"Duelists" from the soviet side

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Command: Modern Operations series >> After Action Report >> "Duelists" from the soviet side

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"Duelists" from the soviet side - 11/29/2013 3:50:55 PM

JCR

Posts: 160
Joined: 11/4/2013
Status: offline

SIDE: Royal Navy
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x Nimrod MR.2P
10x Lynx HAS.3
1x F 169 Amazon [Type 21, Exocet]
1x F 88 Broadsword [Type 22 Batch 1]
1x F 92 Boxer [Type 22 Batch 2]
6x Sea King HAS.5
1x A 385 Fort Grange [Fort Class]
1x F 40 Sirius [Type 12I Leander Batch 2TA]
1x D 80 Sheffield [Type 42 Batch 1]
1x D 89 Exeter [Type 42 Batch 2]
8x Sea Harrier FRS.1
2x Sea King AEW.2
1x R 05 Invincible

EXPENDITURES:
------------------
19x SSQ-963A CAMBS III
9x AIM-9L Sidewinder
3x Generic Chaff Salvo [5x Cartridges]
16x Sea Eagle
49x Sea Dart Mod 1
24x Sea Wolf Blk 1
7x Corvus Chaff [Seduction]
16x Plessey Shield Chaff
4x 20mm/85 Mk15 Phalanx Blk 0 Burst [200 rnds]
1x 114mm/55 Mk8 HE(MP) HE

SIDE: Red Banner Northern Fleet
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
3x Ka-27PL Helix A
3x Tu-16RM-1/2 Badger D
1x Ka-25Ts Hormone B
1x EM Sovremenny I [Pr.956]

EXPENDITURES:
------------------
5x Generic Flare Salvo [4x Cartridges, Single Spectral]
64x SA-N-6a Grumble [5R55RM]
17x SA-N-7 Gadfly [9M38]
32x SS-N-12 Sandbox Mod 1 [P-500 Bazalt]
12x AS-4 Kitchen A Mod 3 [Kh-22N ASM]
24x SS-N-19 Shipwreck [P-700 Granit]
11x AK-130 130mm/54 Twin Frag Burst [2 rnds]
2x AK-630M 30mm/65 Gatling Burst [400 rnds]
4x PK-2 Chaff [TSP-47]
2x SA-N-4b Gecko [9M33M3]
2x SA-N-9 Grinch [9M330-2 Kinzhal]

The key from the soviet side is to have your own SAG hidden and maintain radar contact with the british force during most times. I launched the 3 badgers to get the location of the british force, 2 fell victim to Sea Harriers, the third one managed to keep contact until my Backfires were in place. While I didn't manage simultaneous arrival, the missiles from the Backfires, my Oscar SSGN and from the SAG arrived within 30 seconds of each other.
The AS-4s were all shot down but the Granits from my Oscar managed to get through and sank two frigates, then the main strike of Bazalts and Granits from my SAG arrived. Due to contact "jumping" some of my granits went all over the place and I had to manually plot them back to the british SAG.
Though not all hit, they sank every single british ship in the task force.
Since my shadowing Badger was shot down, I wasn't really sure wether there were any survivors, so I detached my two Sovremeny DDGs to attack any remaining ships with Moskits, unfortunately they ran afoul of the Buccaneer strike and one was sunk.

One thing I noted was the Sea Harriers going after my helicopters like idiots. While it enabled the brits to spot my SAG, it also drew off british CAP so my off axis Badger shadower and Backfire strike were not molested until it was too late.

I wonder why the Kiev doesn't carry any Yak-38 Forgers.
Design decision?

< Message edited by JCR -- 11/29/2013 10:36:28 PM >

Post #: 1

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 11/30/2013 9:50:05 PM

mikmykWS

Posts: 11524
Joined: 3/22/2005
Status: offline

Hi

Going to update this one soon with a few mission adjustments.

As far as the Forgers..they were rarely deployed on that vessel by that time period. They were an ok CAS asset and a horrible everything else.

Mike

_____________________________

(in reply to JCR)

Post #: 2

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/1/2013 3:57:14 PM

JCR

Posts: 160
Joined: 11/4/2013
Status: offline

Still having a AAM carrying plane is preverable to not having one :P

Btw, the Kiev class in the DB3000 seems to carry the wrong sort of missiles for the Forger.

(in reply to mikmykWS)

Post #: 3

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/1/2013 4:16:35 PM

mikmykWS

Posts: 11524
Joined: 3/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JCR

Still having a AAM carrying plane is preverable to not having one :P

Agreed. Now only if we could go back in time and tell Northern Fleet that

quote:

Btw, the Kiev class in the DB3000 seems to carry the wrong sort of missiles for the Forger.

No problem. Can fix.

Thanks!

Mike

_____________________________

(in reply to JCR)

Post #: 4

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/1/2013 8:17:48 PM

Russian Heel

Posts: 231
Joined: 10/8/2013
From: Metro Station Vasileostrovskaya
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Hi

Going to update this one soon with a few mission adjustments.

As far as the Forgers..they were rarely deployed on that vessel by that time period. They were an ok CAS asset and a horrible everything else.

Mike

No, they were horrible in the CAS/strike role too. Their operational testing in Afghanistan was supposed to be extensive and last upwards to six months. I think they dropped 2 bombs and flew less than a dozen sorties before they got shut down and sent home in less than 2 months. I've got a copy of the operational assessment somewhere. They were basically a placeholder air-frame to say 'look we have fixed wing carrier-based a/c' Yak-141 would have been on the same level as the Sea Harrier but the end of the country killed that program.

(in reply to mikmykWS)

Post #: 5

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/1/2013 8:28:45 PM

Russian Heel

Posts: 231
Joined: 10/8/2013
From: Metro Station Vasileostrovskaya
Status: offline

They look cooler in their flot livery tough.

Also there was testing with them for defending convoys, but seriously what were they going to do? Fly a circle and land?

(in reply to Russian Heel)

Post #: 6

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/1/2013 8:54:23 PM

JCR

Posts: 160
Joined: 11/4/2013
Status: offline

Seriously, any aeronautics student with a pocket calculator could've told the VVS how those Afghan trials would go out.
"Hot and high" with a aircraft with so little power reserves....
On the other hand, having a slow, small fighter with 2 AAMs definitely beats not having a fighter at all.
If this thing chances across a Nimrod or a P-3 it will to its job.
Not to mention that the Sea Harrier Mk.1s radar didn't work more often than not, as far as I gathered from Falkland accounts, so not much advantage there.
Though I must admit I have no idea what the two soviet squadrons actually did during their fleet deployments, did they train intercepts and intercepted NATO patrol aircraft?

But judging from a google image search it is notable that the vast majority of the Yak-38 pics on fleet deployment seem to be taken from NATO recon aircraft of planes on the deck of Kievs or from soviet photographers on deck of a Kiev, not in the air. I could find only a few pics of midair shots that might have been shot from a NATO plane of a Forger over the sea, sadly without context.

< Message edited by JCR -- 12/1/2013 9:59:46 PM >

(in reply to Russian Heel)

Post #: 7

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/2/2013 2:30:12 AM

mikmykWS

Posts: 11524
Joined: 3/22/2005
Status: offline

If you want add the Forgers and the missiles. The game gives you the ability to do so in a couple of minutes.

Thanks!

Mike

_____________________________

(in reply to JCR)

Post #: 8

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/2/2013 5:59:50 AM

Russian Heel

Posts: 231
Joined: 10/8/2013
From: Metro Station Vasileostrovskaya
Status: offline

Weird, I typed up a post then I could't post it and now some posts are missing? Anyways let me type this again.

Here is a video produced by the Gazprom owned NTV that shows the Yak-38 in a more positive light, though it is easy too see through the BS. It has English subs if you turn them on. I only spot checked them but the translation seemed OK. It focuses mainly on the Afghanistan deployment but there is a good 7-8 minutes on the development of the A/C and lots of Soviet footage of operations.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doHPQ96HPfQ

Seriously though JCR, this plane was such junk it hardly operated even when at sea, or should I say especially when at sea. It couldn't operate with external stores most of the time in the Black Sea, Med, or Indian Ocean due to the air temperature - it couldn't even have a full fuel load. They made adjustments to the engine and to the intakes but the never got it right. I honestly don't think they had the range with stores to operate outside of the SAM range of the ships. It was literally an aircraft solely in service to say that they had carrier capable fixed wing aircraft.

(in reply to mikmykWS)

Post #: 9

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 12/2/2013 5:52:37 PM

JCR

Posts: 160
Joined: 11/4/2013
Status: offline

At least hot ambient temperatures shouldn't be a problem in the GIUK Gap, but you're probably right.
Do you know if the Yak-38M was any better?

I wanted to design a "Duelists reForged" variant but for some reason I couldn't take off with the Forgers
It seems the unreliability is allready built in :D
It isn't a bug with the Kievs and Forgers as it works flawlessly in a blank scenario, so what could be the reason? Overcrowding?
The Yak-38 transits to launch position but when it should take off it reverts to "readying".

(in reply to Russian Heel)

Post #: 10

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 5/13/2014 11:33:35 AM

DeltaIV

Posts: 161
Joined: 3/3/2014
From: EUCCP
Status: offline

SIDE: Royal Navy
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------
1x A 385 Fort Grange [Fort Class]
1x D 80 Sheffield [Type 42 Batch 1]
1x D 89 Exeter [Type 42 Batch 2]
2x D 95 Manchester [Type 42 Batch 3]
1x F 169 Amazon [Type 21, Exocet]
1x F 40 Sirius [Type 12I Leander Batch 2TA]
1x F 88 Broadsword [Type 22 Batch 1]
1x F 92 Boxer [Type 22 Batch 2]
6x Lynx HAS.3
2x Lynx HAS.3
4x Nimrod MR.2P
1x R 05 Invincible
1x S 107 Trafalgar
1x S 108 Swiftsure
8x Sea Harrier FRS.1
2x Sea King AEW.2
6x Sea King HAS.5

EXPENDITURES:
------------------
12x 114mm/55 Mk8 HE(MP) HE
33x 20mm/85 Mk15 Phalanx Blk 0 Burst [200 rnds]
6x AGM-84D Harpoon IC
4x Corvus Chaff [Distraction]
24x Generic Chaff Salvo [5x Cartridges]
16x Mk24 Tigerfish Mod 2
3x Plessey Shield Flare
40x Plessey Shield Chaff
102x Sea Dart Mod 1
12x Sea Eagle
14x Sea Wolf Blk 1
29x SSQ-963A CAMBS III
2x Stingray Mod 0
6x Type 2066 Bandfish
1x UGM-84B Harpoon IA

SIDE: Red Banner Northern Fleet
===========================================================

LOSSES:
-------------------------------

EXPENDITURES:
------------------
3x 65-76 Kit WH
23x AK-100 100mm/70 Frag
2x AK-630 30mm/65 Gatling Burst [400 rnds]
2x AK-630M 30mm/65 Gatling Burst [400 rnds]
1x AK-726 76mm/60 Twin Frag Burst [2 rnds]
1x APR-2 Orlan-M
12x AS-4 Kitchen A Mod 3 [Kh-22N ASM]
2x PK-2 Chaff [TSP-47]
1x RGB-25 [Track, Passive Directional]
41x SA-N-3b Goblet [4K65]
6x SA-N-4a Gecko [9M33]
64x SA-N-6a Grumble [5R55RM]
22x SA-N-9 Gauntlet [9M330-2 Kinzhal]
32x SS-N-12 Sandbox Mod 1 [P-500 Bazalt]
8x SS-N-14 Silex [85RU, Dual-Role, UMGT-1 Torpedo + 185kg Unitary]
2x SS-N-15 Starfish [RPK-6 Vodopad, UMGT-1 Torpedo]
3x SS-N-16 Stallion [RPK-7 Vodopei, UMGT-1 Torpedo]
24x SS-N-19 Shipwreck [P-700 Granit]
12x USET-80

This has to be my most epic CMANO win so far

Managed to obliterate the Royal Navy without any losses. Used the Bears to keep the contact with Royal SAG. Backfires completely failed to do any damage (but so did British Bucaneers and Harriers). Tu-142 managed to sink one submarine. Oscar managed to destroy the second one. Then i completely cancelled the ASW patrols, because of Harriers. Managed to sneak the Oscar into good firing position and launched the whole salvo of Granits, i think they sunk three or four ships. Other two submarines torpedoed the escorts and managed to sink some ships. Rest was destroyed using Sandbox/Silex combo.

< Message edited by DeltaIV -- 5/13/2014 12:34:09 PM >

(in reply to JCR)

Post #: 11

RE: "Duelists" from the soviet side - 5/23/2014 2:39:06 PM

DirtyFred

Posts: 99
Joined: 5/22/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Hi

Going to update this one soon with a few mission adjustments.

As far as the Forgers..they were rarely deployed on that vessel by that time period. They were an ok CAS asset and a horrible everything else.

Mike

as a diehard harpoon gamer i very much would like to see some F3's added to "duelists" ...

realism check:
many F3 squadrons were available in 1989, RAF Coningsby from 1987, RAF Leeming from 1988, RAF Leuchars from Septmeber 1989 etc.

why?
Fitted with the long range Foxhunter radar and more powerful engines then the F-2, the aircraft successively replaced Lightning and Phantom fighter squadrons in the air defence role. Seven squadrons were formed.
F3 were tasked with intercepting Tu-16 Badgers, Tu-95 Bears, Tu-22 Backfires over the North Sea Lanes.

thanks to the devs for making this game