RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder

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RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/10/2015 5:36:18 PM

HansBolter

Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: vicberg

What a surprise? More extremely important details I just found out about.

Don't worry this will never stop happening.

The disruption incurred from spending time aboard ship is very important to consider.

It pays to make your "troop marshaling and loading points" as close to your objectives as possible.

When this is not possible it pays to minimize the time aboard ship by loading and proceeding as directly to the invasion point as possible.

Time spent loitering is counterproductive.

_____________________________

Hans

(in reply to vicberg)

Post #: 1051

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/10/2015 6:15:28 PM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

Kind of sucks for the Allies in the CentPac where there aren't a lot of islands big enough to stage invasion out of. If you don't have a foothold in the Gilberts then Christmas island is probably the closest base. The only other alternative is to use a base like Palmyra or Canton which can get a pretty good sized port and just pay the supply cost for an uber-stack. Yea its a waste of supply but supply wastage should be one of the last concerns for the Allies, especially in bases close to PH.

(in reply to HansBolter)

Post #: 1052

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/10/2015 8:04:46 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

07 July 1943

If you're not watching something...

Cannonfodder advanced some troops without me noticing to Jubbulpore. With turn after turn, it's easy to let things go, I guess.

quote:

Ground combat at Jubbulpore (46,27)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 23407 troops, 344 guns, 1414 vehicles, Assault Value = 1189

Defending force 9406 troops, 54 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 405

Japanese adjusted assault: 829

Allied adjusted defense: 1507

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 3)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), leaders(+), preparation(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1515 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 96 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 35 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 28 disabled
Guns lost 24 (1 destroyed, 23 disabled)
Vehicles lost 167 (42 destroyed, 125 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
586 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 98 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled

Assaulting units:
2nd Tank Division
1st Tank Division
7th Ind.Tank Brigade
Guards Tank Division

Defending units:
16th LRP Brigade
14th LRP Brigade
23rd LRP Brigade

It looks like I punched him in the face good, and according to the map, his forces are retreating back out. If this had turned into a battle, I would have railed over 2-3 divisions anyway. If he want's to punch through, he'll need overwhelming strength, or I can simply reinforce. If not there, then a couple hexes back anyway.

Other than that, I had recalled all my Australian based subs back to Brisbane. Nearly all of them were low on fuel. I plan to set up a wall within bombardment staging range of my Pago bases. The more difficult one is Vava'u, as he could probably reach it from Suva.

_____________________________

(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 1053

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/11/2015 3:33:57 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

08 July 1943

Figures, when I bring the topic up, it happens.

quote:

Night Naval bombardment of Vava'u at 141,165 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
P-40E Warhawk: 10 damaged
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed on ground
F4F-4 Wildcat: 19 damaged
F4F-4 Wildcat: 1 destroyed on ground
P-47D2 Thunderbolt: 11 damaged
P-47D2 Thunderbolt: 2 destroyed on ground

24 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Japanese Ships
CA Kako
CA Furutaka
CA Kinugasa
CA Aoba
CL Natori
CL Sendai
DD Takakaze
DD Tadeyame
DD Kosugiri
DD Suresushio
DD Hayate
DD Kamikaze

Allied ground losses:
148 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 17 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 7 disabled

Airbase hits 10
Airbase supply hits 7
Runway hits 15
Port hits 24
Port supply hits 6

E7K2 Alf acting as spotter for CA Kako
55th Coastal Artillery Battalion firing at CA Kako
CA Kako firing at 55th Coastal Artillery Battalion
55th Coastal Artillery Battalion firing at CA Furutaka
CA Furutaka firing at 55th Coastal Artillery Battalion
CA Kinugasa firing at 55th Coastal Artillery Battalion
CA Aoba firing at 55th Coastal Artillery Battalion
CL Natori firing at Vava'u
E7K2 Alf acting as spotter for CL Sendai
CL Sendai firing at Vava'u
DD Takakaze firing at 55th Coastal Artillery Battalion
DD Tadeyame firing at Vava'u
DD Kosugiri firing at Vava'u
DD Suresushio firing at 55th Coastal Artillery Battalion
DD Hayate firing at Vava'u
DD Kamikaze firing at Vava'u

I'm surprised my 155mm coast artillery didn't make more of an impression, with him coming in close enough for destroyers to bombard. I'm getting a shipment of more artillery going on the way now. I've pulled out most of my planes. About 2/3 of them were still flyable, and I'm guessing the rest will be fixed up within a few days.

Looking at my 32 kt ships, I don't think he can make the run right from Suva, but has to start a few hexes south. Search planes didn't see anyone. I've got about 4 subs heading to the likely staging areas. Four squadrons of B-25s are set to naval attack, in case he gets careless setting these up. Most of these squadrons are fairly skilled in low level bombing, despite exp not being ultra-high.

Other than that, I'm getting the millstone slowly rolling towards the Colombo op. I may wind up using over eight divisions for this, plus lots of tanks and artillery. You'd think my armored battalions in mid-43 would be phasing out the Stuart for Shermans. My M-10 equipped TD units are probably the best AFVs in the game right now.

My bombers hit his guys leaving Jubbulpore.

quote:

Afternoon Air attack on 1st Tank Division, at 46,27 (Jubbulpore)

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 34 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17F Fortress x 8

No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
6 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x B-17F Fortress bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb

--------------------

Afternoon Air attack on 2nd Tank Division, at 46,27 (Jubbulpore)

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 44 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes

Allied aircraft
Liberator GR.III x 6
B-24D1 Liberator x 9

No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
9 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x Liberator GR.III bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 8 x 250 lb GP Bomb
9 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Also attacking 1st Tank Division ...
Also attacking 2nd Tank Division ...
Also attacking 1st Tank Division ...

--------------------

Afternoon Air attack on 7th Ind.Tank Brigade, at 46,27 (Jubbulpore)

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 49 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 18 minutes

Allied aircraft
Liberator II x 6
Wellington Ic x 8
B-17E Fortress x 9
B-24D1 Liberator x 9

Allied aircraft losses
Liberator II: 2 damaged
Wellington Ic: 1 destroyed by flak

Japanese ground losses:
69 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 7 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x Liberator II bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
2 x Wellington Ic bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
6 x Wellington Ic bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb
9 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
9 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 8 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Also attacking 2nd Tank Division ...
Also attacking Guards Tank Division ...
Also attacking 7th Ind.Tank Brigade ...
Also attacking 2nd Tank Division ...
Also attacking Guards Tank Division ...

---------------------------------------------

Afternoon Air attack on 7th Ind.Tank Brigade, at 46,27 (Jubbulpore)

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid spotted at 27 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-24D1 Liberator x 9
B-25C Mitchell x 12

Allied aircraft losses
B-24D1 Liberator: 1 damaged

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x B-24D1 Liberator bombing from 9000 feet
Ground Attack: 10 x 500 lb GP Bomb
12 x B-25C Mitchell bombing from 9000 feet *
Ground Attack: 3 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Not very spectacular. I've set my LRP brigades there to attack, hoping he has his troops in travel mode.

I've broken up my one division in Karachi to deal with the garrison issues I'm having out east north of Delhi.

< Message edited by Mundy -- 7/11/2015 7:03:32 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1054

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/12/2015 11:38:08 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

13 July 1943

It's mostly been quiet. CF did a sweep at Vava'u.

quote:

Morning Air attack on Vava'u , at 141,165

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid detected at 24 NM, estimated altitude 34,800 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 36

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 24
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 13

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-39D Airacobra: 3 destroyed
P-47D2 Thunderbolt: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
27 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 33800 feet *

CAP engaged:
15th FG/46th FS with P-39D Airacobra (0 airborne, 10 on standby, 11 scrambling)
10 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 3 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 10000 and 28440.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 15 minutes
348th FG/342nd FS with P-47D2 Thunderbolt (0 airborne, 10 on standby, 0 scrambling)
10 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 3 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 33000 and 37200.
Raid is overhead

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Vava'u , at 141,165

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid detected at 193 NM, estimated altitude 34,800 feet.
Estimated time to target is 57 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1-J George x 4

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 7
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 4

Japanese aircraft losses
N1K1-J George: 1 destroyed

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
1 x N1K1-J George sweeping at 33800 feet *

CAP engaged:
15th FG/46th FS with P-39D Airacobra (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
7 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 28440 and 34440.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 57 minutes
348th FG/342nd FS with P-47D2 Thunderbolt (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 27440 and 37800.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 42 minutes

The intel summary screen lists 9 Georges and 9 Cobras down as well as 3 Jugs. The P-47s are CAPping at max altitude next turn. If he wants to play in the thin air, he's going to get burned as the Jugs maneuver rating trumps his at extreme heights.

I have tons of troops loading up at Pearl and Christmas to send to Cape Town. I'm also rounding up a few US divisions up in Australia. I should have over 8 when I finally pull the trigger on this. I'm also going to dump a ton of paras on Ceylon's interior hexes. A bunch of C-47 squadrons are making way to East US for shipment overseas. I already have a bunch of transports in India, so I should have plenty ready do dump everybody when the time comes. I'm looking at probably 4-5 battleships involved in this. I'll also swamp the area with minesweepers, just in case. Ed Doctrine is very thorough when it comes to amphibious landings, and it's stood me in good stead in prior games. I have many, many CB, maintenance, naval shore and engineering units also bound for Ceylon, which will be part of the second lift. I want bases up and running quickly and plenty of naval support to speed up ship unloading.

_____________________________

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1055

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/13/2015 7:46:08 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

14 July 1943

More quietness.

I'll be sending another big load of troops from Pearl next turn.

I did some rearranging of the fighter squadrons amongst the Pago bases. I was letting them build up at a few. Some recon B-25s arrived from Xmas island to Savaii, and I've got them set to look at Suva. The monkey says that the IJA 35th Division is planning for Auckland. I have lots of planes there, so I'll look at moving them to the inland bases I've been developing for last few months. I can't seem to deter bombardments anyway.

Over the next three weeks, about 400k in supply is enroute to India from Cape Town. I hope this makes a difference. Unless the inland bases at the tip of India start getting stuff, I'll probably end up running the paras out of Madras when D-Day comes. I haven't really been keeping strict count, but I have 2-2/3 Indian divisions prepping for Colombo at Bombay. I know I dedicated a UK division there too. Combined, I'll probably have a regiment's worth of paras doing this. I should have enough muscle. I want to keep my ship arrivals to India quiet when they come. I'll set up some dummy TFs at Bombay to see if they get spotted. I'm more worried about a sub encounter giving the thing away. So far, he's been keeping them due west of Karachi, near the map edge where the off map stuff comes in. His sub activity overall has been rather lame. A pack of them were near Auckland, but I've severely beaten them away. I wish I had some hedgehog equipped ships there.

I'm moving some xAKLs to Pago Pago, since it's been getting big enough where I can use it as a supply hub to the other 4-5 bases I have in the area.

_____________________________

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1056

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/15/2015 10:12:11 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

19 July 1943

The great shuffle.

A USA Army division arrived in East US from the west, along with about 15 assorted Seabee and base support forces. Lots of clicks later, I got them shipped to Cape Town.

I noticed one of my Airacobra squadrons on Ta'u upgraded to P-39Ns. I'm not sure I like this plane, as its normal range is 2, with extended at 3. 4/5 with tanks. That'll probably be a pure CAP squadron. I think even Spitfires are better than that.

I bagged a little tanker north of Koumac.

quote:

Sub attack near Belep Islands at 112,153

Japanese Ships
TK Komaki Maru, Torpedo hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
PC Take

Allied Ships
SS Scorpion

SS Scorpion launches 4 torpedoes at TK Komaki Maru
Scorpion diving deep ....
PC Take fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Take fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Take fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Take fails to find sub, continues to search...
PC Take fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub

I got another near Borneo a few days ago. Every little bit helps, I guess.

My test SCTF at Bombay is still unsighted after three days, which is good news. I'm sure he could reach it if he dedicated something to that, being 24 hexes from Colombo. I can probably be confident when all my invasion shipping arrives, they'll be unnoticed. Either way, I'll send them in from the NW to be safe.

All my fleet carriers, barring Hornet are in Panama. I'm getting through minor repairs before sending them across. A new P-40N squadron at Cape Town, (one of three there) is fully stocked up, so I'm shipping them across on a 24 kt xAP. Soldiers and Marines arrived at Melbourne, and they'll be going to Bombay via Cape Town. I'm probably looking at five weeks before the pieces all arrive, at the minimum.

_____________________________

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1057

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/16/2015 12:41:32 AM

Sangeli

Posts: 1132
Joined: 3/29/2012
From: San Francisco
Status: offline

I would not bring my CVs to Bombay if I were you. Best chance you have with this Ceylon invasion is keeping the fact you brought your CVs here as quiet as possible. If the Japanese see you brought USN CVs, then you could very well fall into a KB trap. If it were me, I'd leave the CVs off map in Cape Town until you are actually ready to invade. In general I think you need to be more careful about only pulling forward invasion assets when you need them rather than leaving them in their stage areas indefinitely (like you did with Perth).

Also, if you don't like the P-39N why are you using it? You have like 250+ P-40Ks IIRC.

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1058

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/16/2015 1:14:14 AM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

It was one of the few squadrons I had set to update. Normally I've shut them off. Probably missed a couple. I didn't know Ns were in the pool already. The P-40N pool is filling, which is big. They have a tanked range of 8, the best of all of them.

I'll probably stage all the follow-on support troops at Karachi. I want them fairly quickly on the beach after Colombo falls. To be honest, most of his bases in India proper may struggle to lend air support to Ceylon, given their distances. The nearest could be Vizagapatnam, which is 19 hexes away. Not sure how much he's developed that one.

I don't think I want to hole up at Cape Town. That would put them on top of Diego Garcia when they arrive on-map and give the whole thing away pretty quickly. I'll probably send them to Karachi. If KB suddenly showed, I could get them to Abadan in a blink. I'll need a lesser traveled route there, as he's had a sub lurking near the northern map edge. Approach from the SW.

As it stands right now, I don't know if he would send KB west. That's quite a hike from the areas he's been supporting. He had to have seen my earlier aborted attempt at Baker, so he has to know if I can confirm KB out west, I'll start jumping on his eastern holdings...if I have any transports left over there anyway.

By the time this kicks off, I should have 3 fleet carriers and 5 light carriers. Add to that another 4 or so CVEs which will ride with the invaders. Naval air and probably a few hundred long range heavy bombers will kick the whole thing off. I'm hauling freight like anything to help keep the basing issues at a minimum. The next three weeks should see 400k in supply arriving at Karachi. I'll probably have to use Madras for a lot of it, as it's always kept a healthy supply level, but they'll only transfer there at the last moment. I'll probably have about 15 or more C-47 squadrons to drop all my paras, too.

_____________________________

(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 1059

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/19/2015 10:05:17 PM

Mundy

Posts: 2869
Joined: 6/26/2002
From: Neenah
Status: offline

23 July 1943

Trading Shots.

CF has been probing air bases in India, forcing me to get fighters there. They probably should have been there from the start, but when it's quiet... 3 40K squadrons are there now, but this was probably a one a done. I'm guessing Cochin will be next, but I have like 14 supplies there.

quote:

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 118 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 37 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-IIb Oscar x 42
Ki-49-IIa Helen x 26

Allied aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-49-IIa Helen: 5 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
B-17E Fortress: 2 damaged
B-24D1 Liberator: 5 damaged
B-25D1 Mitchell: 2 damaged

Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 8

Aircraft Attacking:
26 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 13000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on Bangalore , at 32,37

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 61 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 19 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-49-IIa Helen x 60

Allied aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-49-IIa Helen: 2 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
B-24D1 Liberator: 39 damaged
B-24D1 Liberator: 2 destroyed on ground
B-25D1 Mitchell: 13 damaged

Airbase hits 15
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 24

Aircraft Attacking:
30 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 13000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb
30 x Ki-49-IIa Helen bombing from 13000 feet
Airfield Attack: 4 x 250 kg GP Bomb

Supply in India is getting pretty dry. I'm at 40k at Bombay, but that still puts them in the red. I hope there's a big stockpile on Ceylon if/when I take it, as supplying it will be difficult. I'm wondering if it would help if I shut down all building there. Everything's probably big enough to use anyway right now.

I took a shot at some ships at Lord Howe from Brisbane. Figures the SBDs didn't want to cooperate. Better luck with the B-25s. Funny how I took P-38 losses, but the Jugs came out clean again.

quote:

Morning Air attack on TF, near Lord Howe Island at 100,169

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 39 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 14 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 54
Ki-45 KAIa Nick x 34

Allied aircraft
SBD-5 Dauntless x 18

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
SBD-5 Dauntless: 13 destroyed

CAP engaged:
Soryu-1 with A6M5 Zero (23 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(27 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
23 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 4 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 22 minutes
Hiryu-1 with A6M5 Zero (23 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(27 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
23 plane(s) intercepting now.
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 4 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 22 minutes
264th Sentai with Ki-45 KAIa Nick (18 airborne, 16 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(18 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
18 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 12000 , scrambling fighters between 5000 and 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 21 minutes

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on TF, near Lord Howe Island at 100,169

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 36 NM, estimated altitude 2,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 52
Ki-45 KAIa Nick x 34

Allied aircraft
B-25D1 Mitchell x 10

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
B-25D1 Mitchell: 5 destroyed

CAP engaged:
Soryu-1 with A6M5 Zero (19 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
19 plane(s) intercepting now.
7 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 10000 and 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 44 minutes
264th Sentai with Ki-45 KAIa Nick (7 airborne, 16 on standby, 0 scrambling)
7 plane(s) intercepting now.
11 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 12000 , scrambling fighters between 2000 and 12000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 39 minutes
Hiryu-1 with A6M5 Zero (22 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
22 plane(s) intercepting now.
4 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 17 minutes

---------------------------------------------

Morning Air attack on TF, near Lord Howe Island at 100,169

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 27 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 46
Ki-45 KAIa Nick x 31

Allied aircraft
B-25D1 Mitchell x 12
P-38H Lightning x 17
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 12

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 2 destroyed
Ki-45 KAIa Nick: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
B-25D1 Mitchell: 3 destroyed, 5 damaged
B-25D1 Mitchell: 1 destroyed by flak
P-38H Lightning: 3 destroyed

Japanese Ships
xAK Yuri Maru, Bomb hits 1
xAK Syunsei Maru
xAK Kiyo Maru, Bomb hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x B-25D1 Mitchell bombing and strafing from low level
Naval Attack: 6 x 500 lb SAP Bomb

CAP engaged:
Soryu-1 with A6M5 Zero (9 airborne, 0 on standby, 7 scrambling)
9 plane(s) intercepting now.
5 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 1000 and 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 39 minutes
6 planes vectored on to bombers
264th Sentai with Ki-45 KAIa Nick (8 airborne, 4 on standby, 7 scrambling)
8 plane(s) intercepting now.
12 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 12000 , scrambling fighters between 1000 and 31190.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 53 minutes
9 planes vectored on to bombers
Hiryu-1 with A6M5 Zero (13 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
13 plane(s) intercepting now.
12 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 1000 and 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 69 minutes
8 planes vectored on to bombers

Looking at the Panama to Cape Town transit time: Fast carriers will make it in about 21 days. About a month for slower stuff. I'm probably looking at 3 months just to get the pieces in place. A few divisions are enroute to Cape Town from Melbourne. Americal and one of the twenty-something-ith Divisions, plus Paras, Commandos and tanks. A CVL and an Essex (Wasp) will arrive within three days. Hornet's still healing at a very slow rate. I'm guessing two months before I can simply move her. No IJN subs near New Zealand lately, since I've whacked them. I'll have like 8 DDs ready when I finally move her.

_____________________________

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1060

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/20/2015 7:33:14 PM

Sangeli

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy

Supply in India is getting pretty dry. I'm at 40k at Bombay, but that still puts them in the red. I hope there's a big stockpile on Ceylon if/when I take it, as supplying it will be difficult. I'm wondering if it would help if I shut down all building there. Everything's probably big enough to use anyway right now.

If you don't have good supply here then an invasion is completely out of the question. Really until you get this supply situation sorted out you are stuck in India.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
I took a shot at some ships at Lord Howe from Brisbane. Figures the SBDs didn't want to cooperate. Better luck with the B-25s. Funny how I took P-38 losses, but the Jugs came out clean again.

These are the sort of attritional battles that are preventing you from building up your strength to match Japan. You need to stop with "taking shots" and instead focus on conducting operations. Operations consist of tactical battles that help achieve a larger goal. What's the goal here? Sinking a few cargo ships? You need plans with substance. Trying to sink a few AK is not a worthy operational goal.

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1061

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/21/2015 8:39:03 PM

Mundy

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From: Neenah
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26 July 1943

Japan decided to take Norfolk Island between Noumea and New Zealand. That pretty much means that the spotlight will be on Hornet when I decide to get her out of there. I'll let her get as much healed up as possible, so I have some speed when the time comes.

Apart from Hornet, I now have three Essex CVs as well as three CVLs. All the new ones enroute to Cape Town. I'll probably make sure Victorious is ready and present when things kick off. She's in the yard for another 42 days at Pearl. More time to build up.

An S boat sighted Kongo and some destroyers about four hexes west of Noumea, apparently headed west. All transport shipping in Sydney is evacuating to Melbourne. Two USN CAs and 8 DDs will remain there. I've put top notch captains and an admiral on everyone. 8 inch guns will punch the Kongos at close range, plus maybe better torps will help. If it's just her and the destroyers, I'm willing to take that on. I could always wound them enough for the planes to make a difference.

I think all my intended ground troops are finally enroute for Cape Town. Looking at about a month before all the pieces arrive, not counting the RN CV. I'll see about CV-8's condition, and consider waiting for her to join in. I'm in no particular hurry and want to do this right. Some 200+ Hellcats and the like covering the invasion is a nice security blanket.

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Post #: 1062

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/21/2015 11:40:44 PM

Mundy

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From: Neenah
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27 July 1943

Not much to add. KB is sighted about 8 hexes ENE of Lord Howe. It may get dangerous for him if he's thinking about raiding the Australian coast. May.

A third turn today. CF's staying up pretty late.

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Post #: 1063

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 1:47:25 AM

Sangeli

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You have a lot more confidence in USN CAs than I do. I have had major issues with them in combat. At this point I pretty much avoid naval combat with them except under the most favorable odds. Without torpedoes they lack teeth compared to the Japanese cruisers.

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Post #: 1064

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 4:03:52 AM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

You have a lot more confidence in USN CAs than I do. I have had major issues with them in combat. At this point I pretty much avoid naval combat with them except under the most favorable odds. Without torpedoes they lack teeth compared to the Japanese cruisers.

I have had them perform well after:
- they get really good commanders - 60+ Naval, 50+ Aggression
- the TF gets a really good commander - high leadership, high naval

- they have some battle experience to raise crew experience to 60 or higher for the battle type (day/night)
- they have radar, especially after they get SG radar (NOT a reference to Cap Mandrake's Significant Other)

- the TF size is 6-9 ships, preferably 3 cruisers and 5 or 6 DDs
- the engagement doesn't open at point blank torpedo range

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(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 1065

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 4:18:06 AM

Capt. Harlock

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quote:

You have a lot more confidence in USN CAs than I do. I have had major issues with them in combat. At this point I pretty much avoid naval combat with them except under the most favorable odds. Without torpedoes they lack teeth compared to the Japanese cruisers.

IMHO the destroyers backing up the cruisers are equally important. If Mundy has Fletcher-class DD's, they can pose a serious threat to the IJN from late '43 on.

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Post #: 1066

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 12:24:36 PM

Mundy

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The commander and probably 2/3 of the ship captains are 70+ Nav, with the rest in the 60s. My captain's pool seems well stocked at this point.

Kongos, to me, have always seemed a mediocre ship. Nice fast escorts for carriers, but no match for a real battleship. In a prior game, Prince of Wales raked Haruna over good on Dec 8. Inside 3,000 yds, I've seen 8" shells punch holes in the hull. I have raked them over with cruisers before, though I did have more at the time. That battleship in Sydney's drydock would be very welcome right now, but her upgrade is a pretty big one.

I have 8 destroyers with the two cruisers, so I'm hoping they'll add up. Outnumbering any IJN destroyers is a bonus, I figure. I didn't survey the classes I have there, so I'll update later. I think most of my Fletchers were stateside, at Pearl, or enroute to Cape Town. I figure at this point, they have half a chance of doing torpedo damage. The big "if" is getting the hit in the first place. My subs have been sloppy lately too, missing freighters quite a bit.

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Post #: 1067

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 4:26:34 PM

Sangeli

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock
IMHO the destroyers backing up the cruisers are equally important. If Mundy has Fletcher-class DD's, they can pose a serious threat to the IJN from late '43 on.

I will not deny the power of the Fletcher class DD's. That being said, from what I have seen Fletchers do better in their own TFs than they do when paired with cruisers. As a result I only use lesser DDs to escort my cruisers whose primary job is to simply protect the cruisers from submarines.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
Kongos, to me, have always seemed a mediocre ship. Nice fast escorts for carriers, but no match for a real battleship. In a prior game, Prince of Wales raked Haruna over good on Dec 8. Inside 3,000 yds, I've seen 8" shells punch holes in the hull. I have raked them over with cruisers before, though I did have more at the time. That battleship in Sydney's drydock would be very welcome right now, but her upgrade is a pretty big one.

I did not think 8 inch shells could punch hulls through the hull of a Kongo at any range! Granted I can't remember how good their belt armor is. That being said, I still don't think USN CA vs Kongo BBs is a great match up. Kongo is almost as fast, has more armor, and much bigger guns. On the other hand, a large Fletcher TF sounds like it would be a better match up. At any range those torpedoes will do some serious damage to the Kongo. And if things go poorly they can disengage easier with superior speed. One need look no further than Lowpe's AAR to see this in action when a Fletcher TF managed to sink the BB Yamato in a surface engagement. And on the other side, I'm unaware of any battles in any AAR where a pair of USN CAs has sunk a combat ready Japanese BB. If someone has an example I'd definitely like to see it.

(in reply to Capt. Harlock)

Post #: 1068

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 6:56:48 PM

JocMeister

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

You have a lot more confidence in USN CAs than I do. I have had major issues with them in combat. At this point I pretty much avoid naval combat with them except under the most favorable odds. Without torpedoes they lack teeth compared to the Japanese cruisers.

I second this. US CAs have always performed abysmal for me. I try to avoid using them in SCTFs. Better to use Fletchers, Clevelands or British CAs.

(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 1069

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 7:46:41 PM

Mundy

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28 July 1943

Not watching what I'm doing.

KB and the surface stuff are a hex away from Lord Howe, with an apparent western setting.

You know when you create a task force after the first, and, by default, they get the same course setting? Happened to me. The surface forces I set up at Sydney are now sitting at Melbourne.

Hopefully I can get them back and not get attacked doing it.

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Post #: 1070

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 8:07:46 PM

Sangeli

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
The surface forces I set up at Sydney are now sitting at Melbourne.

Hopefully I can get them back and not get attacked doing it.

Seriously, don't you think that you are better off not attacking a FAR superior force? If the goal is to get the KB to attack a heavily LRCAPed fleet there are better ways to do that than putting out your cruisers and destroyers on a limb like that. But if you are aiming to engage the Japanese fleet in surface combat then your plan is suicide. Maybe you get lucky and it turns out alright but you need a LOT of help from things you have no control over like weather.

(in reply to Mundy)

Post #: 1071

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 8:18:43 PM

jwolf

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Is there a way to prevent a massive bombardment of Sydney?

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Post #: 1072

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 8:47:56 PM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
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From: Winnipeg, MB
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

quote:

ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock
IMHO the destroyers backing up the cruisers are equally important. If Mundy has Fletcher-class DD's, they can pose a serious threat to the IJN from late '43 on.

I will not deny the power of the Fletcher class DD's. That being said, from what I have seen Fletchers do better in their own TFs than they do when paired with cruisers. As a result I only use lesser DDs to escort my cruisers whose primary job is to simply protect the cruisers from submarines.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
Kongos, to me, have always seemed a mediocre ship. Nice fast escorts for carriers, but no match for a real battleship. In a prior game, Prince of Wales raked Haruna over good on Dec 8. Inside 3,000 yds, I've seen 8" shells punch holes in the hull. I have raked them over with cruisers before, though I did have more at the time. That battleship in Sydney's drydock would be very welcome right now, but her upgrade is a pretty big one.

I did not think 8 inch shells could punch hulls through the hull of a Kongo at any range! Granted I can't remember how good their belt armor is. That being said, I still don't think USN CA vs Kongo BBs is a great match up. Kongo is almost as fast, has more armor, and much bigger guns. On the other hand, a large Fletcher TF sounds like it would be a better match up. At any range those torpedoes will do some serious damage to the Kongo. And if things go poorly they can disengage easier with superior speed. One need look no further than Lowpe's AAR to see this in action when a Fletcher TF managed to sink the BB Yamato in a surface engagement. And on the other side, I'm unaware of any battles in any AAR where a pair of USN CAs has sunk a combat ready Japanese BB. If someone has an example I'd definitely like to see it.

Not quite sunk, but disabled to the point of impotence - the RL 1st Naval Battle of Guadalcanal, in which CA San Francisco + another (Portland?) knocked out Hiei's steering and started fires which were added to by the DDs 5" guns. The steering compartment was flooded and although the Hiei's crew tried desperately to patch and pump, they were frustrated by bombers from Guadalcanal and ended up scuttling the BB. See CombinedFleet.com for the detailed account.

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(in reply to Sangeli)

Post #: 1073

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 9:37:20 PM

witpqs

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From: Argleton
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

quote:

ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock
IMHO the destroyers backing up the cruisers are equally important. If Mundy has Fletcher-class DD's, they can pose a serious threat to the IJN from late '43 on.

I will not deny the power of the Fletcher class DD's. That being said, from what I have seen Fletchers do better in their own TFs than they do when paired with cruisers. As a result I only use lesser DDs to escort my cruisers whose primary job is to simply protect the cruisers from submarines.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mundy
Kongos, to me, have always seemed a mediocre ship. Nice fast escorts for carriers, but no match for a real battleship. In a prior game, Prince of Wales raked Haruna over good on Dec 8. Inside 3,000 yds, I've seen 8" shells punch holes in the hull. I have raked them over with cruisers before, though I did have more at the time. That battleship in Sydney's drydock would be very welcome right now, but her upgrade is a pretty big one.

I did not think 8 inch shells could punch hulls through the hull of a Kongo at any range! Granted I can't remember how good their belt armor is. That being said, I still don't think USN CA vs Kongo BBs is a great match up. Kongo is almost as fast, has more armor, and much bigger guns. On the other hand, a large Fletcher TF sounds like it would be a better match up. At any range those torpedoes will do some serious damage to the Kongo. And if things go poorly they can disengage easier with superior speed. One need look no further than Lowpe's AAR to see this in action when a Fletcher TF managed to sink the BB Yamato in a surface engagement. And on the other side, I'm unaware of any battles in any AAR where a pair of USN CAs has sunk a combat ready Japanese BB. If someone has an example I'd definitely like to see it.

Not quite sunk, but disabled to the point of impotence - the RL 1st Naval Battle of Guadalcanal, in which CA San Francisco + another (Portland?) knocked out Hiei's steering and started fires which were added to by the DDs 5" guns. The steering compartment was flooded and although the Hiei's crew tried desperately to patch and pump, they were frustrated by bombers from Guadalcanal and ended up scuttling the BB. See CombinedFleet.com for the detailed account.

Basically, a portion of the projectile's kinetic energy is often turned into heat upon impact, partly sort of melting its way through. If the velocity is high enough (with a projectile of enough mass) then even an 8" round could (and did) punch through battleship armor. The trick was very, very close range. Everything else matters, too, but to have a chance the range had to be as short as possible so the projectile was as close to its maximum velocity (basically muzzle velocity) as possible.

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Post #: 1074

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 10:45:02 PM

Sangeli

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From: San Francisco
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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs
Basically, a portion of the projectile's kinetic energy is often turned into heat upon impact, partly sort of melting its way through. If the velocity is high enough (with a projectile of enough mass) then even an 8" round could (and did) punch through battleship armor. The trick was very, very close range. Everything else matters, too, but to have a chance the range had to be as short as possible so the projectile was as close to its maximum velocity (basically muzzle velocity) as possible.

Oh yes, I understand the real life physics behind this. But is this modeled in the game? As in, can anyone post a combat report of USN CAs sinking a BB? Or at least heavy fires/heavy damage?

(in reply to witpqs)

Post #: 1075

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 10:49:41 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

Basically, a portion of the projectile's kinetic energy is often turned into heat upon impact, partly sort of melting its way through. If the velocity is high enough (with a projectile of enough mass) then even an 8" round could (and did) punch through battleship armor. The trick was very, very close range. Everything else matters, too, but to have a chance the range had to be as short as possible so the projectile was as close to its maximum velocity (basically muzzle velocity) as possible.

MV plus a good angle of impact, virtually 90� to the armour face. The USN also had a "super heavy" 8" AP shell that weighed a whopping 355 lbs., compared to around 250 lbs. for those in most other navies (42% heavier). I am unsure whether the shell was used at Guadalcanal.

Another factor may have been the quality of the Japanese armour. The British built BC Kongo for the IJN in WW I and the Japanese then proceeded to copy the design and build the other three of the class. I doubt the British shared the secrets of making good armour and this was the IJNs first go at making armour that thick. At any rate, it was only designed to stop WW I era Armoured Cruiser shells (which did not have the MV of the later models of 8" guns developed post-war).

The Germans got a similar wake-up call at the Battle of the River Plate when British AP shells went through Graf Spee's 5" armour belt. It may not have been heavy but the British AP shell had an excellent cap design for boring through once the surface hardness was cracked.

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(in reply to witpqs)

Post #: 1076

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 10:54:16 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sangeli

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs
Basically, a portion of the projectile's kinetic energy is often turned into heat upon impact, partly sort of melting its way through. If the velocity is high enough (with a projectile of enough mass) then even an 8" round could (and did) punch through battleship armor. The trick was very, very close range. Everything else matters, too, but to have a chance the range had to be as short as possible so the projectile was as close to its maximum velocity (basically muzzle velocity) as possible.

Oh yes, I understand the real life physics behind this. But is this modeled in the game? As in, can anyone post a combat report of USN CAs sinking a BB? Or at least heavy fires/heavy damage?

As was mentioned, I also have seen 8" shell penetrations of Kongo Class BB armour at close range causing significant damage, but inevitably there are too many other ships in the IJN TFs for the Allied CAs to keep the hits coming and wreck the ship. The potential is there though, if an IJN player foolishly sent a Kongo BB home for upgrade with only a couple of DDs to keep it company. Stranger things have happened.

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Post #: 1077

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 10:59:27 PM

witpqs

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They don't call him BBFanboy for nothing!

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Post #: 1078

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/22/2015 11:12:58 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

They don't call him BBFanboy for nothing!

Does it show??

Hijack now off thanks for your patience ....

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(in reply to witpqs)

Post #: 1079

RE: Too much Iron in my Diet - Mundy vs Cannonfodder - 7/23/2015 1:53:11 AM

witpqs

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

They don't call him BBFanboy for nothing!

Does it show??

Hijack now off thanks for your patience ....

"And our humble purveyor of ballistic knowledge disappears into the crowd... until next time!"

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