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Space Combat - 8/23/2014 4:31:44 PM

Stevechase

Posts: 161
Joined: 10/5/2013
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So I have logged 126 hrs on with Distant Worlds Universe. Most of the experience is very good. The various x's are handled well, except for space combat. Unless I am doing something wrong or have some settings that need adjustment, space combat is...well...boring as hell and meaningless. Once my fleet reaches another fleet they enter mix, and trade shots till there is nothing left. Ships really don't do any maneuvering, and there is no use of tactics. Anyway this has been my experience. Am I missing something. I do like the game for sure, but just seems space combat is missing something, then again it could be me and my approach to space combat or expectation.

< Message edited by Stevechase -- 8/23/2014 5:40:48 PM >

Post #: 1

RE: Space Combat - 8/23/2014 10:13:18 PM

Hikikomori

Posts: 62
Joined: 8/16/2014
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The space battle tactics, or better strategies are played out on a larger more abstract level.
Placement, composition, amount and stance(if automated/semiautomated), as well as equipment are your main influence points, there is not much more beside that i am afraid. DW is more of a grand strategy game in that respect.
Fleets are more of an empire wide resource that needs distribution and care, then a tactical tool that requires micromanaging.

You can - in the design menu - choose between several behaviours, as which to behave when facing a weaker, stronger opponent, when to flee and the like. Apart from that you are of course able to micromanage your fleet, which will mainly be positioning and focus fire adjustments.

The AI is nilliwilli about their designs. I recommend you give the AI-Mod, and there preferably the extended version incorporating the DWU: Extended Mod from haree a try. This will cause the ai to be, among other things, be more focussed on their weaponry of choice, making them stronger, and adding to the depth of your strategic gameplay with the arising need(if you do not play on a sissy-difficulty

) to adjust your designs accordingly to your enemies.

Otherwise its pretty much rightclick of doom.

< Message edited by Hikikomori -- 8/23/2014 11:28:03 PM >

(in reply to Stevechase)

Post #: 2

RE: Space Combat - 8/23/2014 10:23:29 PM

Max 86

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Joined: 11/6/2007
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I can't disagree with anything you said for the most part. I think DW basic combat philosophy is whoever gets there "first with the most" usually has the advantage.

It would be nice to have fleet tactical options with some kind of simple "rock, paper, scissors" matrix that decides which fleet has an advantage in an engagement. But since there is no control of the ships during battle there really is only do much that could be done.

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Post #: 3

RE: Space Combat - 8/23/2014 11:20:36 PM

fruitgnome

Posts: 186
Joined: 6/4/2014
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You can:
- attack from several sides
- you can flee and reattack
- you can kite other ships with faster ones
- you can build somethimg like a tank and many little ships wirth firepower
- you can micromanage let your ships with little shields left fly behind your other ships

(in reply to Max 86)

Post #: 4

RE: Space Combat - 8/25/2014 7:30:50 PM

Fishers of Men

Posts: 329
Joined: 3/27/2010
From: Fishers, IN USA
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The combat design is not like MOo2 with you and the enemy ships lined up in neat rows, or like MOo3 with three levels of picket ships circling a core of capital ships. It is definitely a large melee with ships firing in all directions.

I micromanage some of this combat by clicking on several ships and ganging up on a single target, like a certain base, a very dangerous enemy ship, or enemy troop transports.

Superior tech and numbers wins over local battle tactics most of the time.

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RE: Space Combat - 8/25/2014 9:03:41 PM

Retreat1970

Posts: 948
Joined: 11/6/2013
From: Wisconsin
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Basically what you would like is fleet formations ala space empires. Neat idea. I would like it.

(in reply to Fishers of Men)

Post #: 6

RE: Space Combat - 8/26/2014 2:20:08 AM

corwin90

Posts: 48
Joined: 7/14/2014
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I think the space combat is significantly better than a number of the space 4X games I've played. That being said, I definitely wish I had more control over certain aspects of combat. For example, using torpedo ships, I find it extremely difficult to tell those ships to warp in at maximum range and begin firing on the enemy. I wish there were the ability--such as fleet formation (as mentioned above) that would instruct my fleet for warp in with my "tanks" right on top of the target and my ranged ships well back from them.

(in reply to Retreat1970)

Post #: 7

RE: Space Combat - 8/26/2014 6:18:59 AM

Antarian

Posts: 137
Joined: 1/3/2014
From: Victoria, Canada
Status: offline

Try a ship design with all long range weapons (or mostly so) and set it in design screen to standoff, standoff.

These ships will constantly maneuver to try to get distance between themselves and the enemy target. This will usually be very beneficial in a fleet battle, as it draws the enemy out of their tight defensive clusters and opens up the battle. I've seen great success with it, and it is also a much better way to deal with annoying pests like space scorpions.

But the long and the short of it, if you want a real fleet battle experience, with tactics, you have to manually maneuver the ships yourself.

Like coming in to a heavy defended system. Do NOT just order your fleet to jump in on the enemy, they will come in all scattered, right on top of the defenses , and get picked to pieces.

Have smaller fleets, task forces I call them, hop in to different locations, like near a nearby gas giant. Have some fleets hit mining stations in the system to draw off the defenders.

Have a smash fleet ready to go in against the starbase.

Maneuver your ships by ordering groups to specific points, just in their weapons range, and concentrate fire.

It's micro-management hell, but hey, nobody ever said being a Star Lord was going to be easy ;)

< Message edited by Antarian -- 8/26/2014 7:19:19 AM >

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RE: Space Combat - 8/26/2014 7:37:23 AM

fruitgnome

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Joined: 6/4/2014
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quote:

ORIGINAL: corwin90

... I wish there were the ability--such as fleet formation (as mentioned above) that would instruct my fleet for warp in with my "tanks" right on top of the target and my ranged ships well back from them.

This would be very nice.

(in reply to corwin90)

Post #: 9

RE: Space Combat - 8/27/2014 7:48:42 PM

llanite_slith

Posts: 45
Joined: 10/23/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fruitgnome

quote:

ORIGINAL: corwin90

... I wish there were the ability--such as fleet formation (as mentioned above) that would instruct my fleet for warp in with my "tanks" right on top of the target and my ranged ships well back from them.

This would be very nice.

So if you design a combined arms fleet you can see this. I recently proved it to myself by building a "gunboat" design with all beams set to point blank/point blank and a "missile cruiser" design set to "stand off" armed with missiles. With a mixed squadron of these I assaulted a local pirate star base and watched in horror as we trounced the local defenses and destroyed our target, only to have 80% of my gunboat assets destroyed in the starbase's explosion - all my missile boats survived only by virtue of their stand-off status, as both ships were essentially the same design except for their weapon load-outs.

I think people don't play around enough with this.

It would be interesting to see a mod with longer missile ranges to really separate the forces a bit more and interesting tactics around stand-off vs. close-in weapons design. Of course, this would also require custom ship designs for the AI, but notionally this seems doable?

(in reply to fruitgnome)

Post #: 10

RE: Space Combat - 8/27/2014 8:07:51 PM

fruitgnome

Posts: 186
Joined: 6/4/2014
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Cool, I will try it, with the range weapon settings. THX

(in reply to llanite_slith)

Post #: 11

RE: Space Combat - 8/27/2014 8:21:20 PM

Hikikomori

Posts: 62
Joined: 8/16/2014
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I had great success with mixed fleets.

Heavy protected, fast shortrange escorts. Not much damage, especially when you choose to have tractors or pods on them. Point blank, no matter if the target is weaker or stronger.

Missile or Torpedo frigates, relatively weak protected, still rather fast but not that much. Heavy damage and maybe now a tractor for keeping pests away. Standoff/standoff

Carriers, evade or standoff, with torpedo bombers to rip apart from afar any target.

Fly in, a little off target, move in, focus fire the first few ships, lean back and watch the slaughter.

When i fly to attack a heavy target or a enemy fleet is on a vector in, i always queue a few escorts. They are going to suffer.