RE: Carriers in the I.O.

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Carriers in the I.O.

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RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 5:21:55 AM

Yaab

Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline

Maybe a limited offensive in India in the Calcutta basin up to Darjeeling? Thus, you rob the Allies from any air base they can resupply China from while you conquer the Chinese.

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 751

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 7:45:31 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

June 9-11, 1942

CHINA: the tanks break through!At the third attempt they manage to shock and inflict a 10-1 defeat to the chinese corp! Now the mountain hex is hours and we can expand the bridgehead. Problem is now that he is smartly trying to cut the supply lines (which are clearly fragile). Enemy troops are spotted moving from Tyung area westwards and also troops are spotted in a flanking manouvre on both sides of my tanks. We don't care. We'll keep on pushing through, just like Rommell's "Ghost Division" in France in 1940

We've also decided to make a decisive effort against Chikkiang and Kweilling. It's now or never.
Sending several units to the west so to reinforce the tanks' efforts and to keep the LOCs safe.

INDIA: The stack has arrived at Hyderabad. I got what you say guys about the 70th UK ID. Probably i understimated it a bit, but i never had any clear success with british divisions in 1942... i always felt them simply too weak. But maybe i am now wrong and will lose this decisive battle...we'll soon see i guess.
India is costy in terms of supplies, sure. My strategy was to bag a lot of supplies and fuel and exploit its heavy industry as long as possible (possible till 1.1.1943). Unfortunately it didn't work (HIs was everywhere wreckd and ddn't find any stock in the base i conquered), so the whole strategy changed: now India is a way too keep the allies far from Burma and from China, so to be able to starve it and isolate it. However i do not plan to remain there forever. 6 more months is what i want. Then we can turtle back at Ceylon and in Burma.
The last KI-44a group (3 out of 3) has arrived at Calcutta today from Burma. Will be based at Patna, while the other 2 will operate at Hyderabad

DIEGO: on the 11th, suddenly, a DDTF pops up from the CT Channel. No air cover. No CVs. Just British DDs. 33 Vals took off from Diego. 2 DDs were sunk while 3 escaped. I need to put more efforts here. Accelerating the process of sending reinforcements to Attu and Diego.

CENTPAC:... quiet

SOPAC: ...deadly quiet

OZ:...even boring

RnD: A6M3a is online! Production is already up to 210/month!

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 752

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 8:29:47 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

Jul 12, 42
A day of lights and shadows.
In Burma we defeated the last 2 indian brigades that survived at the japanese advance. We conquered Ramree Island and another one (well, what was left of it after a chase that lasted 3 months in the jungle).
In India we're waiting for the next allied advance.
I think he will try to use paras again, possibly against Viz. Taking the necessary countermeasures immediately.
In China everything went bad.
Our tanks finally stopped their victorious advance. No way to proceed for the moment. Too few AVs. Too few supplies. Simply too many enemies.
South of Chikkiang things didn't go any better. Another bloody nose. We're now waiting for the 1st Tank ID to change the equation here.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 78,51 (near Chihkiang)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 32519 troops, 386 guns, 578 vehicles, Assault Value = 989

Defending force 36956 troops, 163 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1099

Japanese adjusted assault: 542

Allied adjusted defense: 2674

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 4

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1863 casualties reported
Squads: 7 destroyed, 199 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 27 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 11 disabled

Allied ground losses:
1130 casualties reported
Squads: 12 destroyed, 108 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 13 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Guns lost 12 (1 destroyed, 11 disabled)

Assaulting units:
13th Tank Regiment
15th Division
34th Division
23rd Tank Regiment
10th Tank Regiment
13th Army
3rd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
7th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
4th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
1st Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
2nd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
6th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
14th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
Tonei Hvy Gun Regiment
15th Ind.Medium Field Artillery Regiment
4th Mortar Battalion
5th Ind.Hvy.Art Battalion

Defending units:
73rd Chinese Corps
63rd Chinese Corps
70th Chinese Corps
86th Chinese Corps
7th Artillery Regiment

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 60,43 (near Katha)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 5424 troops, 42 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 209

Defending force 373 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 2

Japanese adjusted assault: 23

Allied adjusted defense: 1

Japanese assault odds: 23 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-)
morale(-), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker: leaders(-), morale(-)

Allied ground losses:
399 casualties reported
Squads: 25 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 53 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Units destroyed 1

Assaulting units:
2nd RTA Division

Defending units:
16th Indian Brigade

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Ramree Island (54,48)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 7563 troops, 45 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 329

Defending force 2571 troops, 6 guns, 48 vehicles, Assault Value = 72

Japanese adjusted assault: 118

Allied adjusted defense: 15

Japanese assault odds: 7 to 1 (fort level 3)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Ramree Island !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-), morale(-)
experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Japanese ground losses:
163 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 39 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Allied ground losses:
2369 casualties reported
Squads: 136 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 153 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 16 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 6 (6 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 64 (64 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units destroyed 2

Assaulting units:
6th RTA Division
3rd RTA/B Division

Defending units:
46th Indian Brigade
208th RAF Adv Base Force

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 72,49 (near Kweiyang)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 8232 troops, 122 guns, 598 vehicles, Assault Value = 426

Defending force 46542 troops, 309 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1596

Japanese adjusted assault: 306

Allied adjusted defense: 2459

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 8

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
195 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 19 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 8 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Vehicles lost 55 (3 destroyed, 52 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
354 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 33 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled

Assaulting units:
7th Ind.Tank Brigade
Guards Tank Division

Defending units:
7th Chinese Corps
14th Chinese Corps
66th Chinese Corps
1st Group Army
1st Artillery Regiment
18th Artillery Regiment

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 753

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 8:35:42 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

We're now risking another statlemate in China. I need to keep on pushing inorder to move the front,but Erik simply has too many units in too good terrain to hope to advance fast. The heavy artillery can do wonders, but only when he's low on supply. Unfortunately he seems to be in a pretty good situation supply-wise. My mistake. I let him dig in there for too long...

Fast transports keep on moving in CentPac and Sopac. We'll soon have to deal with these two threatening vectors.

Another CV went for upgrades. Zuikaku now.

Producing 7 A6M3a every day. The first units will be able to upgrade very soon

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 754

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 8:44:17 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

China

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(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 755

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 8:44:47 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

Attachment (1)

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 756

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/8/2014 8:52:00 PM

MrKane

Posts: 790
Joined: 3/9/2013
From: West Poland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

We're now risking another statlemate in China. I need to keep on pushing inorder to move the front,but Erik simply has too many units in too good terrain to hope to advance fast. The heavy artillery can do wonders, but only when he's low on supply. Unfortunately he seems to be in a pretty good situation supply-wise. My mistake. I let him dig in there for too long...

Fast transports keep on moving in CentPac and Sopac. We'll soon have to deal with these two threatening vectors.

Another CV went for upgrades. Zuikaku now.

Producing 7 A6M3a every day. The first units will be able to upgrade very soon

At some point you need decided what you like to have more ? China or China industry :) You should remember that Nick & Lilly are great for LI destruction :)

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 757

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/9/2014 6:34:51 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrKane

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

We're now risking another statlemate in China. I need to keep on pushing inorder to move the front,but Erik simply has too many units in too good terrain to hope to advance fast. The heavy artillery can do wonders, but only when he's low on supply. Unfortunately he seems to be in a pretty good situation supply-wise. My mistake. I let him dig in there for too long...

Fast transports keep on moving in CentPac and Sopac. We'll soon have to deal with these two threatening vectors.

Another CV went for upgrades. Zuikaku now.

Producing 7 A6M3a every day. The first units will be able to upgrade very soon

At some point you need decided what you like to have more ? China or China industry :) You should remember that Nick & Lilly are great for LI destruction :)

I remember very well!
The point is that we have an HR that restrict strat bombing only to manpower, so the efforts needed to really destroy the chinese industry would be massive. At the same time, yes, i still have hopes to conquer some more of those precious LIs and HIs intact, so i really don't wanna intact them...not if i am not really forced to do it.

(in reply to MrKane)

Post #: 758

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/16/2014 9:24:01 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

Jul 13-20, 42

Turns are slow recently. I am on vacation and my GF reached me here, so i have very little time to play (mainly when she's taking a shower or she's sleeping late in the morning) and even less to update the AAR...

Seven days have passed.

CHINA: more failed attacks at Kweilling and South of Chikkiang. Am not able to break through his lines, despite the heavy air bombing and the extra supplies delivered to the front. Erik is doing great in China and i strongly suggest everyone who complains about the impossibility to defend China in DBB to take a look at what he's doing here...

INDIA: the allies keep on applyin pressure here, bombing my undefended bases and i smell them paradropping in Assam very soon...

CENTPAC: the Empire tried to ambush the several convoys moving to the Gilberts. Spotted a big Cruiser TF on the 19th, along with several transport TFs. My KB was hiding in the shades... decided for a full-speed run....
Everything seemed perfect...
But weather, once again, kicked in.
Storms above the main allied bases (where i had planned several sweeps) and bad weather in the afternoon over my two CVTFs...
only small strikes in the morning... bad luck...
bagged some minor ships, but that's all...not a single warship attacked...:-((((

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at 78,51 (near Chihkiang)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 39295 troops, 414 guns, 226 vehicles, Assault Value = 1161

Defending force 41383 troops, 130 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1260

Japanese adjusted assault: 749

Allied adjusted defense: 2356

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 3

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
4375 casualties reported
Squads: 11 destroyed, 389 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 29 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 38 disabled
Guns lost 36 (1 destroyed, 35 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
1040 casualties reported
Squads: 4 destroyed, 120 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 2 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 6 (1 destroyed, 5 disabled)

Assaulting units:
6th Division
34th Division
60th Division
15th Ind.Medium Field Artillery Regiment
13th Army
2nd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
6th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
3rd Hvy.Artillery Regiment
4th Mortar Battalion
1st Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
14th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
Tonei Hvy Gun Regiment

Defending units:
84th Chinese Corps
70th Chinese Corps
73rd Chinese Corps
86th Chinese Corps

------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Tabiteuea at 137,134

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 30
B5N2 Kate x 61
D3A1 Val x 72

Japanese aircraft losses
B5N2 Kate: 1 damaged
D3A1 Val: 1 damaged

Allied Ships
xAKL Masayas, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
DMS Boggs, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
APD Manley, Bomb hits 1, on fire
DMS Lamberton, Bomb hits 6, and is sunk
APD Colhoun, Bomb hits 5, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAP Zaandam, Bomb hits 5, Torpedo hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAP Zealandia, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
xAKL Teapa
APD Schley, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires
APD Litchfield
xAKL Matagalpa, Bomb hits 3, and is sunk

Allied ground losses:
2615 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 72 destroyed, 37 disabled
Engineers: 18 destroyed, 9 disabled
Vehicles lost 15 (13 destroyed, 2 disabled)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Nikunau at 139,134

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 30
B5N2 Kate x 13
D3A1 Val x 15

No Japanese losses

Allied Ships
xAK Robert Morris, Bomb hits 6, heavy fires
AM Turkey, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
AVD Chincoteague, Bomb hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAKL Hirondelle, Torpedo hits 4, and is sunk

Allied ground losses:
10 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Tabiteuea at 137,134

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
B5N1 Kate x 7
B5N2 Kate x 12
D3A1 Val x 27

No Japanese losses

Allied Ships
xAP Zaandam, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk

Allied ground losses:
1936 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 133 destroyed, 45 disabled
Engineers: 8 destroyed, 7 disabled
Guns lost 18 (17 destroyed, 1 disabled)
Vehicles lost 37 (35 destroyed, 2 disabled)

And that's all... tons of fuel wasted... lots of damage points accumulated...for some old xAPs...:-((((

Japan is reinforcing Port Hedland and Exmouth, while lots of units are getting to India. Planning to send there 4 Divisions ASAP

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 759

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/16/2014 12:29:17 PM

ny59giants

Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

My KB was hiding in the shades... decided for a full-speed run....

Your slang needs correcting here.

It should be "shadows" and not "shades."

China - I would look for some shattered divisions or brigades that you can buy out cheaply to be re-deployed to other areas. You know you need to garrison too many bases with the troops you have and China is the best place to get them from.

_____________________________

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 760

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/16/2014 5:33:40 PM

MrBlizzard

Posts: 636
Joined: 4/16/2012
From: Italy
Status: offline

I am on vacation and my GF reached me here, so i have very little time to play (mainly when she's taking a shower or she's sleeping late in the morning)

You are lucky! My girlfriend didn't allow me carry the laptop on holidays...

Do you pretended it was for job?

_____________________________

Blizzard

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 761

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/16/2014 6:54:04 PM

Cribtop

Posts: 3890
Joined: 8/10/2008
From: Lone Star Nation
Status: offline

I love this game, but if I know GreyJoy's girlfriends I am amazed he has the restraint to play it while she's in the shower on vacation. Just sayin'.

Michael, "shades" is just part of the GJ Lexicon, like Scoodra, Ducth, etc. It's GreyJoy's world, we just live in it.

GJ, what are the main elements, in your opinion, of Eric's good play in China?

_____________________________

(in reply to MrBlizzard)

Post #: 762

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/19/2014 2:09:20 PM

leehunt27@bloomberg.net

Posts: 533
Joined: 9/6/2004
Status: offline

I second Cribtop's question: "what are the main elements, in your opinion, of Eric's good play in China?"

Also I've found the secret to what hopefully will be a lifetime of playing this game is to have the PC and the wife's Jane Austen TV in the same room. I can plot my turns and discuss with her 19th century period piece relationships at the same time... She's happy, I'm happy...

_____________________________

John 21:25

(in reply to Cribtop)

Post #: 763

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/19/2014 6:42:50 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

Jul 23, 42

Nothing to report. In India the allies are building the newly conquered bases in the central plains, while Japan is recieving the higly needed reinforcements.
In China, Erik abbandons Kweilling, thus allowing me to connect Changsha basin to the southern railroad network. Great! Now i can move out the 4 Divisions of the 14th Army that are badly needed in India! With the arrival of 4 IDs, i will have a critical mass to use against him.

For what concerns Erik's good plays in China, here are my thoughts:

First of all, he understood very well how much the +3 terrain is important. He immediately moved every unit into good terrain positions and started to dig in since dec 7th.
Then he has fooled me at Sian. He understood how much i wanted it and decided to attract me in. I ate the bait, thinking that with tanks and well supplied divisions i could easily rivercross and shock them out in clear terrain. That has costed me more than 50,000 men and forced me to stop any other operation.
His only mistake was not to defend the southern axis enough, which has costed him now to lose the southern sector, but he has retreated in good order and his armies haven't suffered any real defeat.
For sure the HRs we have have impacted a lot on China's war (in a good way IMHO). PDU OFF means japan is forced to use extensively Lilies, Sonias and Anns in China, which are nowehere as good as Sallies or Helens.
Secondly we can only strat bomb manpower, which makes very difficult to really destroy chinese supply sources.
These HRs have made China a much more balanced scenario, where Japan cannot really do much more than crawling in the mud, advancing very very slowly and at high costs.
However, with SLs i do believe China is defendable in the long run.
Against Mr.Kane i've lost the north only in mid 1943 after a series of prolongued battles and never lost the central and southern front, even if Mr.Kane did make a big push in that theatre. The real key, even more than supplies, is to keep your armies undefeated. A corp in +3 terrain with 2 or more forts is a huge beast to defeat and it's more or less immune to aerial bombings. If you can rotate your corps in an out of a constested hex (a +3 terrain hex), Japan won't have an easy life, especially if the supply lines are long (the more he advances, the longer are the supply lines).
Tanks are tough to face for the chinese, but, at the same time, they are at disadvantage in mountain or WR hexes and cannot move that fast (they even move slower than INF units on those hexes).
So, the conclusion (my personal one at least) is that, given our HRs, China is defendable and Erik is doing it at its best.
Also i don't think China cannot be treated alone, as if it's a stand-alone scenario.
If the allies pushes their threats as they should, Japan cannot keep on sending men, equipments and supplies to China at its desires.
Take my situation as an example.
Erik is pushing strong in India and in the Gilberts.
I now need to make a choice: abbandon India and retreat to Burma, maybe sending some divisions to reinforce the China front, or abbandon any real chance of caging the chinese tiger and send some units to India (hoping to last a bit longer there).
You can't do both.
Eithr way, the allied strategy works in the long run

(in reply to leehunt27@bloomberg.net)

Post #: 764

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/19/2014 6:55:45 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leehunt27@bloomberg.net

I second Cribtop's question: "what are the main elements, in your opinion, of Eric's good play in China?"

Also I've found the secret to what hopefully will be a lifetime of playing this game is to have the PC and the wife's Jane Austen TV in the same room. I can plot my turns and discuss with her 19th century period piece relationships at the same time... She's happy, I'm happy...

China: GreyJoy didn't move aggressively there from day one.

Jane Austen. Did that last night with wife and daughter.

Sense and Sensibilities. I got to thinking how Col Brandon would defend Burma...everybody loves Austen here. Not everyone loves WITP tho.

(in reply to leehunt27@bloomberg.net)

Post #: 765

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 9:16:09 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

Jul 24, 42

Again, nothing to report.
In India the allies are ready to para-drop on the small empty dot bases north of Dacca, so to cut the rail-line fro Calcutta to the east. I do have a stretegy here. I just need enough time to set it up. That's where i need those 4 IDs from China and the 14th Army. These units are already moving back to a safe port where they can be loaded for India. Dedicated AA units and heavy artillery are already in place at Calcutta. 300 bombers are waiting at Calcutta for him to try to paradrop and strat move. Tanks are ready to cut the rail line. Everything is taking shape.
Need at least 4 weeks but i think it can be done.
Another big sentai of zero (45 planes) will arrive in India in two days.
In 6 days we'll start producing the KI-43 IIb. I know it is not a game changer, but for sure it will be better than the KI-43 Ic i'm now using extensively in India. Also many more sentais equipped with the obsolete Nate could finally be upgraded... can't wait to get rid of those useless planes!!!
At Hyderabad nothing is moving lately. No new allied units arrived, nor he ever tried to attack Hyderabad's air space... That's good for me. I am there to buy times for Madras to be built up...nothing more.
The 1st Air Army arrived at Calcutta today. More 144 badly needed aviation support points.
In the pacific, he keeps on advancing along the usual axis. Building the Gilberts... i can't do much there but keep the KB alert and try to punish him if he gest too aggressive. In the while i'm building Ponape to a fortress in order to defend my flank.

In China we're almost ready to attack south of Chikkiang once again. It will be slow, i know... but i need to get there.
The 16th ID is slowly moving to reach the Guards Tank ID east of Kweyang

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 766

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 9:18:58 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: leehunt27@bloomberg.net

I second Cribtop's question: "what are the main elements, in your opinion, of Eric's good play in China?"

Also I've found the secret to what hopefully will be a lifetime of playing this game is to have the PC and the wife's Jane Austen TV in the same room. I can plot my turns and discuss with her 19th century period piece relationships at the same time... She's happy, I'm happy...

China: GreyJoy didn't move aggressively there from day one.

Well, yes and no.
I did move from day one. The problem was that i didn't have the bomber army at my disposal in China... i did use it for India and Luzon and i thought i could make to Sian with just the LCUs...wrong! I did recieve a huge bloody nose and that stopped any chance to advance any further for a while (6 divisions completely wrecked)

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 767

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 11:12:33 AM

ny59giants

Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline

quote:

I now need to make a choice: abandon India and retreat to Burma, maybe sending some divisions to reinforce the China front, or abandon any real chance of caging the Chinese tiger and send some units to India (hoping to last a bit longer there).
You can't do both.

The choice needs to be decided by which one allows Japan to better take on the 800 pound gorilla that is just beginning to pound his chest....USA!! As you well know, the Allied forces cannot do much unless the USA is involved. Thus, I would say that you consolidate China and try to bleed the Allies in India while building up your defensive perimeter to deal with the coming counterattacks by the USA.

_____________________________

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 768

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 3:17:28 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

quote:

I now need to make a choice: abandon India and retreat to Burma, maybe sending some divisions to reinforce the China front, or abandon any real chance of caging the Chinese tiger and send some units to India (hoping to last a bit longer there).
You can't do both.

The choice needs to be decided by which one allows Japan to better take on the 800 pound gorilla that is just beginning to pound his chest....USA!! As you well know, the Allied forces cannot do much unless the USA is involved. Thus, I would say that you consolidate China and try to bleed the Allies in India while building up your defensive perimeter to deal with the coming counterattacks by the USA.

The question is who is bleeding? Even with victories in India or a good defensive stalemate. I don't think the supply and fuel burn required to keep such a massive 2nd theater open can be sustained by Japan. The skilled Greyjoy will be a good test of this theory, but I suspect that this strategy will hurt Japan later in the war. I might be wrong here but have a hunch. The only thing that can justify a campaign in India is a massive defeat for the Allies. So far Obvert has not obliged. I am beginning to think that there are only two real options for India- autovictory or stay out. Perhaps a rapid early strike to smash the very weak Indian army and take Ceylon and then a quick pull out of all but Ceylon.

Japan has only so much sake in the wine cellar. You can drink it all early and have fun but is that wise?..

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Post #: 769

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 3:27:27 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
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If Greyjoy had only captured a lot of supplies and fuel in India. If....

I think Japan's economic woes will be tough in this game...

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 770

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 4:27:47 PM

jmalter

Posts: 1673
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leehunt27@bloomberg.net
Also I've found the secret to what hopefully will be a lifetime of playing this game is to have the PC and the wife's Jane Austen TV in the same room. I can plot my turns and discuss with her 19th century period piece relationships at the same time... She's happy, I'm happy...

IMO leehunt27 has discovered the secret to long life & happiness! But I'm a not-so-secret fan of those Jane Austen dramatizations, & have even been known to enjoy watching a Hugh Grant movie.

Awhile back I said that I would ignore GJ's AAR in favor of reading obvert's AAR only, but this game is so interesting that I can't help but read the threads of both sides. And I don't see why I should deprive myself of reading GJ's assaults on the English language.

Neither player needs any advice from me, I'm just gonna sit back & cheer for both of them.

(in reply to leehunt27@bloomberg.net)

Post #: 771

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/20/2014 6:26:37 PM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy
These HRs have made China a much more balanced scenario, where Japan cannot really do much more than crawling in the mud, advancing very very slowly and at high costs.
However, with SLs i do believe China is defendable in the long run.

Definitely agree on this one. I'm playing with similar rules in my game and I've come to very similar conclusions. I've found that a stack of Chinese corps with 1000 AV in 3x terrain in supply with stacking limits is basically an immovable object, especially if you can rotate units in and out. The only effective way to get by a roadblock like that is to march around...then that's where the "crawling in the mud" comes into play and China is very good at that.

However, the problem I see with Chinese players is that too often they strictly adhere to forming defensive lines. China simply does not have enough AV to defend every point in the line. However, China does have enough strength to match Japanese AV as it's deployed. The goal is not to have defensive lines in place when Japan attacks but rather to detect Japanese offensives as early as possible and start deploying to meet that offensive and force the Japanese to take flanking maneuvers. Some parts of that line need not even be defended; often times I will simply not occupy a 1x hex in the "line" and instead position reserves in better terrain along its flank. Should the Japanese move through this hex I just bring in reserves to contain the salient and put pressure on its flanks. I've used this sort of tactic successfully a handful of times to lure the Japanese into overextending themselves then cutting them off at the base.

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 772

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/21/2014 10:17:18 PM

leehunt27@bloomberg.net

Posts: 533
Joined: 9/6/2004
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As I am I the midst of defending China early on, I agree with Sangeli. Its too hard to cover every hex, best try to let the IJ army show its hand first. The Flying Tigers help too prevent some aerial carnage.

As for invading India, with a lot of skill you can evacuate in time and really leave the Allies gasping for gains till 1945. Its very tricky- and of course highlights the absolute insanity of the Japanese starting the war in the first place!

p.s. currently my wife is watching the TV series Scrubs & then sometimes Parenthood, as I play this game (and sometimes work) 15 feet away. Scrubs is amusing as the steady beat of laughs hopefully matches the sounds of torpedo attacks in the background (my favorite combat text: ** FUEL STORAGE EXPLOSION **). Parenthood is too realistic and is how I feel as a Japanese player in 1944 as the Allies converge all over the Empire-- putting out fires constantly...

< Message edited by leehunt27@bloomberg.net -- 8/22/2014 2:12:20 AM >

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Post #: 773

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/21/2014 10:30:00 PM

Chickenboy

Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton
I am beginning to think that there are only two real options for India- autovictory or stay out. Perhaps a rapid early strike to smash the very weak Indian army and take Ceylon and then a quick pull out of all but Ceylon.

I completely agree with this assessment. That's the only way to look at an Indian campaign, IMO. Smash, grab and (most importantly) kill as early as possible. Then leave for more defensive territory that has been pre-sited astride the Allies likely point of advance.

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Post #: 774

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/25/2014 5:09:35 PM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton
I am beginning to think that there are only two real options for India- autovictory or stay out. Perhaps a rapid early strike to smash the very weak Indian army and take Ceylon and then a quick pull out of all but Ceylon.

I completely agree with this assessment. That's the only way to look at an Indian campaign, IMO. Smash, grab and (most importantly) kill as early as possible. Then leave for more defensive territory that has been pre-sited astride the Allies likely point of advance.

Well its definitely important to take as much booty and do as much damage on the offensive as possible but at the same time I think there is ample opportunity to make your opponent play going on the defensive as well, but it means you have to be very careful. It requires a lot of foresight in what your opponent is planning and willingness to retreat but with India as big as it is it mean anything except paradrops will take time to develop and thus counter. The extensive rail system in India really gives the advantage to the defender who is able to use it more effectively. And assuming Japan has some sort of air superiority it means that Allied units can really get hammered as they are forced to march over long distances in the open toward Japanese positions. Such a scenario could very well favor the Japanese against an overly-aggressive Allied opponent. The ability to slow down the enemy with air attacks coupled with those railroads can enable the Japanese to always "slip away" before he Allied land hammer can ever come down on the Japanese.

(in reply to Chickenboy)

Post #: 775

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/25/2014 7:13:16 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
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Jul 27-30, 42

July is running fast with not much happening.
Japan is now on the defensive posture, waiting for the allied move in order to react.
We're trying to manage our perimeter as best as possible.
I completely agree on your observation guys.
India is not the right place to fight and stand.
The only real advantage i see in my indian campaign (which was planned in order to plunder and grab precious resources and supplies) is the defence of the DEI.
I see my defensive perimeter in India as a way to slow down the advance of the allies towards Burma and Sumatra.
Keeping the western democracies away from Ceylon and Diego and holding the Assam basin the threat to Burma and Sumatra oil fields is kept away.
My hope is to hold the present perimeter untill 1.1.1943, then jump back into safer prepared positions in Burma and Ceylon.
A delaying action. Nothing more.
An expensive one, i know.
Time will tell if i am completely wrong (could be, i know).

China: another failed (and expensive) deliberate attack south of Chikkiang. More than 3000 casualities on my side and less than half on Erik's one. His defensive positions are holding way better than expected. He must be in a very good supply situation. Crap!

No sign of the allied CVs... my subs are searching... but no joy till now.

In India, on the 30th, we decided to try the allied CAP north of Patna. Sent 3 different groups to sweep at 20K.
A6M3s went in first. It was the first real test for this plane, which is actually the best IJN fighter i can fill untill the A6M5 arrives. I had quite a good expectation for it... didn't go well.
1-3 in his favour during the first engagement (didn't use the LRCAP+Sweep combo).
Luckly the second group was one ofthe 2 KI-44a sentai i can field. They did wonders!
At the end of the day, we achieved a 1-1 (which isn't good), 23 planes lost for 23 destroyed.

In SOPAC the allies bombard Tarawa for two days in a row and then landed and conquered Nanumea...

My CVs are back at Truk...let's see what i can do

(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 776

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/25/2014 7:17:42 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton
I am beginning to think that there are only two real options for India- autovictory or stay out. Perhaps a rapid early strike to smash the very weak Indian army and take Ceylon and then a quick pull out of all but Ceylon.

I completely agree with this assessment. That's the only way to look at an Indian campaign, IMO. Smash, grab and (most importantly) kill as early as possible. Then leave for more defensive territory that has been pre-sited astride the Allies likely point of advance.

Well its definitely important to take as much booty and do as much damage on the offensive as possible but at the same time I think there is ample opportunity to make your opponent play going on the defensive as well, but it means you have to be very careful. It requires a lot of foresight in what your opponent is planning and willingness to retreat but with India as big as it is it mean anything except paradrops will take time to develop and thus counter. The extensive rail system in India really gives the advantage to the defender who is able to use it more effectively. And assuming Japan has some sort of air superiority it means that Allied units can really get hammered as they are forced to march over long distances in the open toward Japanese positions. Such a scenario could very well favor the Japanese against an overly-aggressive Allied opponent. The ability to slow down the enemy with air attacks coupled with those railroads can enable the Japanese to always "slip away" before he Allied land hammer can ever come down on the Japanese.

The point is that,with PDU OFF,the japanese bomber armada isn't that strong. The allies just need a couple of heavy AA units (even bought out american ones) to render useless the LCU bombing activity by the japanese.
However i am still in mid 1942. I hope to be able to resist for some more months... let's see!

(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 777

RE: Carriers in the I.O. - 8/25/2014 7:27:20 PM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy
The point is that,with PDU OFF,the japanese bomber armada isn't that strong. The allies just need a couple of heavy AA units (even bought out american ones) to render useless the LCU bombing activity by the japanese.
However i am still in mid 1942. I hope to be able to resist for some more months... let's see!

The actual damage is lower but certainly a big factor in the effectiveness of using bombers in this way is preventing advancing Allies from using the "move" OP mode. Great way to slow down an Allied stack which threatens your positions via maneuver giving you more time to escape. Hard to hit a target if it's always moving faster than you can move.

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 778

Back from vacations... - 8/31/2014 5:53:38 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
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July 31 - Aug 03, 1942
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Turns are very slow now.
Erik left the country for a wedding and then he'll be busy for his own wedding (!!!!), while i'm trying to get the best out of my last days of vacation,which will end TODAY

As you may understand, WITP don't have much time in our days at the moment. I guess that it'll be like that untill mid semptember.

However the game has entered in a very important phase with the beginning of august.

The allies keep on moving men and materials to the Gilberts, now completely (safe for Tarawa) in their hands.
I don't consider them strategic so i'm not really fighting for them. Hopefully the presence of my CVs should be enough to prevent a fast and easy deep penetration beyond the Tarawa-Ocean Island line (at least for the moment).
He's keeping his CVs hidden, wisely.
In India nothing has changed in the last days. The 14th Army (four divisions) is moving from China to India, but it will take a while before i could field it.
In the while the Oscar KI-43 IIb (armoured version) is online and we hope to be able to replace the KI-43 Ic squadrons in India with new machines by the end of the month.
Heavy allied recon over Patna and Ranchi (my main defensive line of Assam). I do expect some moves from him soon in this area.

In China we keep on getting bloody noses south of Chikkiang. This is the 4th Battle there that we lose (another 1-2). He keeps on being well supplied and there seems to be no way to push those damned 4 corps back. Will now try to use the tanks..
P-38s arrived in China and are ambushing my bombers...lost 20 of them in the last 4 turns... 45 A6M3 have now been transfered from Japan to counter this threat.
We tranferred 3 Netties sentais to China and started to strat bomb a bit Chinese industries at Chengtu...hopefully we can lower the Chinese supply production and so indirectly help my poor troops in the front lines.

We are also ready to buy out from Manchuria another Division (that will be sent to CENTPAC), while 2 new brigades are almost ready to be sent to Onnekotan Jiima and Shimushiri Jiima (Kuriles), where engineers and base forces are already working on fortifications and AFs developement.

(in reply to Yaab)

Post #: 779

RE: Back from vacations... - 9/1/2014 7:48:26 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

So I'm finally back to work... after 25 days of sun, fresh breeze, seaboats and seafoods (and, above all, 28� Celsius), the coming back to reality is pretty hard: storms, heavy clouds, constant rain and 12� degrees... ouch

Anyway, the only good thing of today is that I was finally able to launch tracker (doesn't seem to be working on my new laptop

).
It has been 29 turns since the last update...
The economy is stable, even if supplies are far from being at a decent shape: 2.8M against the 2.79M of 30 days ago...

Fuel remains stable at 6M, while the oil has dropped to 3.7M

The arrival of the KI-43 IIb should give me some more air power in the front lines (INDIA) and lower the demand of Navy Sentais in India (so that I can start to transfer them to the Pacific).
Now I face a difficult planning:
I have 12 groups (of various dimensions) that can upgrade to the KI-43 IIb (one is the dreaded 260th sentai on which Symon is still working to see if it is possible to make him move from the KI-43 Ib version where it's stuck).
Only a small fraction of these groups go on on the same upgrade path and gets the IIIa and the IV version, being some switched to the KI-84a line and some other getting stuck with the Sonia KI-51b version that arrives in 1944 (and obviously am not RnDing!)
At the moment I'm producing:
1x33 KI-43 IIa
1x110 + 7x30 KI-43 IIb

what to do with the 7x30 factories (remember I am playing realistic RnD OFF even if PDU OFF)?
I'd love to get to the KI-43 IV version asap, but only 5 of the present groups will be able to upgrade to it (being one stuck with the dreaded KI-51b model). Another sentai that can upgrade to the KI-43 IV arrives in 81 days. Then it's over for 450 turns for what concerns the KI-43 IIIa and IV line

So, not much.
Is it worth to invest that much on a production line that has this small impact after the KI-43 IIIa (which isn't much better than the KI-43 IIb version)?
Or would it be better to devote some of those RnD factories to improve the research on more crucial planes (like the KI-84b for example)?
Really hard to balance things out in PDU OFF...

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 780