slot, if you cant do it with a 3 month slot then send them off to blow things up again, rinse and reapeat. Sending spies off for 'research grabs' untrained is a sure fire way to end up losing them.

Darkspire

_____________________________

Darkspires's File Repository

(in reply to Arcatus)

Post #: 7

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 5:24:27 PM

Arcatus

Posts: 197
Joined: 1/2/2012
Status: offline

Huh.

Definitely seems like I have been throwing my spies into deep water a bit too soon...

(in reply to Darkspire)

Post #: 8

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 7:15:24 PM

Ralzakark

Posts: 225
Joined: 4/24/2012
Status: offline

I don't have any trouble with my spies working effectively.

- I send them on easy missions to start off with, such as stealing a territory map, never anything less than high 80%s or above success rate. This means they often spy for a year but it gains them experience.
- I target small empires to start with. A large empire will have more spies of its own and so probably a greater number on counter espionage. Remember you cannot see the effect of counter espionage reflected in the chance of success.
- I avoid spying on races with good or numerous spies such as the Ketarov.
- I always play to their strengths, or use skills that have a chance of improving.

All this in vanilla games.

(in reply to Arcatus)

Post #: 9

RE: Espion missions - 12/17/2012 7:30:45 PM

Ralzakark

Posts: 225
Joined: 4/24/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Webbco

Has anyone ever played as the Keterov? They specialise in espionage, but I can't imagine winning a game solely based on effective spies.

Come to mention it, I've never played a game where any of the auto-generated empires were Keterov...does the AI tend to avoid using these guys?

I'm currently playing as the Ketarov. My most successful spy at 20 years into the game is below.

I see the Ketarovs quite often when not playing as them, so the AI does use them.

I use racial victory conditions when playing. The Ketarov are difficult to win with while playing an interesting game as they have to

a) Start the fewest wars (which can make them a bit dull)
b) Conduct the most successful intelligence missions. Quite ease, and I'm currently at 33.
b) Intercept the most intellignece missions. Very difficult, still at none despite having an agent or two with good counter intelligence skills on the job.

I suspect there have been few missions against me, and if you bothered about the victory conditions then you may not be able to win simply because no-one has tried spying on you.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Ralzakark -- 12/17/2012 7:31:43 PM >

(in reply to Webbco)

Post #: 10

RE: Espion missions - 12/19/2012 10:36:44 PM

Blueberry

Posts: 87
Joined: 12/16/2011
From: Distant Worlds
Status: offline

To be honest, I've never experienced too much trouble with my spies stealing techs of other empires. When I do play keratov and humans, their respective racial abilities make it relatively easy for the spies to operate quite successfully.

Sometimes a player gets lucky with a new spy that requires no special training and is ready for a 3-month tech missions. Play on hardest settings not that it matters. At this point, the game is just too easy. Looking forward to DWS.

(in reply to Ralzakark)

Post #: 11

RE: Espion missions - 12/28/2012 4:37:53 PM

tjhkkr

Posts: 2428
Joined: 6/3/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Blueberry

No man, no.....
Please do it again. Not continue till you're dead... You send him/her away for a year and once the spy is back you have the option to send once again without selecting all those options again.... You can hardly steal late game tech from guardians just by sending the poor bastard only once...can ya

I equipped the Guardians with strong counter-espionage characters... so sending them to steal from the Guardians is a quick way to get a man killed.
In fact, most of my groups have a good counter-espionage characters.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Webbco
Has anyone ever played as the Keterov? They specialise in espionage, but I can't imagine winning a game solely based on effective spies.
Come to mention it, I've never played a game where any of the auto-generated empires were Keterov...does the AI tend to avoid using these guys?

I made an Israeli like race from my Star Wars universe, and equipped with a reasonably powerful military, it does quite well.
I also play a race called the Bothans from the Star Wars Universe. Their military is not strong, and they usually are absorbed.
I suspect such Intelligence style folks will work VERY well with some of the things being proposed in Shadows...

_____________________________

Remember that the evil which is now in the world will become yet more powerful, and that it is not evil which conquers evil, but only love -- Olga Romanov.

(in reply to Blueberry)

Post #: 12