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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> Mid-February Update

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Mid-February Update - 1/22/2015 9:23:33 PM

jimh009

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Joined: 5/15/2005
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No big surprises so far.

Overall Play of the AI

About as expected. I'm not standing in its way, so it is methodically advancing. No big thrusts yet, although something is brewing in the Central Pacific. The AI did launch a few small SCTF raids, that I let pass unmolested.

Basically, I'm just waiting for the AI to get done with its advances and set up its defensive position. Figure that will take many more months yet.

China

A "sitzkreig" has for the most part developed in China. I have a solid line that runs from Liuchow - Changsha - Chengteh - Ichang - Loyang. AI isn't really advancing on it - more like doing a few "probes."

The one exception is the accidental wrench I threw into the AI's plans at Wenchow. The AI continues to beat its head against the wall there, doing several bombardments turns followed by a deliberate attack. It is using 3 ID's. If I hadn't moved into the other two ID's at the beginning of the game, I'm sure the AI would have taken Wenchow by now. But alas...it seems not to be. Since Wenchow creates its own supply, I'm beginning to wonder if/when the AI will take it.

Philippines

On the other hand, I gave an accidental gift to the AI in the Philippines. Due to all the forces from Clark Field retreating into Bataan and destroying the supply situation, Bataan fell in record time. The AI - with just 15,000 troops and needing only three deliberate attacks to do it - took Bataan on January 31st. So, I taketh away from the AI and China and giveth to the AI in Bataan. Seems like a fair trade.

DEI

The DEI has been pounded every turn by land and carrier aircraft. However, the AI lost the CVL Zuiho. The turn before Singapore fell (which fell on Jan. 21st), I moved over two torpedo squadrons and two fighter squadrons to Batavia. The AI hadn't bombed Signapore much, so the air groups were in good condition. Anyways, the Zuiho just got unlucky and took three torps. Despite all the attacks over two weeks that the Allied torpedo planes launched, the Zuiho was the only ship that took a hit.

Of course, no complaints on my end.

I am using the Dutch PT boats a bit. They've done two raids and taken a few transports, but nothing earth shattering. But they are pretty much out of the game now.

The Hiryu took a torpedo hit from a Dutch Sub, but apparently the damage was only minor. Still, a hole is a hole is a hole.

Japanse forces have invaded Java in three places, but have yet to land enough forces there to dislodge Dutch forces in Batavia, Soerbaja and elsewhere. Right now, the landings are just preliminary it seems.

Elsewhere in the DEI and Borneo, Japan has taken all major bases except Koepang.

Singapore

Signapore fell on Jan 21st. I "suicided" one Indian Brigade of the 9th ID that was left behind during the evacuation. Cut off and trapped, that brigade was preventing me from rebuilding the rest of the 9th ID that was now in Colombo. So, with two AV it started to chase Japanese units around, spoiling for a fight and, after a few weeks, found on - resulting in the unit being destroyed.

India & Burma

The AI just took Rangoon. All Indian/British forces are, with the exception of a few stragglers, back in Calcutta where they are resting and refitting. The 1st Burma ID has been rebuilt, too. Once it gets its morale restored and units rebuilt it will be sent back to Imphal.

Otherwise, nothing really happening in this theatre.

When the AI eventually gets around to taking Akyab and Cox Bazaar I will, as mentioned in the first post, let the AI take it without resistance and make no attempt to interfere with its attempts to keep the area supplied.

I suspect the result of allowing the AI to move in forces to Akyab at will be a decent and probably rather bloody battle at Chittagong. As such, I'm planning on eventually moving in lots of forces to Chittagong. But for now, most forces are in either Calcutta or Colombo.

Australia

6th Australia is about to arrive at Perth. 7th is arriving in Aden now.

No battles here at all yet. Australia is well stocked with supplies and fuel - helped by all the fuel swiped from Soerbaja by the retreating units and the fact that no major naval forces are operating in the Coral Sea.

Pago Pago

Pago has become, at least for the moment, the default operating base for US naval operations. All needed support ships are here to allow for rearming and refueling of naval forces, torpedo planes and surface ships. With 250 quality AV and another 150 quality AV arriving in a month or so, Pago will end up near the stacking limit for the hex. The result is that it will be a hard nut to crack, even for an experienced human player.

The big problem is just bulding up the airfield and the port.

Suvaii will also be full built up.

Rest of South Pacific

Slowly putting up bases on islands I never once used before. Most islands in/around Suva and Pago have base forces slated for them. Just a matter of getting the shipping....and the PP's....to get them moving.

Potential AI Large Assault in the Central Pacific

There's a mass of ships congregating in-between Johnston and Midway Island right now and about 25 hexes due West of PH. Currently I see 9 TF's. This isn't a raid, either. It's an assault of some kind, since searches reveal numerous AP's and AK's and TK's. The weird thing, though, is that it isn't really moving. It is just sort of sitting there in the middle of the Central Pacific. Perhaps waiting for the CV's to join up for the party???

I have no idea where this assault - if it is an assault - is going to go. I've seen no intelligence showing units prepping for Johnson Island, Midway Island or anywhere in Hawaii. So where-ever it is going is a surprise to me.

Regardless, I'll let it "take" whatever it wants if it does make an assault. Then will take it back once I've got units prepped and the AI has left.

Canton & Baker Island

Both Canton and Baker Island are on the "Allied Side' of the Red Line. Thus, I'll defend them when possible - at least as long as it doesn't lead to an all out carrier war.

A small allied SCTF beat back a very weak AI amphib landing on Canton. A few turns later, an undetected AI assault landed on Baker Island. I sent in the SCTF I had at Canton and it destroyed the hanful of ships there, but the AI landed around 80 AV.

Since I had two CV's passing by on the way to Pago, I sent them over to bomb Baker - with a BB force also joining the fun. It will be a while before I have the units available to take Baker, but for all intents and purposes it is out of business for now.

AI also took Funafuti. the CV's sunk a few transports, but I won't battle the AI for Funafuti now. Jap forces on Funafuti are only a tiny annoyance, not a larger aggravation like when they have Baker or, worse, Canton Island.

North Pacific

Quiet as a church on Friday night.

(in reply to jimh009)

Post #: 31

Jim's Newbie Tip #1 - 1/24/2015 7:51:08 AM

jimh009

Posts: 368
Joined: 5/15/2005
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One advantage to rolling over for the AI is that it makes the first few months of the games go by rather quickly. I'll go over the various theatres in this and followup posts with maps. But first.....

Jim's Newbie Tip #1 : Keeping the Allied Fleet Replenished Far Out at Sea

Logistics for naval fleets, especially the growing Allied fleet that operates far away from major ports, often poses a challenge to newbie players. In particular, how can a player keep a CV or Surface Combat Task Force fueled, fully armed and - for CV's - keep the amount of sorties replenished when the Allied fleet is far away from a Large Port?

As always, there's multiple ways to do it. The painful way is to find a mid-sized port, have a gaggle of small Tanker TF's, and slowly drop off fuel at the base. Meanwhile, you can disband the CV's and SCTF's and refuel them ever-so-slowly.

The quick and non-painful way is to instead find a nice, secure anchorage. An anchorage is any dot hex or controlled base. Since you'll be doing the refueling and replenishing at a location that likely lacks strong land based air cover, be sure to pick a spot that is far away from land based air threats. And ideally is in a location where enemy CV's won't show themselves.

While this can be done at dot hexes, this method is best used at a controlled base that has a port of 1 or greater. For refueling, dot hexes work just as well as bases with ports. However, rearming is much slower at dot hexes when compared to a port. Moreover, dot hexes prevent the resupply of the AE's/AKE's needed to maintain high operational tempo. In other words, if you have a choice of doing this at a "dot hex" or a controlled base with a port, always choose the port - and the larger the port, the better. Still, all you really need is a level 1 port, although having a port with some naval support does help. If you have a level 2 port or greater with lots of Naval Support (30+), well....you're totally "golden". A level 2 port with good naval support will allow the player to keep everything but the largest of fleets armed/fueled and ready to go nearly indefinitely.

Currently, I'm using Pago Pago as the refuel/replenishment/rearm base (port 3 with 9 naval support). In the unhappy event that Suva falls (thus putting Pago Pago under air threat), my backup refuel/replenishment/rearm base is Penhryn Island.

Now that you've found a base to do this, here's what you need to keep a moderate sized CV TF's and SCTF's fully armed and replenished and ready to rock and roll.

1. Multiple AKE's and/or AE's. You NEED more than one or two to maintain operational tempo. I'm currently using 5 AKE's and 1 AE at Pago Pago to keep my two CV TF's and two SCTF's (which contains two BB's) fully operational, fueled and armed.

Note...it is important to disband the AE's and AKE's. Do not keep them in a task force. Instead, disband them in port. Disbanding the AE's/AKE's makes it MUCH simpler to keep them resupplied.

Also, an AD is always helpful, although it isn't needed. Still, if you have a spare one, be sure to include it.

2. Six AO's, split into two separate replenishment TF's. These replenishment TF's stay at the anchorage spot and do NOT move back and forth between the base and Pearl Harbor/West Coast to get fuel. Instead, the AO's have the the "gas brought to them" by separate Tanker TF's (described next). Because of this, once the replenishment TF's have reached the anchorage you have chosen, you do not need to keep it heavily escorted - just a DD or two will suffice (in case you have to move it in a hurry for whatever reason).

3. Six TK's, split into two separate Tanker TF's which contain three TK's each. Later in the game, when the Allied fleet is huge, you'll need more tanker TF's and each Tanker TF will need to contain more tankers. But early in the game this is all you need.

The purpose of the Tanker TF's is to run fuel in-between the West Coast/Pearl Harbor and the replenishment TF's that are located at the anchorage.

To Refuel and Re-Arm Your CV's and SCTF's

1. Move your CV's and SCTF's back to your chosen base. Hit the replenish button in your CV and SCTF's screen. Simple.
2. By using replenish button, you draw fuel from the AO's sitting at the anchorage. You also draw supplies from the AE's/AKE's sitting disbanded in the port (or at anchor in a dot hex). The supplies rearm all guns for every ship AND also restock the sorties for the CV's, along with resupplying torpedoes for the torpedo bombers.
3. Yawn...nothing new here. But alas, there is....
4. The problem, of course, is that you just drew down - perhaps substantially - the amount of fuel and supplies in the AO's and AKE's. In particular, supplies will drop dramatically if you have BB's that have been kept busy in battle or doing bombardments. If you want to keep your CV's and SCTF's active in operations over a long period of time (not just a single operation), you need to be able to keep those AE's and AKE's and AO's continually resupplied.
5. So...next step is to hit the replenish button for the AO's. If the AO's have op points still available (and they should, that's one reason to use six AO's spread across two separate TF's) the AO's will transfer fuel from the TK's to the AO's. Every turn keep hitting the replenish button of your AO's to keep them topped up, drawing down the amount of fuel in the Tanker TF's. Once the Tanker TF's are empty or near-empty, send them back to port to get more fuel and "wash/repeat". Since you're using two tanker TF's, just as one is empty the other full one should be just about to arrive, too.
6. To keep the AE's and AKE's supplied, go into the port screen for the base and hit "Load Tenders" at base. Assuming the AE's and AKE's have operational points available, they will all load supplies. How fast they load is dependent on port size and naval support.

However, remember you used six AKE's/AE's. When CV's and SCTF's pull supply from AE's and AKE's, they pull supply in equal amounts from ALL AKE's and AE's that are disbanded in port. Generally, even moderate sized TF's involved in active operations won't drain a large pack of AE's/AKE's. Generally, you can fully reload the supplies on AKE's/AE's within a turn or, at worse, two turns.

Just remember, the AE's/AKE's are drawing their supply from the base itself. Thus, your base needs to have LOTS of supply. If the base runs out of supply, then you lose the ability to "reload" the AKE's/AE's that are disbanded in port.

Hmm....sorry this was so long!

< Message edited by jimh009 -- 1/24/2015 8:57:30 AM >

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Post #: 32

RE: Jim's Newbie Tip #1 - 1/24/2015 8:11:15 AM

paradigmblue

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From: Fairbanks, Alaska
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Great advice Jim, thank you!

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Post #: 33

March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/24/2015 8:13:40 AM

jimh009

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March 15th, 1942

Overall, things according to how I thought it would so far. AI has been deliberate in its movements. AI just finished grabbing all the bases in the Solomons and the area around Port Moresby. Intel shows LCU's moving down now to reinforce PM and Lunga and Tulagi.

Surprisingly, the AI hasn't tried to invade Noumea or Luganville yet. Not sure if it is "waiting" for a specific thing to happen in order to trigger an invasion - or if something has changed in its algo so that it is no longer making those deep, large, unsupported invasions. Regardless, if Noumea and Luganville are not occupied by Japan in the next few months, at some point in late summer or early fall I'll move in and set up shop.

China

The "Sitzkreig" continues. I've developed a nice looking line that, of course, is made of glass. Any competent human player could easily shatter it in many places. And should the "sitzkreig" end with the AI, I suspect the AI will likely shatter it too. The Burma Road is still open (for the next week anyways), but supply already sucks. Two weeks from now, it will be far worse when the Burma Road gets closed.

I've had to pull out forces from several cities due to lack of supply. One thing that continually confounds me about supply in China is why a unit will "starve" in a city but as soon as it move away from the city hex the unit finds supply. The only cities where Chinese units don't "die on the vine" are in those cities that generate the supply (Sian, Changsha, Ichang, etc...). But in cities like Loyang, Nanyang, Yenan and a long list of others....Chinese units just slowly starve to death.

Anyways, lack of supply made me pull two of the three ID's I had in Loyang. The division that remains in Loyang is only getting 15% of the supplies it needs, so I'll likely pull that out soon too. I rather have it pull out then get forced out, being hopelessly broken in the process.

I've also basically abandoned Yenan. Just keeping a tiny unit there (which is still starving despite its tiny size) to keep the AI busy in the event the AI decides to take the march down the road to the city. The units I pulled from Yenen are just one hex away, had been starving in the city, and are now fully supplied now that they sit out in the country. Sometimes this game confounds me.

Finally, there's Wenchow. The AI continues to get bloody in futile attacks to get it, although it is doing a good job bombing the place. Still, supply is running out here too. So I'm pulling out two of the three Infantry divisions I have there. This will allow the remaining one (and the strongest one) to keep fully supplied. It should, hopefully, also give the AI a better shot at taking Wenchow too. The units I'm pulling out of Wenchow will make the long march up to the area around Liuchow and vicinity - assuming they can make the march without being cornered by a Jap unit.

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 34

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/24/2015 8:25:17 AM

Yaab

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From: Poland
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Since Loyang is both on the frontline and at the end of your supply line, you can start stockpiling supplies and resources there starting from Dec 7. Thus, when AI Japs arrive there in March, your three divisions can defend Loyang using the gathered supplies, plus the LI there will continue to produce supplies from the gathered resources.

You can do this for any frontline base (Nanyang, Ichang etc) which don't generate enough supplies on their own and which you want to defend in force.

< Message edited by Yaab -- 1/24/2015 9:26:05 AM >

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Post #: 35

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/24/2015 8:26:05 AM

jimh009

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South Pacific

Other than taking the Ellice Islands with a weak force as well as Baker Island, the AI hasn't show itself here yet. Even Noumea/Luganville haven't been invaded.

to prepare for the AI becoming entrenched on Noumea/Luganville, I'm building up Suva as well as putting bases on many islands in the South Pacific. It's kind of fun, actually. I'm discovering islands I never heard about before, despite playing this game for years!

The map shows the location of current bases, and new bases will also be put up in Upolu, Niue and Wallis Island. Off map, Norfolk and Lord Howe Islands are also getting bases.

Pago Pago is the main naval base now. But if the AI doesn't grab Noumea or Luganville by late summer/early fall, I'll likely move everything over to Suva due to it being a bit closer to where the action will be.

I do have one operation in the works. I plan to kick the AI off Baker Island. Will use a tank unit and one regiment of the 1st Marine Division and one artillery unit. Invasion will happen in a few months time, though, as units just began prepping and the AI has forced a lot of units on to that little island (at a high cost of lost ships, however). In the meantime, CV's and BB's will be busy pounding Baker Island to prevent it from building up any meaningful fortifications or establishing a strong air presence.

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Post #: 36

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/24/2015 8:42:09 AM

jimh009

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Rest of the World in March 15th, 1942 & General Comments

AI has pretty much taken over everything in the DEI. Its pounding Batavia now, and moving on Soerbaja. I'll give the AI credit...it launched a new offensive in Java. With all the CV's and land based air and BB's running around, if the Allies had tried to reinforce Java it likely would have been destroyed at sea. And the AI has done a fine job of "softening" up the Dutch defenders on Java. While it lose the CVL Zuiho to a lucky torpedo hit, other than that air forces in Java were essentially wiped out while inflicting little damage in return. About the only big mistake I see the AI making is launching an amphib assault right into Batavia itself. The CD guns in Batavia - as well as the mine field - have taken a toll on the ships and men that have landed. Still, the forces in Batavia are being ground down. Figure they'll surrender in a week or two.

North Pacific

Still quiet as a church on a Friday night. I did move some units to Adak to get started on setting up a base.

Supply in Scenario 30

Despite the 30% reduction in supply capacities of all cargo ships in Scenario 30, I'm still not really struggling with supply for the allies. Cargo ships continue to build up in San Francisco, Aden, Cape Town and Sydney faster than I can find uses for them. Since I'm not struggling for supply, I've started to convert all eligible xAK's to xAP's. Ultimately, the reduction in supply capacities for the allied player only really hinders the creation of "mountains of supply." I know in past games I've had 500K at Noumea at times, and sometimes more! I can't see that happening this game. In short, under the old system, vast amounts of supply was just wasted. In this game, supply is more rationally allocated and used.

I think the reduction probably hits Japan harder than the Allies, simply because Japan has "so much" real estate to cover and so much to move. Moreover, the passive way I'm playing right now hasn't really drained supply either. Perhaps if there were many active operations going on in Australia, things might be different. But Oz is dead quiet now, too....just being reinforced and being used as a giant air-training base for bombers and fighters.

Stacking Limits

While the reduction in cargo capacities hasn't changed much in terms of game flow for the Allied player, the new stacking limits in Scenario 30 certainly have. In past games, I tended to "centralize" units in just a few spots. The result was vast amounts of LCU's piling up in PH and Noumea.

The stacking limits prevent that. PH is now being used as a "transit base." Units arrive from the West Coast via strategic transport. From PH, they are either then sent to NZ/Oz via strat transport or to smaller bases via amphib assault. The lower stacking limits really does force the Allied player for spread their LCU's around, sort of like how the Japanese player usually has to. I like this change personally, but it does take some getting used to!

And of course with all these additional bases, all the air power that I used to concentrate in just major areas is also now being spread all around.

Fortunately, this scenario has lots of new units. And the biggest change to units I've seen in the game are the base forces. The Allied player has much more aviation support in this game (at least to this point of the game) then it has under stock. This has allowed me to actually start developing multiple air bases scattered across all of Australia, instead of being forced to wait until late summer like I had to do in stock.

Overall, I really like Scenario 30. Having played this scenario, I definitely won't be going back to "stock" again.

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Post #: 37

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/24/2015 9:02:13 AM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

Since Loyang is both on the frontline and at the end of your supply line, you can start stockpiling supplies and resources there starting from Dec 7. Thus, when AI Japs arrive there in March, your three divisions can defend Loyang using the gathered supplies, plus the LI there will continue to produce supplies from the gathered resources.

You can do this for any frontline base (Nanyang, Ichang etc) which don't generate enough supplies on their own and which you want to defend in force.

Yeah, I do that, although perhaps not as extensively as I should.

But what confounds me is the difference between "city" and "country" in terms of supply in China.

Take Yenan. I have a tiny, 50Av unit there now. That's it. Both the base and the unit have 0 supply. Meanwhile, I have 200 AV two hexes further away, not on any road, and sitting on top of a mountain peak, and it is fully supplied.

I just don't get it!

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Post #: 38

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/24/2015 9:28:38 AM

Yaab

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Yenan has no industry at all. It gets its supplies from Sian/Loyang/Chengchow provided anything get exported from these cities. If you put too many troops in them, little supply is exported. Even if they export, there are several units in non-base hexes around those cities that need supply. Yenan is somewhat isolated so it gets crumbs of what is left.

You could override the automatic supply distribution by upping the supply requirement in Yenan. Maybe you can collect 2000-3000 supplies this way, then switch to normal supply requirement in Yenan, and then set supply to stockpile at Yenan.

< Message edited by Yaab -- 1/24/2015 10:31:37 AM >

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Post #: 39

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/26/2015 7:25:02 AM

Yaab

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BTW, there is another house rule I forgot to add. When I play against the Japanese AI, I never change leaders for Allied submarines on December 7. Historically, the leaders' evaluation was conducted after they had completed their first patrol. I know there are very bad sub commanders at start, but I let them finish their first patrol anyway. It helps the AI in its initial operations during the amphibious bonus phase, because it suffers fewer ships sunk by the Allied subs.

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Post #: 40

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/26/2015 1:38:18 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

BTW, there is another house rule I forgot to add. When I play against the Japanese AI, I never change leaders for Allied submarines on December 7. Historically, the leaders' evaluation was conducted after they had completed their first patrol. I know there are very bad sub commanders at start, but I let them finish their first patrol anyway. It helps the AI in its initial operations during the amphibious bonus phase, because it suffers fewer ships sunk by the Allied subs.

Yeah, I never change leaders during the firs turn. Truthfully, I don't start changing leaders of anything until January. Allied PP's are just too few, and the ones I have I use on land LCU's primarily. And even in early to mid 1942, about the only leaders that get changed are those of carriers and the Pacific Ocean HQ. I prefer to use the PP's to get LCU's out of the West Coast/Australia HQ's instead.

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Post #: 41

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/26/2015 1:40:34 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

Yenan has no industry at all. It gets its supplies from Sian/Loyang/Chengchow provided anything get exported from these cities. If you put too many troops in them, little supply is exported. Even if they export, there are several units in non-base hexes around those cities that need supply. Yenan is somewhat isolated so it gets crumbs of what is left.

You could override the automatic supply distribution by upping the supply requirement in Yenan. Maybe you can collect 2000-3000 supplies this way, then switch to normal supply requirement in Yenan, and then set supply to stockpile at Yenan.

The problem is that there's no "extra supply" to grab in China. Even Chungking is barely "in the white", and often bumps around in the orange in terms of supply level.

There is something odd about China supply in this game. I've had to pull out of a few more Chinese cities due to lack of supply - cities that are surrounded by other Chinese units in supply! And the minute I pull those units out off the cities, these units immediately go into supply.

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Post #: 42

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/26/2015 1:53:16 PM

Mike McCreery

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jimh009

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

Yenan has no industry at all. It gets its supplies from Sian/Loyang/Chengchow provided anything get exported from these cities. If you put too many troops in them, little supply is exported. Even if they export, there are several units in non-base hexes around those cities that need supply. Yenan is somewhat isolated so it gets crumbs of what is left.

You could override the automatic supply distribution by upping the supply requirement in Yenan. Maybe you can collect 2000-3000 supplies this way, then switch to normal supply requirement in Yenan, and then set supply to stockpile at Yenan.

The problem is that there's no "extra supply" to grab in China. Even Chungking is barely "in the white", and often bumps around in the orange in terms of supply level.

There is something odd about China supply in this game. I've had to pull out of a few more Chinese cities due to lack of supply - cities that are surrounded by other Chinese units in supply! And the minute I pull those units out off the cities, these units immediately go into supply.

There is nothing odd about china but low supply levels. Each unit has it's own supply level. Units are being supplied but not enough to top them off plus start to fill up the base. Remove the units and the base starts to fill but not enough to top off the units.

Also, there are a lot of damaged units in China trying to recover disablement which will suck supply as well.

China is the area in the game where this is chronic and manifests itself. Dump 2 million supply into china and everything would sort itself out rather quickly.

_____________________________

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Post #: 43

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/26/2015 2:29:00 PM

obvert

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Apparently turning disabled squads into good active squads doesn't use supply, but needs supply in order to happen. So if the unit is low on supply it won't recover, but if it has full supply it will and no supply is lost. I've not tested this conclusively, but others have assured me that this is the case.

Also, building forts in the field has been said not to take supply. I find this hard to understand, since it does take supply in a base, and when I leave my units in China in combat mode, trying to build it seems to me they run out faster than when I leave them in rest mode. These again are not things I've tested but I'm feeling like I really need to do that since they've been bothering me for a while.

According to Alfred's Supply thread IIRC a division (generic average division, which of course doesn't really exist but is a guide) uses 1500 supply a month to do nothing but exist. So quite a bit.

Units outside cities will indeed pull supply from everywhere, but in bases they all only use internal supply from the base. So if it's below the requirement, the unit will not take supply. Be careful in the rough off roads because supply is also 'lost' in transit more extremely in off road areas. So a unit camped in the rough forest will draw supply to it an dome will be lost in that process in addition to the supply that makes it there.

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Post #: 44

RE: March 15th, 1942 & China - 1/26/2015 3:00:49 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Apparently turning disabled squads into good active squads doesn't use supply, but needs supply in order to happen. So if the unit is low on supply it won't recover, but if it has full supply it will and no supply is lost. I've not tested this conclusively, but others have assured me that this is the case.

Also, building forts in the field has been said not to take supply. I find this hard to understand, since it does take supply in a base, and when I leave my units in China in combat mode, trying to build it seems to me they run out faster than when I leave them in rest mode. These again are not things I've tested but I'm feeling like I really need to do that since they've been bothering me for a while.

According to Alfred's Supply thread IIRC a division (generic average division, which of course doesn't really exist but is a guide) uses 1500 supply a month to do nothing but exist. So quite a bit.

Units outside cities will indeed pull supply from everywhere, but in bases they all only use internal supply from the base. So if it's below the requirement, the unit will not take supply. Be careful in the rough off roads because supply is also 'lost' in transit more extremely in off road areas. So a unit camped in the rough forest will draw supply to it an dome will be lost in that process in addition to the supply that makes it there.

Units inside cities only pull supply from the base? That's interesting...I didn't know that. Learn something new everyday. That also explains then why units in many Chinese cities starve while the ones outside the cities remain in supply and are able to build forts.

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Post #: 45

May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/26/2015 8:02:05 PM

jimh009

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Update for May 26th, 1942

AI has wrapped up all its early objectives, it seems. With all its shipping available, it has even gone after virtually all allied "dot hexes" in the DEI and New Guinea.

South Pacific

The AI has stopped expanding here. It seems content with the Horn Island - Port Moresby - Russell Island - Lunga line, which actually makes strategic sense.

The AI has been busy building up Moresby and Lunga/Tulagi according to Intel. It probably won't be too much fun taking it, either. And right now, essentially can't be taken due to the KB still intact and running around.

The AI has not made any attempts to take Noumea or Luganville. So, figuring that the AI was unlikely to take Noumea at this point...I just landed the Aus 7th division on Noumea to begin base construction. Suva is likely to end up being the main base for the Allies, however, since it is further built up and has a larger stacking limit.

Stupid AI Raids

The AI is fixated on Canton Island. Large forces, with CV's, slowly head down to Canton, bomb the heck out of it, seem ready to invade it....then leave. It has done this 3 times now. In past games, this has always been disaster for the AI as I'd send the Allied CV's to gang up on it. But I'm letting it pass in this game. Maybe once I take Baker Island - the first counter-offensive planned - the AI will lose its fixation on taking Canton Island.

The AI also launched a CV raid against Brisbane and Sydney. In past games, this has always ended up in disaster for the AI. Typically, the AI would blow its planes and sorties battling the land based air, and be greatly weakened for the fight against the Allied CV's (who have 5 at this point). The result was usually multiple sunken CV's for Japan and essentially the "end" of the war for Japan. But, I ignored this raid too...which resulted in some non-important ships being sunk in harbor in Brisbane and a lot of air losses to the P-40's guarding the base.

Finally, in what has to be the most bizaare "raid" taken by the AI I've ever seen, in early May a large force slowly started making its way toward PH. Since I had tons of shipping going in and out, I couldn't ignore it. So moved the 5 Allied CV's into position for an intercept. The "raid", if you want to call it that, consisted of 15 LB's and 10 coastal mine sweepers! Being such small vessels, the CV's didn't even try to sink it but instead ran from it when the "raid" ended up being in the same hex as the CV's. I had to call out the BB's at PH to do the job. But what on earth was the AI thinking....sending LB's (not loaded with troops) and Coastal Mine Sweepers all the way to PH??? Crazy!

China

The sitzkreig continues. I bailed out of Loyang to preserve the force there that was starving. Two of the three ID's at Wenchow also successfully retreated back towards Changsha, leaving just one ID in Wenchow now. Yet, the AI still struggles against it - perhaps because it took such huge losses earlier. Eventually it will get it, but it is likely to be a while.

I've also bailed on three other cities in China, as they had 0 supply. The line China has formed is nice, but is, of course, made of glass and would shatter with a good Japanese punch to it. Whether or not the AI will make that punch I don't know and am kind of interested to see. Far as I know, Scenario 30 isn't a "Quiet China" scenario, so I'm assuming the AI has more objectives. But so far, it is been oddly passive.

India

I've let the buildup at Akyab proceed unmolested. No Japanese forces are moving beyond Akywb or slogging through the jungle toward Imphal. Just a building up of the air war. I have a suspicion that this theatre will be largely static for the next year.

The Stacking Limits

The stacking limits really do change the character of the game compared to stock. With its small stacking limits, the islands of the South Pacific can't really allow for building up of lots of forces. Noumea will be near the stacking limit with just one ID, engineers, port/air battallions, one art and one AA. The result is that allied offensives in the Coral Sea area are likely going to have to originate from Australia and New Zealand, much as it did during the real war. This will definitely put a strain on shipping compared to the stock game.

Later in the war, it is plainly obvious that offensives to take objectives like the PI will have "long sails" from New Guine, OZ and Pearl Harbor. Gone are the days of stacking everything at the Marianas and using it as the forward base for all offensive allied operations. Again, this slows the game down and makes it match history far more closely.

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Post #: 46

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/26/2015 8:03:47 PM

jimh009

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Map of China in May 26th, 1942. AI, for now, seems content with its line. I forgot about the garrison in Nanyang, and am moving a tiny Chinese force there for garrison requirements. The unit will, of course, "starve to death."

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 47

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/26/2015 8:09:23 PM

jimh009

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Finally, just another random thought.

For those who want to play the AI, I really do think "rolling over" for the AI early in the war and using Scenario 30 is the way to go. As my game stands now, it is a lot like how it was historically this time during the war. The trick is getting through the first six "boring months" of the war, where the Allied player pretty much does nothing but move stuff around and set up its logistics. But now that I have, things are beginning to get interesting and I'm seeing some strategic challenges that never existed in the stock game. Plus, with the AI having the full weight of the KB and having the whole Solomons/New Guinea area to work behind, I can see where re-taking that area is going to be a lot, lot harder than it has in past games.

Overall, I'm pretty pleased with how the AI has played this game so far. For the most part it has avoided the "big blunders". And where it has blundered, I've just let it pass (for now anyways). And now that is has fully set up all its bases, I have to admit, I'm curious to see what the AI is going to do now. Will it attempt to expand further? Or will it consolidate its various lines of defense? I'm beginning to think the latter from what I've seen so far, which is good in my opinion. A strong line, with a full KB, makes it far more difficult for the Allies to penetrate.

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Post #: 48

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/26/2015 10:04:37 PM

Mike McCreery

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The AI follows a script. Once the script runs out it starts to behave more and more erratically.

You can set traps for it which it will blunder in to or I guess you can somehow relax into fighting the KB on some sort of terms you feel is acceptable for the AI.

The problem is that the game will not react to you like a human player will.

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Post #: 49

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/27/2015 12:59:15 AM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

The AI follows a script. Once the script runs out it starts to behave more and more erratically.

You can set traps for it which it will blunder in to or I guess you can somehow relax into fighting the KB on some sort of terms you feel is acceptable for the AI.

The problem is that the game will not react to you like a human player will.

Yeah, I figure the AI will do lots of strange things no human would ever do. And for sure, setting traps will be easy - but it is something I'll do my best to avoid doing.

Anyways, rest of the game should prove interesting, at a minimum. The AI is certainly set up far, far better than it has ever been in my past games at this point of the war.

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Post #: 50

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/27/2015 4:51:45 AM

CaptBeefheart

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In hindsight, you probably should have let Canton go. The AI does seem to go after that island every time.

Regarding NoPac, in an Ironman game with stacking limits I managed a good foothold in Hokkaido by October '43. You can place about one division per island around Adak until you need to lift them to the Kuriles and Hokkaido. Build only ports on those islands to make it easier to pick them up when you have to (and put them back after the assault if necessary).

I've said it a few times (with hat tip to Bullwinkle on the idea), but a different challenge is to put the game on continuous AI vs. AI for several months before picking up as Allies. This will remove some of your forces from the pool and also allow you to quickly pass the time. Another bonus is that some of your restricted units will then be garrisoning Noumea and other locations, and you'll have all the PPs you need as the AI doesn't use them. Of course, once you take over, you'll need to round up your ship withdrawals posthaste and disband your red air units before bleeding too many PPs.

Anyway, great AAR and keep up the good work.

Cheers,
CC

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Post #: 51

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/27/2015 6:23:54 AM

karmannkc

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That inexplicable raid on PH sounds like an ill omen. My problems with the AI is that when I get to mid 1942 (after I have put up a stout defense in Malasia and the DEI) the AI seems to throw "Kamikaze" raids with valuable CV & SCTFs into heavily defended bases and what the AI should know are minefields, heavy CD emplacements, or large warship bases. They obviously get slaughtered and the war kinda ends.

Example: In my last game I got fed up when a TF with the Zuiho and a decent CA & DD screen literally sailed right into Pearl Harbor as if they were planning to defect. They were all quickly dispatched to the bottom of the pacific.

At the same time large Transport TFs would go undefended into contested waters, and those too would die just as quick.

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Post #: 52

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/28/2015 9:35:44 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Cody

In hindsight, you probably should have let Canton go. The AI does seem to go after that island every time.

Regarding NoPac, in an Ironman game with stacking limits I managed a good foothold in Hokkaido by October '43. You can place about one division per island around Adak until you need to lift them to the Kuriles and Hokkaido. Build only ports on those islands to make it easier to pick them up when you have to (and put them back after the assault if necessary).

I've said it a few times (with hat tip to Bullwinkle on the idea), but a different challenge is to put the game on continuous AI vs. AI for several months before picking up as Allies. This will remove some of your forces from the pool and also allow you to quickly pass the time. Another bonus is that some of your restricted units will then be garrisoning Noumea and other locations, and you'll have all the PPs you need as the AI doesn't use them. Of course, once you take over, you'll need to round up your ship withdrawals posthaste and disband your red air units before bleeding too many PPs.

Anyway, great AAR and keep up the good work.

Cheers,
CC

I'll be avoiding the NoPac route, if only to prevent giving the AI problems. In the game now (I'll post an update later), the AI took Attu but that's it. I'm built up at Adak with minimum forces. I suspect if I made a big drive through the NoPac area, the AI simply wouldn't know "what to do." So far, the AI is giving me a decent game. So no reason to break it!

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Post #: 53

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/28/2015 9:37:51 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: karmannkc

That inexplicable raid on PH sounds like an ill omen. My problems with the AI is that when I get to mid 1942 (after I have put up a stout defense in Malasia and the DEI) the AI seems to throw "Kamikaze" raids with valuable CV & SCTFs into heavily defended bases and what the AI should know are minefields, heavy CD emplacements, or large warship bases. They obviously get slaughtered and the war kinda ends.

Example: In my last game I got fed up when a TF with the Zuiho and a decent CA & DD screen literally sailed right into Pearl Harbor as if they were planning to defect. They were all quickly dispatched to the bottom of the pacific.

At the same time large Transport TFs would go undefended into contested waters, and those too would die just as quick.

I wonder if these raids have a certain "cut off" date in the code, which might sort of make sense. During the past month or so now (I'm well into July now), the AI hasn't made any raids other than at Midway Island. It has even stopped the Canton Island raid - at least for now (knock on wood).

I think the key to dealing with these raids is to basically ignore them if possible and hope that the passage of time will allow them to stop!

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Post #: 54

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/28/2015 9:42:45 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

The AI follows a script. Once the script runs out it starts to behave more and more erratically.

You can set traps for it which it will blunder in to or I guess you can somehow relax into fighting the KB on some sort of terms you feel is acceptable for the AI.

The problem is that the game will not react to you like a human player will.

Quite true. But I think one thing I'm doing to help the AI is by not doing anything "out of the box." A drive through the NoPac would likely break the AI hopelessly, as would a surprise drive up around Perth and into the DEI. Right now it is consolidating and strengthening its South Pacific bases, which makes perfect sense. I think as long as I limit my upcoming offensives to the SoPac and CenPac area, the AI might surprise me and provide a decent contest.

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Post #: 55

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/28/2015 10:07:24 PM

Mike McCreery

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jimh009

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wargmr

The AI follows a script. Once the script runs out it starts to behave more and more erratically.

You can set traps for it which it will blunder in to or I guess you can somehow relax into fighting the KB on some sort of terms you feel is acceptable for the AI.

The problem is that the game will not react to you like a human player will.

Quite true. But I think one thing I'm doing to help the AI is by not doing anything "out of the box." A drive through the NoPac would likely break the AI hopelessly, as would a surprise drive up around Perth and into the DEI. Right now it is consolidating and strengthening its South Pacific bases, which makes perfect sense. I think as long as I limit my upcoming offensives to the SoPac and CenPac area, the AI might surprise me and provide a decent contest.

We have been told before that these scripts have end dates.

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Post #: 56

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/29/2015 6:40:47 AM

CaptBeefheart

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jimh009

I'll be avoiding the NoPac route, if only to prevent giving the AI problems. In the game now (I'll post an update later), the AI took Attu but that's it. I'm built up at Adak with minimum forces. I suspect if I made a big drive through the NoPac area, the AI simply wouldn't know "what to do." So far, the AI is giving me a decent game. So no reason to break it!

Probably good on your part. The northern route was way too easy.

Cheers,
CC

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Post #: 57

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/29/2015 5:32:20 PM

chemkid

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.

< Message edited by chemkid -- 4/25/2018 11:04:01 AM >

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Post #: 58

RE: May 26th, 1942 Update - 1/29/2015 10:53:33 PM

jimh009

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quote:

ORIGINAL: chemkid

jim, just dropped in to say hi.
hope you'll finish this scenario 'till the bloody end.
thanks for giving that ai another chance. i'll be sticking around.
cheers!
robert

Thanks for reading the AAR. yeah, I do plan to play until the bloody end, unless my computer dies. I'm playing on my old Win 7 laptop, which is sort of on its last legs. I've been unable to get AE to work on my new Mac laptop that runs Parallels 10. :(

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Post #: 59

August 29th, 1942 Update - 1/29/2015 11:30:05 PM

jimh009

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August 29th, 1942

Strategic Overview

AI has completely stopped expanding, except for perhaps a few nibbles in China that might be a prelude to some more offensives there. For now, the AI seems totally content to build up its line, fortifications and resources.

Japan still has all of its CV's, CVE's, BB's and CVL's (minus the Zuiho). While Allied subs have taken a toll on Japanese shipping (and some dumb AI moves, such as invading Batavia directly and having the shore guns sink a lot of ships), compared to past games, the AI is pretty flush with shipping at this point in the game.

The AI is in the process right now of doing its one "west coast" raid. Two CV's sunk a tiny transport convoy, giving me heads up to move everything back to port. For the next week or so, little will be shipped anywhere on the West Coast until the KB gets bored and moves North to Alaska - where it will find nothing to bomb either.

The raids by the AI are a bit like diarrhea - an annoyance that will, in time, soon pass. By happen stance, all Allied CV's are in PH and could give chase. But I'll let the AI do its thing in peace, although this might be the last "big raid" by the AI that I let it get away with.

It's been a busy two months, so a lot to go over.

First Allied Offensive - Baker Island

Allies took Baker in mid-August. I gathered up the entire US Navy, which by now includes 10 BB's (including the Repulse and Prince of Wales), and took Baker with nary a fight. In past games, Baker has always caused nasty losses to the Marines who wade a shore - due mainly due to lazy planning on my part and the sometimes "spur of the moment" offensive I'll take to get it back. This time I planned better. I moved a pile of AKE's to Canton, and bombarded Baker for 5 days with 6 different bombardment TF's. Result was a "walk on". The 160 AV the Japanese had there was reduced to 1 in the final combat once the Marines invaded.

The KB didn't show itself during the fight to take Baker. Since Tarawa is still a level 2 airfield, there was also no air opposition.

New Caledonia Region

In early June I gave up "waiting" for the AI to take Luganville and Noumea, so I landed forces and started building bases. Bases now include Noumea, La Fae, Kourmac, Efate, Luganville and Tanna. Luganville is still just an AF2, so it has a ways to go to be built up. Until the AF gets larger, I won't be able to base any bombers there for the future operations I have in the South Pacific (see map).

Future Operations

Since the Navy right now is a bit of a mess with a lot of ships due upgrades, I pulled the entire fleet that participated in Baker Island back to PH. It will remain there for a few weeks, take some much needed shore leave, then likely be gone from PH for a long, long time - since operations will be shifting down to the South Pacific.

Funafuti

The first operation, to be done in late September or early October, is taking Funafuti. Japan hasn't built any of the Ellice Islands up, but I don't like the "dead space" in search over this region of the Pacific. This will be a small operation, with all units now nearly 100% prepped. Assault stages out of Auckland.

The Isolation of Guadalcanal

The big operation for the rest of 1942 is the isolation of Guadalcanal. In the old stock game, taking Guadalcanal was pretty simple...just gather up more LCU's then the AI had there, do a couple days worth of bombardments and voila, the base was in Allied hands.

It won't be nearly as simple this game. Left unmolested, the AI has built up Guadalacanal into a mini-fortress. It's fully manned with at least one ID (perhaps two), tanks and one infantry regiment. All likely sitting behind 4+ forts.

Lunga has a stacking limit of just 40,000. Since the AI is right up against the stacking limit, it is pretty much impossible for the Allies to just "overwhelm" Lunga in a few turns. While you can go over stacking limits by 10% or so without too many problems, going over by 20% or more is a recipe for fast disappearing supply and disruption among the units.

Moreover, the KB is still running around and the AI has filled the skies with Betties in the Solomons. Because of this, it just isn't safe to keep the Allied fleet there all by its lonesome for any length of time.

Because of this, to take Lunga it will be necessary to first establish a network of Allied bases that will, eventually, surround Lunga. The goal of the bases is to provide the necessary land based air cover that the Allied fleet can retreat beneath and, of course, to provide bases that will cut off supply to Lunga.

This task would be a bit simpler if the Allies still had Port Moresby and Milne Bay - since the Allies wouldn't have to deal with Betties coming from multiple bases and multiple directions like they do now. But alas, with the AI having it, it becomes necessary to build up a solid base network.

The allied bases will, as you can probably surmise, be covered with fighters and any torpedo/dive bombers I can scrape up. The big bombers will be based at Luganville.

There's another big reason for the development of all these bases, too. To provide early warning of an approaching KB as well as to keep the KB busy with air battles. If the Allies simply leaped up and tried to take Lunga as it is now, the Allies would be "flying blind" to the location of any Japanese naval forces. The Japanese land based air alone will keep the Allies very busy - despite having 6 CV's. To throw the KB into the mix would, ultimately, lead to disaster.

Thus, a more deliberate approach to Lunga is needed. And that means the development of multiple bases in the area.

The goal is that once the Allies have taken Tulagi and the surrounding bases have been developed, the Allies will have a solid defense screen of land based air, giving the Allied fleet a relatively safe umbrella to operate under. Once that umbrella is established, the Allied Fleet will then essentially be operating out of Tulagi for a few weeks. The BB's - of which the Allies have many now with more on the way - will then do a round the clock bombardment of Lunga over several weeks that will quickly degrade the base, LCU's and supply level. This degradation should allow 2+ full divisions, plus armor, artillery and needed support, to land on Lunga and have a reasonable chance of taking it fairly quickly and without suffering horribly high losses in the process.

While too early to fully know, I imagine I'll be basing one of those new port units (that have 100 Naval Support) at Tulagi during this time, to help keep the AKE's fully loaded. And there will be at least 10-15 AKE's disbanded in Tulagi's port, potentially more. Meanwhile, as the BB's and other ships bombard Lunga, Allied CV's and land based fighters will function mainly to keep the KB and Japanese SCTF's in check and away from Lunga.

But should the KB show itself - and I think it is likely to do so - the land based air will prove a huge factor. Besides providing protection for the Allied fleet, land units will be able to launch their own strikes against the KB. Thus, if the KB shows itself, I think the combination of land based fighters/dive bombers from multiple bases and 6 Allied CV's can give Japan a very blood nose while suffering only light to, at worse, moderate losses.